Pakistan-Saudi Arabia mutual defense pact: News & Discussion
- Thread starter Yasser76
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the vicious kind
Registered Member
What ever helps you sleep at night. ALL IS WELL !
The truth is the Pakistan - KSA ties are time tested and strategic in nature, unlike the purely transactional relationship India has with the gulf. What will Saudi Arabia do for Pakistan? We dont need saudi soldiers on our front line, we want a steady oil shipments , diplomatic leverage and financial support ( which we are already getting, despite our conflict with India, despite KSA investment in India).
Indians are so naive and guilable , My family owns a small farmhouse in Muridke. We can practically see the LEJ markaz from our zameen. I know first hand, where the money came to build that massive LEJ command center, let me tell you boy it wasnt built by Pakistan money. Keep up the copium my friend..
the vicious kind
Registered Member
Jalan kay liay i suggest use burnol
mythbuster
Trusted Member
Why don't you make it easy for us poor souls and blurt it out
the vicious kind
Registered Member
I agree, Qatar , Bahrain and UAE shouldnt exsist. The whole concept of Emiraat is outdated.
With KSA opening up the country for tourism and foreigners as a whole (outside of Hajj, Umrah and expats) and becoming a tourist hub/magnet (already one of the most visited countries on earth), thanks to the state finally realizing the potential of tourism (let alone soft power) and as a result due to heavy investments in the tourism sector (infrastructure, opening up for heritage sites, nature sites etc.), many new/old/hidden gems are reappearing on the world tourism map for locals and foreigners alike.
Farasan islands are very nice (largest island archipelago in KSA) but have in mind that there are some 1500 + islands in KSA alone (tropical, volcanic, mountainous, desert etc.) on both coastlines, although the Red Sea has the majority and by itself is one of the marine treasures of the world and home to the second largest coral reefs in the world after the Great Barrier Reef in Australia and one of the richest marine ecosystems in the world.
Some 5-10% of all marine life in the world is endemic to the Red Sea. It is an incredibly rich sea.
فرسان by Jazan Know, on Flickr
Tabuk area منطقة تبوك by tabuk تبوك, on Flickr
Agree with much brother, but I would not include Kuwait here. They (government/regime/monarchy) and parliament and people are staunchly anti-Israel and anti-Zionist and have never recognized Israel (ever) nor entered the nonsense Abraham Accords. Neither Qatar for that matter but the Al-Udeid base cannot be ignored here in what we were discussing. It is a oxymoron. And they are excused, after all, they are barely a "real country" to begin with with 350.000 locals (almost all of them originally from KSA/Najd mainly, including the Al-Thani ruling family). For starters the concept of Qatar as a separate Arabian entity is barely 200 years old and that too loosely and effectively only much later did it gain "full" autonomy.
Most Emiratis, Qataris, Kuwaitis and Bahrainis are well aware that we are one people and that their states, most likely, will eventually be absorbed by the main powers of Arabia (as throughout history) and long-term, their states, are not feasible.
The best thing that could occur, if the current monarchies remain intact (if not the whole political landscape will change for obvious reasons), would be for the GCC to turn into a real federation and get absorbed by the main power (KSA) and in return the smaller GCC states could remain as federal states of this new state, much like the UAE for instance is made up of various emirates that have a large degree of autonomy and their own laws (Sharjah emirate for instance is quite conservative and totally different from say Dubai) but de facto controlled/ruled by mainly Abu Dhabi.
I mean nobody can choose freely how big their country or population is but frankly speaking we are roughly talking about the exact same people. There is no point of a seperate "Qatari identity" or "Emirati" etc. For all I care, the "Saudi" identity can also disappear and be replaced by a new Arabian identity. I mean all those are nation states, the land (Arabia) and people (Arabs, Arabians) have existed since time immortal with recorded civilizations/ancient advanced cultures spanning 12.000 years (Al-Magar). Whatever we call ourselves we will remain Arabs/Arabians.
What I am trying to say here is that unity is the way forward in the Arab and Muslim world and that I am personally tired of us Arabs having 20 + nations and 20 + regimes instead of having 2-4 (at most) powerful nations that could truly speak with 1 tongue and in our own interests and those of the region and people.
Many of those regime policies and nations and their policies have nothing to do with Arab aspirations, opinions or sentiments. Most Bahrainis, Emiratis, Moroccans want nothing to do with Israel or the Abraham Accords for instance. Nor do we support any silly internal Arab-rivalries that are fueled by regimes in power. Look at for instance the retarded Moroccan/Algerian split/rivalry that could not be more artificial by heart. Other such examples that are not relevant to this thread but I am frankly sick and tired of it personally.
Brother Qatar, Bahrain and UAE are kept seperate emiraats by design. A larger much powerfull KSA would be seen as a threat by the West.
See the The Sykes–Picot Agreement, it was basically a secret deal made during World War I where Britain and France decided to carve up the Middle East between themselves once the Ottoman Empire collapsed. The problem was, they drew borders with little regard for the people actually living there, different ethnic and religious groups were lumped together or split apart.
Tank131
Registered Member
Honestly do i dont think we would ever see Saudi troops or aircraft in Pakistan in a fight against India or anyone else, agreement or not. But we will see (and have seen) Pakistani military throughout the middle east at the behest of their royals. Additionally i think iflt very objectively puts Saudis under the Pakistani nuclear umbrella without Saudi running a foul of the US by building their own nuclear weapons program.
However, that is not to say Pakistan wont get something from this. I think we will see heavy flow of direct funds into Pakistan's defense procurements and defense industry from KSA, aiding in large ticket purchases (FGFA, naval ships, and missile systems ect). You may start seeing a significant coordination of hardware purchasing to enhance interoperability between the services. Additionally if Pakistan becomes the de facto guardian of KSA it may need to be able to reliably extend its nuclear reach finally giving Pakistan the diplomatic cover and need to test longer range missiles up to 4000-5000 km.
However, that is not to say Pakistan wont get something from this. I think we will see heavy flow of direct funds into Pakistan's defense procurements and defense industry from KSA, aiding in large ticket purchases (FGFA, naval ships, and missile systems ect). You may start seeing a significant coordination of hardware purchasing to enhance interoperability between the services. Additionally if Pakistan becomes the de facto guardian of KSA it may need to be able to reliably extend its nuclear reach finally giving Pakistan the diplomatic cover and need to test longer range missiles up to 4000-5000 km.
Hakikat ve Hikmet
VIP Member
The more I think about this pact the more I get amazed to the level of ecstasy! The Pak Deep State has really pulled off a great feat. I need to appreciate the KSA leadership for properly studying the current geo-strategic dynamics. It's making the once-in-a-century shift. Almost all the fault-lines have become active to push out the dark energies being accumulated for a number of decades. Both Modi and Netenyahu, under the shadow of President Trump's MAGA mantra, offered a combo opportunity to make it like "Direct Action" and "Now or Never"......
Fortune favors the brave, and fortune isn't without its ONE and ONLY ONE MASTER.....
La Galibe Illallah....
Fortune favors the brave, and fortune isn't without its ONE and ONLY ONE MASTER.....
La Galibe Illallah....
Yasser76
Elite Member
- Thread starter
- #1,554
Yes, some good points. The lack of joint hardware is a problem, especially in the context of trained manpower, which Pakistan has an adbundance of compared to Saudi.
For example former PAF pilots or PAF pilots on deputation are not capable of flying any Saudi fighter types (although an F-16 pilots could probably do an OCU course for the F-15SA/S very easily).
This would help Saudi capability a lot as at the moment the pilot to plane ratio they have is very low, and many of their jets are twin seaters (Tornado/F-15S/SA). Just having a full two crews for each jet will enhance their combat power a lot.
Lands forces and air defence wise situation is worse, Pakistani forces operate almost completely a mix of Pak/Chinese hardware in both armoured and air defence formations.
Navals wise much of the European equipment in our Turkish/Dutch ships will be similar to their French ships.
As I said in an earlier post, will be interesting to see how this agreement works out in terms of future joint conventional weapons procurement. The agreement already states Saudi will invest in Pakistani defence production. This could well be drones and missiles I imagine, that Saudi forces will then use, possibly even PFX fighter.
In terms of future procurement from non treaty partners, I think either Saudi will fund Pakistani purchases of western equipment or Saudi may buy Chinese equipment with Pak manpower and expertise or possibly even a combination of both
maxpane
Elite Member
absolutely right.Fortis Fortuna adiuvat.
Yasser76
Elite Member
- Thread starter
- #1,556
Most global think tanks and analysts are studying this now and writing about it.
My feeling si we may not still realise the full extent of it for another few months or even years.
Pakistani constructed (Chinese designed) Subs to build a Saudi submarine force armed with Baburs? Pakistan Fatah and Raad missiles in RSAF? HQ-9 system in Western Saudi?
Pakistani purchase (Saudi funded) of F-15SAs?
Who knows, none of the above may happen or all of it can.
Very interesting times ahead. What I do know is, any Indian dreams of pushing Pak out of GCC and becoming nwt security provider of the region are now in ruins
Cash gk
Elite Member
Any weapon from America has no real significance; it’s practically junk because of end-user restrictions. Remember when Pakistan preferred grain over the remaining F-16s in the 1990s — that was highly significant. So please, fanboys, don’t jump to the conclusion that Pakistan will go and buy American weapons. Just realize how much junk they are; these weapons cannot even be used against Israel, nor can they truly defend their own users.
Yasser76
Elite Member
- Thread starter
- #1,558
Pakistan hints at more defence pacts post-Saudi deal; India implores Riyadh to mind 'sensitivities
www.trtworld.com
TRT World - Pakistan hints at more defence pacts post-Saudi deal; India implores Riyadh to mind 'sensitivities'
Islamabad's top diplomat, Ishaq Dar, says other nations are seeking defence agreements akin to Pakistan's with Saudi Arabia. Meanwhile, Pakistan's foe India hopes Riyadh prioritises mutual interests.
www.trtworld.com
maxpane
Elite Member
you are absolutely right.its just start. it will take time . still many other countries would also jointhey all were looking at KSA.Now for weapons we surely go for east and west. This pact has endorsemnt from USA and China . Trump wants some share so KSA can do do some shopping . On chinese side , its interesting to see zardari visited chengdu and had a briefing on j 10 jf 17 and most importantly J 20. Though its like a wild dream but to protect the middle east we need heavy weight fighter may be its possible now .
For Pakistan role as a guardian, world still in awwe how Pakistan is getting its role. This time israeli attacked pave the way and Pakistan showed some balls instead of staying in its border .
its still start of the pact we all have high hopes but we dnt know the future.
But one thing is clear when people said that Pakistan is fort and guardian of islamic world most did not believe that but know they realized that Pakistan has an important role to play.
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