Forsvaret
Trusted Member
Too bad, the world can’t remove guys like George W. Bush or Tony Blair or Benjamin Netanyahu by force for their untold number of crimes against humanity.
Venezuela - US Conflict: News, Updates
- Thread starter Bharatah
- Start date
The SC
INT'L MOD
An unbelievable prophecy as if it is happening today 
The late Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez:
"Years ago, someone said to me: 'They will end up accusing you of being a drug dealer - you personally - you, Chavez. Not only does the government support or allow it - no, no, no. They will try to apply the Noriega formula to you.'"
They are looking for a way to link Chavez directly to the drug trade. Then, anything goes against the "drug kingpin boss," right?
The late Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez:
"Years ago, someone said to me: 'They will end up accusing you of being a drug dealer - you personally - you, Chavez. Not only does the government support or allow it - no, no, no. They will try to apply the Noriega formula to you.'"
They are looking for a way to link Chavez directly to the drug trade. Then, anything goes against the "drug kingpin boss," right?
chinasun
Registered Member
Although Latin American countries gained independence around 1820 and imported Western electoral systems—without suffering direct devastation from world wars—their economies have still failed to achieve sustained, balanced growth for two centuries, repeatedly falling into the “middle-income trap.” This is not the result of a single cause, but of intertwined domestic and external factors, above all the following:
Pseudo-free-market dependency and harvest: Influenced by U.S.-led neoliberalism, the region rushed into market liberalization without domestic industrial foundations or strong national capital, effectively disarming itself. Local markets were quickly dominated by Western monopolies, core resources and industries were ceded to foreign capital, and development gains flowed outward. Countries that served Washington’s interests became clients; those that did not faced sanctions and coups, crippling autonomous development.
Absence of social revolution and a vicious circle of capital shortage: Unlike East-Asian late industrializers (Japan, Korea, Taiwan), most Latin American states never carried out thorough land reform. Land remained concentrated in the hands of a few oligarchs, rural inequality suppressed domestic demand, and electoral politics polarized: left-wing parties over-promised welfare to win votes, while right-wing parties defended oligarchic and foreign capital interests, pushing further liberalization harmful to industrialization. Policy reversals every electoral cycle made long-term industrial planning impossible, while chronic fiscal deficits were financed by dollar debt. When the global cycle turns—e.g., Fed rate hikes—crises erupt, aborting development once again.
Dollar hegemony as a financial harvester: After the collapse of Bretton Woods, the U.S. entrenched dollar dominance. LatAm’s trade, debt, and reserves are dollar-centric. Washington’s monetary cycle—QE inflow followed by abrupt tightening—acts as a global harvester. Hot dollars inflate local asset bubbles, then flee, leaving currency crashes, inflation, default, and bankruptcies; national wealth is transferred abroad and industrialization is derailed.
Beijing’s room for maneuver under existing rules: China cannot—and will not—carry out the “land–fiscal–currency” triple revolution for LatAm. Washington still controls SWIFT, rating agencies, and dollar liquidity. Any radical challenge to the current division of labor risks the standard U.S. response: sanctions, market raids, and color revolutions. What Beijing can offer is “embedded cooperation”: ports, power grids, 5G, bilateral local-currency settlement, and limited arms sales that reduce marginal dependence on the U.S., but it cannot pay the fixed cost of institutional overhaul. Unless LatAm societies are willing to reform themselves, any Chinese equipment or funds will ultimately be re-harvested by the old structure.
Forsvaret
Trusted Member
SolarWarden
Trusted Member
Well for the 250th birthday celebration of US there's going to be an octagon fighting ring at the Whithouse maybe Elon and Maduro can fight it out there and if Maduro wins he gets to go back to Venezuela as president. Now that's some crazy cht there.
Forsvaret
Trusted Member
That’s basically what the Chinese offered Pakistan with their CPEC 10 years ago. Fast forward to 2026, the country is now effectively back to US dependence already after that failed Chinese experiment.
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
Any way events in Venezuela could also be argued from a standpoint of the US itself being on a retreat. At least outside of its own Western Hemisphere which Venezuela after all is a part of.
By focusing its energy on consolidating its hegemony in the Western Hemisphere instead of fully focusing on containing China.
Maybe Trump/USA is also admitting that they cannot draw Russia back into the Western fold at the expense of China.
In a way we might be moving towards a situation where the US consolidates its primacy in its backyard and part of the world (Americas) while the US begrudgingly admits defeat in China's own backyard (East Asia) when it comes to Taiwan (not worth the risk going all-out against China on their home turf for the sake of small Taiwan), without any direct confrontation, for the sake of the stability of the global economic market and for the US not wanting to risk a military defeat in China's own backyard, that could potentially be crucial long-term.
In this development, Russia itself will be allowed to dominate its own immediate backyard (Ukraine, Belarus etc.) with NATO members being the dividing line.
Rest of the world will have to navigate in that reality and global division of spheres of interest.
Speaking about Maduro, I still think that he looks and acts like nothing else than what he is, some former friendly bus driver or the uncle that loves to joke all the time. Looks and acts harmless but maybe this is some facade.
But of course either all of us that mention this, not out of hatred by any accounts, are completely clueless or it is just some wider genius plan that us stupid mortals are not privy to or even come close to understanding.
This whole Belt and Road project, without a military component, is what it is as well. There was great talk about it in the Arab world and the results are similarly lacking. For better or worse.
By focusing its energy on consolidating its hegemony in the Western Hemisphere instead of fully focusing on containing China.
Maybe Trump/USA is also admitting that they cannot draw Russia back into the Western fold at the expense of China.
In a way we might be moving towards a situation where the US consolidates its primacy in its backyard and part of the world (Americas) while the US begrudgingly admits defeat in China's own backyard (East Asia) when it comes to Taiwan (not worth the risk going all-out against China on their home turf for the sake of small Taiwan), without any direct confrontation, for the sake of the stability of the global economic market and for the US not wanting to risk a military defeat in China's own backyard, that could potentially be crucial long-term.
In this development, Russia itself will be allowed to dominate its own immediate backyard (Ukraine, Belarus etc.) with NATO members being the dividing line.
Rest of the world will have to navigate in that reality and global division of spheres of interest.
Speaking about Maduro, I still think that he looks and acts like nothing else than what he is, some former friendly bus driver or the uncle that loves to joke all the time. Looks and acts harmless but maybe this is some facade.
Not an expert in this regard but if true that could be another in a relatively long list of grievances aimed at the passivity of the Chinese government. Many/some of which I have already mentioned earlier in this thread. As have other users.That’s basically what the Chinese offered Pakistan with their CPEC 10 years ago. Fast forward to 2026, the country is now effectively back to US dependence already after that failed Chinese experiment.
But of course either all of us that mention this, not out of hatred by any accounts, are completely clueless or it is just some wider genius plan that us stupid mortals are not privy to or even come close to understanding.
This whole Belt and Road project, without a military component, is what it is as well. There was great talk about it in the Arab world and the results are similarly lacking. For better or worse.
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Forsvaret
Trusted Member
MH.Yang
Trusted Member
Yes, it is amazing that Islam/Arab culture reached all the way to China. Actually it reached through land (Xinjiang/Turkistan/Old Tocharian lands)
battle of Talas
Battle of Talas - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
and through the millennia old ancient maritime trade routes that Arabs created that connected Africa, Arabia, Middle East/West Asia, North Africa, South Europe, South Asia, South East Asia (look up how Indonesia - the largest Muslim nation became Muslim - due to Arab - mainly Yemeni and Hejazi traders and settlers - many of the current Muslim ruling families from Mindanao in Philippines - Sultantes of Sulu, Brunei, numerous in Sumatra, Java, Indonesia - many Arabian in origin - well-confirmed - not hoaxes) and ultimately China as well (South, around Guangzhou).
Even Arabs mixed with local Hans creating the Hui ethnic group (Muslim Han Chinese with some Arab/Middle Eastern/Turkic admixture).
History of Islam in China - Wikipedia
China–Arab relations - Wikipedia
Arabs are the by far largest trade partners of China in the Muslim and developing world.
The trade volume was over 400 billion USD in 2024.
China-Arab Trade Volume Hits $407.4 Billion in 2024
Beijing, July 30 (QNA) - Trade volume between China and Arab countries rose by 2.3% year-on-year in 2024, reaching $407.4 billion, reinforcing China’s position as the Arab world’s top trading partner for consecutive years.qna.org.qa
China has created a special Arab policy paper and official policy aimed at the Arab world as the only geographical region of the world. China is also hosting the annual Sino-Arab conference.
Full text of China's Arab Policy Paper
The founding of the People's Republic of China and the independence of Arab countries created a new era for China-Arab friendly exchanges.ningxia.chinadaily.com.cn
China educates annually 10.000 + Arabists and Arabic speakers (many speaking very well given the difficulty of Arabic - something that Mandarin and Arabic has in common - two of the most difficult main languages of the world - widely known as such - a short visit on Youtube will confirm the 100's of videos arguing what language is more difficult to master and learn).
Personally I am not the least anti-Chinese (as in people or culture) but I don't like the Chinese passivity in terms of foreign policy.
I keep, in my mind, thinking what a unified Arab world (if 1 single country) with a population of 1.5 billion could do and when I see Chinese passivity towards allies or potential allies, it somewhat annoys me a bit, lol. Nothing personal but maybe more baffles me than annoys me.
If I understand correctly, you don't oppose the behavior of the United States, and you even want China to become the next America? Then what? China to rot for the same reasons, and you look for the next America?
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
Genuine question, did the Maduro regime ever invite China to establish a military base in Venezuela?
The US in comparison has China almost surrounded by US military bases.
The world is better off with polarity rather than singularity. Manifested in various poles of power across the globe, depending on the geography.
Every country has some rot but so far it seems that the US is content with their global hegemony. In fact it is this very reality that keeps it afloat and the dollar supremacy (for now) alive as well as the general US cultural pull.
Once this position retracts it risks becoming another UK, once the most powerful empire (not that long ago) but now largely irrelevant compared to its former heights and quickly declining.
The US in comparison has China almost surrounded by US military bases.
You are wrong. I think that a much more active China globally would serve the power balance of the world in a better fashion rather than just having 1 foremost hegemonic power like currently the case to a large extent, albeit not as dominant as from 1990-2010. China is closing the gap, at least economically, militarily and technologically to an extent.
The world is better off with polarity rather than singularity. Manifested in various poles of power across the globe, depending on the geography.
Every country has some rot but so far it seems that the US is content with their global hegemony. In fact it is this very reality that keeps it afloat and the dollar supremacy (for now) alive as well as the general US cultural pull.
Once this position retracts it risks becoming another UK, once the most powerful empire (not that long ago) but now largely irrelevant compared to its former heights and quickly declining.
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ety
Trusted Member
Unfortunately, China now is powerless to protect Venezuela and Maduro. China now simply doesn't have projection power esp military to far away regions such as South America and Middle East.
As for Vietnam, its relation with China has been complicated for more than two thousands years, more like love and hate, one one level, they like Chinese cultures and adopted many, on the other they are wary of Chinese and want to keep a distance from China partly because it had ruled Vietnam for a thousand years and then broke away. SK may also has similar mentality towards Chines because it has similar relationship with China for thousands of years besides current political conflict and recent Korean war. As for Japanese, they are acting hostile to China simply because they want to cover up their deep guilt in WW II and recent wars atrocities towards Chinese and Japanese don't want to see a resurgent China.
Cash gk
Elite Member
Venezuela's acting president has said the US seizure of Nicolas Maduro had "Zionist undertones
Speaking in a televised address on Saturday, Delcy Rodriguez said:
“Governments around the world are shocked that the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela has become the victim and target of an attack of this nature, which undoubtedly has Zionist undertones.”
She added:
“The extremists who have promoted armed aggression against our country — history and justice will make them pay.
US special forces seized Venezuela’s now-ousted President Nicolas Maduro from the capital, Caracas, early on Saturday, as American fighter jets bombed key military installations and bases across the country.
Rodriguez, who served as Maduro’s vice-president, has been decreed by the Supreme Court to lead the country on an interim basis.
It was not immediately clear what Rodriguez meant by her comments on Saturday, though Venezuela and Israel have long had strained relations.
In November, Maduro claimed that “Zionists” were attempting to deliver his country to “devils
“There are those who want to hand this country over to the devils — you know who, right? The far-right Zionists …”
youtube.com
Speaking in a televised address on Saturday, Delcy Rodriguez said:
“Governments around the world are shocked that the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela has become the victim and target of an attack of this nature, which undoubtedly has Zionist undertones.”
She added:
“The extremists who have promoted armed aggression against our country — history and justice will make them pay.
US special forces seized Venezuela’s now-ousted President Nicolas Maduro from the capital, Caracas, early on Saturday, as American fighter jets bombed key military installations and bases across the country.
Rodriguez, who served as Maduro’s vice-president, has been decreed by the Supreme Court to lead the country on an interim basis.
It was not immediately clear what Rodriguez meant by her comments on Saturday, though Venezuela and Israel have long had strained relations.
In November, Maduro claimed that “Zionists” were attempting to deliver his country to “devils
“There are those who want to hand this country over to the devils — you know who, right? The far-right Zionists …”
Post from Middle East Eye
Venezuela's acting president has said the US seizure of Nicolas Maduro had "Zionist undertones". Speaking in a televised address on Saturday, Delcy Rodriguez...
youtube.com
Hakwa Nadro
Trusted Member
Can someone persuade the OIC to place a huge bounty on Nutandyahoo's head, that would be fun.Analysis: Trump flexes a new level of unrestrained global power
From CNN's Nick Paton Walsh
US President Trump's post is seen on the Truth social media app on January 3.
Jaap Arriens/NurPhoto/Getty Images
Expressions of unbridled power don’t come blunter than abducting a sitting president from his capital in the dead of night.
President Donald Trump has shown in a 74-word social media post that he can act decisively, suddenly and perhaps recklessly, in pursuit of his varied and varying foreign policy goals, with little regard for precedent, consequence or, it seems, international law.
The operation to take Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro and his wife from their heavily guarded location in Caracas to – presumably – face the American court system, does follow a predictable albeit extreme pattern for what the US calls a fugitive, with a $50 million bounty on his head.
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
I never understood the dislike of the Japanese and Koreans towards China. It was the Japanese that were the aggressors and occupiers of Korea, China and much of East Asia. They killed millions of innocent civilians.
The same China has also impacted those countries culturally more than the other way around historically.
Those same people (Japanese, Vietnamese, Koreans - to an extent even the Mongols) have no closer kin (outside of themselves) than the Chinese either.
You are all mostly Atheists, share similar religions (albeit differences) with similar philosophies. You look alike as well in the great scheme of things. You live in the same neighborhood.
Do you think that it is due to Japanese, Koreans being distrustful of one-party regimes and communism? Or is that used as an excuse? Or is this all the work of the US installing pro-US regimes in South Korea, Japan etc. due to how history unfolded?
Or is the hostility much deeper and bound in historical events that far predate WW2 events?
For me as an outsider it is very difficult to understand how come a country and civilization like China, with 1.5 billion people (!!!) has not a much, much bigger influence on their own region and vicinity. And why that was neither the case prior to WW2 and the century of humiliation.
Once again I believe it is due to the state philosophy of China itself for most of its recorded history of being very inward looking and considering China as the center of the world. I never understood why the Chinese, Japanese etc. were not far more adventurous and expanding on a global scale (since millennia ago). In fact out of all East Asians the Mongols were the ones that were the by far most expanding but it was relatively short-lived and extremely bloody. Not a very good example of successful empire building in terms of civilizational, cultural, linguistic, religious etc. impact.
I think this hesitation can still be seen in today's Chinese foreign policy and national psyche which was my main point in the previous discussion.
I think this behavior is a bad thing not only for China but the world as a whole because by all accounts plurality (political, economic, military) is better than a singularity on a global scale.
Because absolute power and dominance corrupts and we have many such examples from recent US history to the detriment of itself and those countries it attacked because nobody could stop them from doing what they pleased.
Behavior like this thread is about (Maduro kidnapping) also erodes internal law and how little it was implemented. It basically makes the world a bigger jungle than it already is. It aids Zionist/Israeli behavior because they can always say that everyone is doing whatever they want to anyway without any consequences etc. It is a bad development for the rest of the world and a potentially very dangerous one too.
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