Who Rules the Waves? U.S. and Chinese Fleets, by Tonnage

[Get Ya Wig Split]

Who Rules the Waves? U.S. and Chinese Fleets, by Tonnage

Overview​

With China’s third aircraft carrier in sea trails, and reports that the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) Navy already has more ships than the U.S., just how do these superpower rivals stack up, ton for ton?

Key Takeaways​

• The U.S. Navy has over 3.6 million (U.S.) tons of ships in its fleet, nearly twice the size of China’s combined fleets of just over 2 million tons.
• While China boasts the largest number of ships, 1,015 between both the PLA Navy and the Chinese Coast Guard, against the U.S. Navy’s 364, they are generally smaller and less advanced than their U.S. counterparts.
• The Chinese Coast Guard has received many of the PLA Navy’s older ships, however the vast majority of their ships are patrol and coastal combatants that average 711 tons apiece and aren’t able to sail far from China’s coast.
• Even as the U.S. Navy edges out the PLA Navy across almost every ship type, China does hold a 16:1 edge in tonnage of landing ships and craft, reflecting the Asian superpower’s stated policy goal of reunifying Taiwan with the mainland.

@F-22Raptor @LeGenD @Foinikas It's not even close lol

@Beijingwalker

 

[F-22Raptor]

The US builds higher tonnage ships, with more VLS cells and advanced capabilities.
The USN has over 10,000 cells between its surface ships and conventional subs. It’s like two and a half x the amount of Chinese cells.

The USN is also flying 5th Gen fighters from its carriers and amphibs, and is far more capable than Chinas capability.

An the PLAN is not even close to being in the same league as US nuclear submarine technology.

 

[Get Ya Wig Split]

The US builds higher tonnage ships, with more VLS cells and advanced capabilities.
The USN has over 10,000 cells between its surface ships and conventional subs. It’s like two and a half x the amount of Chinese cells.

The USN is also flying 5th Gen fighters from its carriers and amphibs, and is far more capable than Chinas capability.

An the PLAN is not even close to being in the same league as US nuclear submarine technology.

Add in the navies of Japan, Australia, and South Korea and the gap gets even bigger.

 

[Get Ya Wig Split]

Chinese figures are as always exaggerated. China has more ships but in most cases they are small vessels that btw have already become outdated...

First Look At The US Navy’s Orca XLUUV With Massive Payload Module​

Images have surfaced showing, for the first time, the U.S. Navy's Orca Extra Large Uncrewed Undersea Vehicle (XLUUV) fitted with a payload section.​

The picture (shared on LinkedIn by the former Commodore of UUVRON-1) is significant because, to Naval News’ knowledge, all Orca photos so far were showing the XLUUV without its payload insert. We can now see how huge Orca really is.

Boeing has delivered the first Orca XLUUV to the U.S. Navy in December 2023. The uncrewed submarine is now going through an extensive testing program. Five more are set to be delivered this year.

According to OSINT and submarines expert H I Sutton, a regular contributor to Naval News:

The advantages of the insertable payload module is that there can be various types tailored to different missions”

“The payload module has large hatches in the top, and possibly the bottom, which would be consistent with mine laying missions. Other configurations previously suggested include doors on the sides to launch and recover smaller underwater vehicles,” Sutton added.

Sutton estimates on his blog that Orca features a length of about 25.9 meters with the payload module in place (compared to 15.5 without the module).

About Orca XLUUV​

The Orca is an Extra Large Unmanned Underwater Vehicle (UUV) developed as part of the U.S. Navy’s UUV Family of Systems (FoS) to address a Joint Emergent Operational Need (JEON). The current vehicle measures about 85 feet (26 meters) in length, has a displacement of about 85 tons and uses a diesel electric propulsion system that gives it a 6,000 nautical miles range.

The UUV features a modular payload bay that is about 400 inches (10 meters) in length and has a capacity of 8 tons. This payload bay has defined interfaces that future and current payloads, such as the Hammerhead, will adhere to.



The US Navy’s Unmanned Undersea Vehicles Squadron One (UUVRON-1) is currently working on developing and documenting tactics, techniques, and procedures (TTPs) for the Orca XLUUV.

According to the US Navy’s budget documents, the service is updating facilities at the Naval Base Ventura County site for CONUS XLUUV testing, training, and work-ups.

The document also states that the Navy is working through the process of establishing and developing infrastructure that will support XLUUV OCONUS basing, fleet integration and in-theater forward operational capability, including support platforms, trailers, maintenance equipment, and ashore hardware.

Following the completion of Government testing in FY25, the US Navy might exercise three production options for more vehicles in FY26. The production options would coincide with the transition to an Acquisition Category (ACAT) Program.

First Look at the US Navy's Orca XLUUV with Massive Payload Module - Naval News

Images have surfaced showing, for the first time, the U.S. Navy's Orca Extra Large Uncrewed Undersea Vehicle (XLUUV) fitted with a payload module

www.navalnews.com

The US Navy needs to produce 1,000 of these smaller submarines that carry a few missiles capable of easily destroying any Chinese warship.

 

[Foinikas]

Who Rules the Waves? U.S. and Chinese Fleets, by Tonnage

View attachment 47750

Overview​

With China’s third aircraft carrier in sea trails, and reports that the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) Navy already has more ships than the U.S., just how do these superpower rivals stack up, ton for ton?

Key Takeaways​

• The U.S. Navy has over 3.6 million (U.S.) tons of ships in its fleet, nearly twice the size of China’s combined fleets of just over 2 million tons.
• While China boasts the largest number of ships, 1,015 between both the PLA Navy and the Chinese Coast Guard, against the U.S. Navy’s 364, they are generally smaller and less advanced than their U.S. counterparts.
• The Chinese Coast Guard has received many of the PLA Navy’s older ships, however the vast majority of their ships are patrol and coastal combatants that average 711 tons apiece and aren’t able to sail far from China’s coast.
• Even as the U.S. Navy edges out the PLA Navy across almost every ship type, China does hold a 16:1 edge in tonnage of landing ships and craft, reflecting the Asian superpower’s stated policy goal of reunifying Taiwan with the mainland.

@F-22Raptor @LeGenD @Foinikas It's not even close lol

@Beijingwalker

Nice infographic!

 

[F-22Raptor]

Add in the navies of Japan, Australia, and South Korea and the gap gets even bigger.

I’d like to see Congress get its act together and make a massive investment in our naval industrial base. We still make the best ships on the planet. We just need expanded ports, production facilities, and work force.

 

[MH.Yang]

Updated photos of the USS Eisenhower released by the U.S. Navy. The U.S. Navy has not released a photo containing the island of the USS Eisenhower.

 

[nahtanbob]

Who Rules the Waves? U.S. and Chinese Fleets, by Tonnage

View attachment 47750

Overview​

With China’s third aircraft carrier in sea trails, and reports that the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) Navy already has more ships than the U.S., just how do these superpower rivals stack up, ton for ton?

Key Takeaways​

• The U.S. Navy has over 3.6 million (U.S.) tons of ships in its fleet, nearly twice the size of China’s combined fleets of just over 2 million tons.
• While China boasts the largest number of ships, 1,015 between both the PLA Navy and the Chinese Coast Guard, against the U.S. Navy’s 364, they are generally smaller and less advanced than their U.S. counterparts.
• The Chinese Coast Guard has received many of the PLA Navy’s older ships, however the vast majority of their ships are patrol and coastal combatants that average 711 tons apiece and aren’t able to sail far from China’s coast.
• Even as the U.S. Navy edges out the PLA Navy across almost every ship type, China does hold a 16:1 edge in tonnage of landing ships and craft, reflecting the Asian superpower’s stated policy goal of reunifying Taiwan with the mainland.

@F-22Raptor @LeGenD @Foinikas It's not even close lol

@Beijingwalker

The days of naval strength by tonnage ended in WW 2. It boils down to who controls the skies over the oceans. Right now it is the US Naval Air wing

 

[Lulldapull]

The days of naval strength by tonnage ended in WW 2. It boils down to who controls the skies over the oceans. Right now it is the US Naval Air wing

We don’t believe that is a true statement even by a long shaatt no? In two minutes da irani’s can sink da fitth fleet no? Same same with da rhusshiandz or da chinese no in their theaters? Come on now…..

 

[Harbyharb]

It's not the current that worries analysts, it's the trend that does.

The USN rules the waves, for now. But warships are not permanent, they are not like real estate, but more like durable consumables like your own car. When you buy it it's shiny and new, and it will carry you places for a good while, but eventually, there will be a time when you will have to replace them. And if you are earning less money than you did back before, then you are gonna get a downgrade.

Same deal with warships. Usually, a warship has around 5 decades of lifespan from drydock to scrapyard, and this means if, over the course of 50 years, your shipbuilding capability and naval budget shrinks, in due time your past assets will become your current liability.

This is precisely the conundrum facing the USN going into the 2030s, where its own backbones are not ageing well both in condition and in technology, while replacements are hard to come by.

The earliest Nimitz and Ticonderogas are on countdowns and that's just a start. For the coming decades, every 3-5 years a carrier and a batch of surface combatants will retire with little hope of timely replacement, and the scale of the fleet will begin to dwindle exponentially as the rate of retirement burns through the rate of replacement.

The biggest enemy of the USN isn't the PLAN the VMF or any other navy in the world, but rather our past selves 50 years ago.

 

[nahtanbob]

We don’t believe that is a true statement even by a long shaatt no? In two minutes da irani’s can sink da fitth fleet no? Same same with da rhusshiandz or da chinese no in their theaters? Come on now…..

What have the Iranians really achieved ? Trade goes on as usual. Iran wants to be seen as doing something however ineffective it might actually be.

Talk is cheap. Look at Palestinians in Gaza, They are getting slaughtered in slow motion. Thousands of Hamas fighters or Iran cannot do squat to stop it. I am not justifying anything here. Pointing out the obvious

Warships are great. They are ineffective against naval air combat aircraft unless you have some of those protecting the skies on your side.

 

[Awwad]

The US builds higher tonnage ships, with more VLS cells and advanced capabilities.
The USN has over 10,000 cells between its surface ships and conventional subs. It’s like two and a half x the amount of Chinese cells.

There was a time when US was building Arleigh burke class destroyers and All china was producing was 2000 ton light frigates. Today China is producing Type-055s and Type-052D destroyers and guess what US is still producing same Arleigh burkes. Chinese have progressed immensely in last 2 decades while US is not able to catch up with the trend. Is only a matter of time that China will be ahead in tonnage-wise as well. Its the writing on the wall. You just have to see that almost entire Chinese fleet of destroyers is modern Built 2014 and onwards. Chinese do not have to phase out much. But the USN will have to retire a lot of vessels. So when you see how much US is adding versus retiring and then compare it with already beefed up Chinese construction of warships, then you get the real picture. That graph / infographic will be upside down by 2030.

Just note, I am not comparing the technology or capabilities. I am not going into it. I am just pointing out at the "tonnage" comparison that's whats this thread is all about. I am only stating that tonnage advantage to US is only temporary. Its just matter of time, the PLAN will have more tonnage overall.

 

[nahtanbob]

There was a time when US was building Arleigh burke class destroyers and All china was producing was 2000 ton light frigates. Today China is producing Type-055s and Type-052D destroyers and guess what US is still producing same Arleigh burkes. Chinese have progressed immensely in last 2 decades while US is not able to catch up with the trend. Is only a matter of time that China will be ahead in tonnage-wise as well. Its the writing on the wall. You just have to see that almost entire Chinese fleet of destroyers is modern Built 2014 and onwards. Chinese do not have to phase out much. But the USN will have to retire a lot of vessels. So when you see how much US is adding versus retiring and then compare it with already beefed up Chinese construction of warships, then you get the real picture. That graph / infographic will be upside down by 2030.

Just note, I am not comparing the technology or capabilities. I am not going into it. I am just pointing out at the "tonnage" comparison that's whats this thread is all about. I am only stating that tonnage advantage to US is only temporary. Its just matter of time, the PLAN will have more tonnage overall.

Just to add to your analysis. China is still lacking in crucial areas

• allies - All the tonnage is of little use if the Chinese navy is bottled up in its shores. China needs better allies and less enemies
• blue water capability - you have to operate far away from the coast to project power.
• naval aviation - Chinese are still in the infancy

 

[Awwad]

Look at Palestinians in Gaza, They are getting slaughtered in slow motion.

Even the weakest military of the world can slaughter civilians and babies. Especially if they are living in an open air prison of a tiny strip of 40 kms and densely packed. They lived a life under occupation, they had no control over the seas, air or borders. They had no airport authority or ports. Hamas is just indigenous militia using mostly home made rockets and home made copies of RPGs. Its amazing that they put up so much fight against a military which has billions of dollars of worth budget. As far as why Iran cannot stop israel from doing it is so obvious. Its only and only because of the US. The US brought its carrier fleet for only one purpose, to give a loud and clear message that US will protect Israel if any country (like Iran) intervenes or attack Israel. Iran don't want a war with US. Only Israel on its own is never an issue for Iran.

 

[Awwad]

Just to add to your analysis. China is still lacking in crucial areas

• allies - All the tonnage is of little use if the Chinese navy is bottled up in its shores. China needs better allies and less enemies
• blue water capability - you have to operate far away from the coast to project power.
• naval aviation - Chinese are still in the infancy

I already mentioned, I am specifically talking about "tonnage". The thread is all about "tonnage". So now people are boasting about tonnage when we have the advantage but its crazy to know that soon that advantage will erode and then we will talk about "other" stuff. Then we will say, oh tonnage don't matter lol. yep right!

BTW, China is ofcourse a blue water capable navy. with over like 100 destroyers and frigates and massive logistic ships, oil tankers, aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, they are easily the second most powerful navy and blue water capable. Do you really think they are making those 12,000 tonnage cruisers (type-055s) to operate near coast of China ? China's actions are saying LOUD and CLEAR about their objectives of power projection in far seas. All this build up is NOT just for Taiwan or coastal wars. They have global power ambitions and that's exactly that whole naval machine they are creating for.