Joint Defense Agreement: Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan, news & updates

[Yasser76]

Well, you have got it exactly backwards, and both your claims in this post can't stand scrutiny....


First, you are talking about rank and file, Devji about summit/leadership..... Sunnis were around 85% of Indian Muslims, so a Sunni-majority membership is a statistical inevitability that explains nothing........ What needs explaining is why that Sunni-majority body kept placing Ismaili Imams, Bohra industrialists, Shia Rajas and a Khoja barrister at its head and its treasury for 40 years straight, that's the entire lifespan of ML (pre-partition)...... and Devji's answer is that the sect-blind "general Islam" was the one formula under which those men could lead at all.... ML may have emerged from the Aligarh movement, but its leadership, the ones calling the shots from day 1, were from the minority sects....


Second, the actual Sunni religious establishment fought Jinnah's general Islam tooth and nail...... Madani's Deoband, the biggest Sunni clerical body in India, wrote whole treatises declaring the two nation theory un-Islamic and put up candidates against the League in the 45-46 elections..... Maududi, another Sunni stalwart, called a League made Pakistan a kafir government of Muslims and declared voting itself haram..... The Ahrar coined Kafir-e-Azam for Jinnah and after losing in 46 openly said "Madhe Sahaba" should be used as a weapon against the League, a direct sectarian attack on his Shia background.....


So the custodians of Sunni orthodoxy didn't produce the League's sect blind Islam, they declared war on it, and attacked its leader sectarianly, which proves Devji's point better than anything....


The "general Islam" of the ML was a lay identity built against the clerical establishment, led by an Ismaili Imam, financed by a Shia Raja, and consummated by a Khoja barrister, while the Sunni masses voted for it over their own muftis' fatwas..... That's not a Sunni clerical doctrine grandfathered in, that's the double minority thesis in action....

Again, why you so obsesses with sect, 99% of this post has nothing to do with the joint pact. It is just weird.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Again, why you so obsesses with sect, 99% of this post has nothing to do with the joint pact. It is just weird.

It's called an academic discussion, it branched off the pact naturally, nobody is obsessed with anything ........ if it is above your reading level just scroll past instead of announcing it.....

 

[KingQamaR]

You also need a clear cut leader e.g. america for NATO or soviet union for Warsaw pact. Not having clear cut leader can cause some issues with direction and goals down the line.

Alliances are a maturing entity. The 3 will sort this all out.

 

[Yasser76]

It's called an academic discussion, it branched off the pact naturally, nobody is obsessed with anything ........ if it is above your reading level just scroll past instead of announcing it.....

It is sectarianism, and needing to insult reveals everything about both our reading levels..

 

[Watandar]

You also need a clear cut leader e.g. america for NATO or soviet union for Warsaw pact. Not having clear cut leader can cause some issues with direction and goals down the line.

The leaders of this pact are the Saudis, who organized it and are putting up the money.

 

[chinasun]

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The Mecca Joint Defense Pact signed by Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and Turkey establishes collective defense, completely ending India's attempts to isolate Pakistan. The complementary strengths of Saudi capital, Turkish military technology, and Pakistan's nuclear deterrence have instead marginalized India within the regional security framework, transforming it from a "strategic pressurer" into the "isolated party."

 

[retaxis]

The leaders of this pact are the Saudis, who organized it and are putting up the money.

China sees Saudi as leader of islamic world for some reason maybe its because they rule over the holy lands and are oil rich. But a leader needs to be a capable fighter and not scared of fighting battles and in this case, Pakistan and Turkey are far more capable.

 

[Pakistani Dragon]

They said Turks will end up like Palestinians if we remove the Greeks from Cyprus and take half of it..
They said we would all be bombed to pieces by the Christian world if we touched Armenia.
In the end, nothing happens, and we keep prospering.

Unlike others, we do not fear Christians and white world. We don't care. We will continue to do whats in our best interest.

Sharing tech with Pakistan is fine if in return they share Nukes(just hypothetical). But what do we gain from Saudi Arabians?
Ask anyone in a room most would rather have tech than money. So, what exactly they bring? Money alone isn't enough when Turkiye is doing relatively fine in that aspect too.
And I'd rather have nukes over money also.

With all due respect, brother, Türkiye's external debt is over half a trillion dollars ($518 billion as of March 2026), and one Turkish Lira represents one million Old Turkish Liras of 2005.

I remember back in 2018, during his first tenure, how a mere handwave by Donald Trump caused a financial crisis in Türkiye as he demanded the release of a U.S. pastor.

Türkiye then had to blow up the Jamal Khashoggi matter to astronomical levels as a diversion, before releasing the U.S. pastor.

10/08/2018: Turkey Shaken by Financial Fears, Trump Rattles It Further: Courthouse News Service

20/08/2018: Turkey’s currency collapse shows just how vulnerable its economy is to a crisis: The Conversation

23/09/2018: Trump tariffs, sanctions offer Erdogan excuse for Turkey's economic woes: NBC News

 

[Pakistani Dragon]

Muslims, of all people, should stop calling it “Mecca”. It is Makkah.

“Mecca” is a Westernised spelling, and it is also used as a name for gambling casinos. Use Makkah.

 

[M. Sarmad]

It is sectarianism, and needing to insult reveals everything about both our reading levels..

No, it's not...... Jinnah being a Shia, the ML top leadership being dominated by minority sects, and the Sunni orthodoxy opposing it with everything they had is not sectarianism, it's established historical fact with academic sources cited right there in the thread..... Naming sects while discussing the history of sects is called reading, not obsession...... If documented history is too hard for your fragile sectarian ego, that's your problem, not the thread's.....


And it connects to the pact directly...... The "general Islam" the ML built during the Pakistan struggle, a Muslim identity above and beyond sect, is exactly the template a Turkey Saudi Pakistan alliance would need to replicate if it ever wants to unite Muslims across the Sunni Shia divide instead of becoming another sectarian bloc......... So the discussion was always on topic, you just walked in at the wrong paragraph.....

 

[KingQamaR]

Israel occupies Sinai essentially. Egyptian forces are not permitted heavy equipment there, what would you call that?

Unfortunately Egyptian Brothers is partially controlled by the- Israel Peace Treaty signed on March26 , 1979 in Washington; DC, following the camp David Accords. For instance , Egypt is still obliged to defend Israel from attack overflying the airspace of Egypt…

 

[Yasser76]

No, it's not...... Jinnah being a Shia, the ML top leadership being dominated by minority sects, and the Sunni orthodoxy opposing it with everything they had is not sectarianism, it's established historical fact with academic sources cited right there in the thread..... Naming sects while discussing the history of sects is called reading, not obsession...... If documented history is too hard for your fragile sectarian ego, that's your problem, not the thread's.....


And it connects to the pact directly...... The "general Islam" the ML built during the Pakistan struggle, a Muslim identity above and beyond sect, is exactly the template a Turkey Saudi Pakistan alliance would need to replicate if it ever wants to unite Muslims across the Sunni Shia divide instead of becoming another sectarian bloc......... So the discussion was always on topic, you just walked in at the wrong paragraph.....

Lots of words, so little content

 

[KingQamaR]

Again, why you so obsesses with sect, 99% of this post has nothing to do with the joint pact. It is just weird.

We don’t want a Sunni Muslim Alliance it need to be open to all.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Lots of words, so little content

Again, if something is above your reading level, simply scroll past instead of announcing it and making yourself look an even bigger idiot than you already have..... No need to quote me again, have a nice day.....

 

[Oldenwisdom...قول بزرگ]

After Kuwait I know think Bahrain are keen....

Bahrain FM congratulates Dar on Makkah defence pact, expresses desire to visit Pakistan

DPM Dar reiterates Pakistan’s "firm commitment to promoting dialogue and diplomacy to achieve peace and stability in the region and beyond".

www.dawn.com

Trip wires are set when you want war... such as NATO in Baltics. There is nothing that statlets can offer aside from instability. Because they possess a lot of wealth that doesn't go horizontal... it only travels vertically. Allowing a few very well to do... that burn wealth. Build vertically, suppress decent, carry masses in neo slavery. All four, Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain and Emirates therefore punch greater than their sum.

Instead, post closure Persian Gulf their projection architecture needs to be clipped... they're not going on expeditionary wars and no one is coming for them. They can and should however be pooling money in the region which largely flies west owing to petro dollar recycling... an endless loop. Which makes them the greatest tool for power projection from across the globe... bases and safe spaces to push agendas in the periphery. It is this very reason, Emirates goes to make an alliance with zion and India... or the other three hold major US bases for the empire... acting as first line of defense for zion.