Al - Haider VT-4 MBT - The Premier PA Ground Asset [Developments]

[iron shrapnel]

The VT4 has decent mobility, the test in question wasn’t that hard tbf, it’s just that all the other tanks in question are underpowered and VT4 has the correct amount of power for it’s weight. Even detuned to 1200HP it can drive circles around the other MBTs in PA service.

HIT delivered its first tank gun barrels in April 2011, but the project to make it was launched even before the AK was unveiled in 2000, the quality has considerably improved since.

I agree that the VT4 was the “best” Option we had, but at the end it was honestly the only option we had left too. Even if PA picked the Oplot, Ukraine would never have been able to match the order and HIT doesn’t have the capability to produce powertrains locally.

If we weren't in such an economic crunch,
I still think Pakistan could have gotten out more from the Ukrainians especially considering their current situation... ToTs and licenses to produce the 6td series would have gotten a long way for both them and us... Securing your current fleet of AKs and developing for defense and civilian usage might have also been possible...

 

[hasssanali8998]

If we weren't in such an economic crunch,
I still think Pakistan could have gotten out more from the Ukrainians especially considering their current situation... ToTs and licenses to produce the 6td series would have gotten a long way for both them and us... Securing your current fleet of AKs and developing for defense and civilian usage might have also been possible...

Off topic but after the war in Ukraine ends we should definitely improve our relationship with Ukraine , even maybe send soldiers to train with them .

 

[Dreamer]

Off topic but after the war in Ukraine ends we should definitely improve our relationship with Ukraine , even maybe send soldiers to train with them .

'after the war' part is quite funny.

 

[hasssanali8998]

'after the war' part is quite funny.

why , you don't think its going to end

 

[Toxic]

why , you don't think its going to end

I think it's because existence of Ukraine is not exactly certain after the war, especially with the peace terms thrown around include de militarization.

 

[Foinikas]

The VT4 has decent mobility, the test in question wasn’t that hard tbf, it’s just that all the other tanks in question are underpowered and VT4 has the correct amount of power for it’s weight. Even detuned to 1200HP it can drive circles around the other MBTs in PA service.

HIT delivered its first tank gun barrels in April 2011, but the project to make it was launched even before the AK was unveiled in 2000, the quality has considerably improved since.

I agree that the VT4 was the “best” Option we had, but at the end it was honestly the only option we had left too. Even if PA picked the Oplot, Ukraine would never have been able to match the order and HIT doesn’t have the capability to produce powertrains locally.

In the late '90s or around there,the Hellenic Army had extensive trials for the future tank that Greece would buy.

Extensive trials,something we haven't seen since then. The contestants were:

M1A2 Abrams
Leopard 2A5
Challenger 2E
Leclerc
T-80U
T-84 Oplot

Some info I found online about it that you might find familiar with your trials

https://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/8286-greek-tank-trials/

The tanks compared included the M1A2 Abrams, Leopard 2A5, Leclerc, T-80UE and T-84.


Of these six vehicles, out of a maximum possible operational and technical score of 100%, best performing were: Leopard 2A5, 78.65%; M1A2 Abrams, 72.21%; Leclerc, 72.03%; and Challenger 2E, 69.19%. Next was the T-84 and last the T-80UE.


The Leopard 2A5 was the only one with a demonstrated deep fording capability, while the M1A2 had the best firing results during hunter/killer target engagements.


The German 1,500hp MTU EuroPowerPack was fitted in both the Leclerc and the Challenger 2E and these two vehicles had the best cruising range and lower fuel consumption.


The T-80U had the best mobility and reliability.


Some shooting results:


Leopard 2A5: ~80%


Leclerc: 65% targets hit


T-84: 47 % targets hit


Challenger-2: 40 % targets hit


No data for the T-80UE and M1A2. The Challenger-II did not use proper ammo, while the T-80UE and T-84 used practice rounds 3P31, which corresponds to BM15 at below 1.5 km but become unpredictable after 2 kms. The Abrams could not fire practice ammo and had to wait for 3 days before real ones were brought.


The T-80UE had an experimental T type transmission.


The T-84 was considered to be somewhat inmature and had few problems: smoke grenades failing to work.

 

[Dreamer]

why , you don't think its going to end

point is, the kind of situation Ukraine is in, if you wait for war to end you're already too late. This kind of situation countries remember who did what during the war. (Pakistan did take a reasonable stand but I was referring to your after the war point).
Also what do you think a post-war ukraine will look like? It will be 'occupied' by NATO if not by russia.

 

[Ak01]

In the late '90s or around there,the Hellenic Army had extensive trials for the future tank that Greece would buy.

Extensive trials,something we haven't seen since then. The contestants were:

M1A2 Abrams
Leopard 2A5
Challenger 2E
Leclerc
T-80U
T-84 Oplot

Some info I found online about it that you might find familiar with your trials

https://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/8286-greek-tank-trials/

The tanks compared included the M1A2 Abrams, Leopard 2A5, Leclerc, T-80UE and T-84.


Of these six vehicles, out of a maximum possible operational and technical score of 100%, best performing were: Leopard 2A5, 78.65%; M1A2 Abrams, 72.21%; Leclerc, 72.03%; and Challenger 2E, 69.19%. Next was the T-84 and last the T-80UE.


The Leopard 2A5 was the only one with a demonstrated deep fording capability, while the M1A2 had the best firing results during hunter/killer target engagements.


The German 1,500hp MTU EuroPowerPack was fitted in both the Leclerc and the Challenger 2E and these two vehicles had the best cruising range and lower fuel consumption.


The T-80U had the best mobility and reliability.


Some shooting results:


Leopard 2A5: ~80%


Leclerc: 65% targets hit


T-84: 47 % targets hit


Challenger-2: 40 % targets hit


No data for the T-80UE and M1A2. The Challenger-II did not use proper ammo, while the T-80UE and T-84 used practice rounds 3P31, which corresponds to BM15 at below 1.5 km but become unpredictable after 2 kms. The Abrams could not fire practice ammo and had to wait for 3 days before real ones were brought.


The T-80UE had an experimental T type transmission.


The T-84 was considered to be somewhat inmature and had few problems: smoke grenades failing to work.

and the abrams had GPS issues thanks to the french sending jammers to skew the results!

 

[Foinikas]

and the abrams had GPS issues thanks to the french sending jammers to skew the results!

 

[Psyko70]

and the abrams had GPS issues thanks to the french sending jammers to skew the results!

I always wonder how did west tanks actually perform in ukraine. So far what I know they performs like 10% better in some cases to russians. While russians in some.

 

[Foinikas]

I always wonder how did west tanks actually perform in ukraine. So far what I know they performs like 10% better in some cases to russians. While russians in some.

One big difference is that Ukrainians crews get the chance to get out of the tank and leave. Sometimes they just get immobilized by hitting a mine. Most of the time they crew can be ecavuated safely,while with the Russian ones...they often get blown up in a second. Turrets flying. The Western ones are also harder to destroy with FPVs.

 

[iron shrapnel]

I think it's because existence of Ukraine is not exactly certain after the war, especially with the peace terms thrown around include de militarization.

De militarization would be one of the best opportunities to swoop in to pick up some goodies

 

[Toxic]

De militarization would be one of the best opportunities to swoop in to pick up some goodies

I don't think so, demilitarization would also mean very tight monitoring of Ukraine's military industry including any export of technology, IMO the best case scenario for us would be one where Ukraine isn't demilitarizated and would need to rebuild so they would be more willing to give away military technology for a lower cost.

This is what babus should have done in the 90s but alas babus are retarded.

 

[iron shrapnel]

I always wonder how did west tanks actually perform in ukraine. So far what I know they performs like 10% better in some cases to russians. While russians in some.

Russian crew fatalities are horrific... Mainly due to carousel magazine
Role of IFVs have been more highlighted.. Bradley and CV series has out shown russian counterparts...

 

[Psyko70]

Russian crew fatalities are horrific... Mainly due to carousel magazine
Role of IFVs have been more highlighted.. Bradley and CV series has out shown russian counterparts...

Yes that was also read by me. You are right