Turkish Foreign Policy and Regional Geopolitics

[hyperman]

I'll ask you for the 4th time:

Where does it say in the article that Greece plans to expand to 12 nm in the Aegean? And if you can't find it,find a reliable source. You keep ignoring my question repeatedly.

Greece's 12-mile territorial waters: Ministers signal expansion ahead of Turkey talks

Greek ministers signal potential expansion of territorial waters to 12 miles ahead of crucial Turkey talks, raising stakes in Mediterranean diplomacy.

en.parapolitika.gr

this is greek

 

[Foinikas]

The Europeans will burn you if you instigate a war right now with Turkey.

Instigate a war with Turkey?

A couple of points

1. A vague statement by some politicians about Greece retaining the right to expand to 12 nm in the Aegean,isn't proof that Greece will actually do it.
2. I know this won't have any meaning to you,because you're Muslim and not Orthodox but some saints here have foretold of Turkish destruction by mainly the Russians,after Turkey provokes a war with Greece. And allegedly,that would happen with the expansion of the territorial waters to 12 miles. So,if this comes true you shouldn't be happy about it.

bet my bottom dollar that your opinion on the Greek side of the social media is probably totally different from what you portray here.

Oh yes,on Greek social media I'm accused of being Pro-Pal and they don't like me when I disagree with them every time they call Arabs "jihadi islamist apes" or whatever. I'm the guy who used to fight online with others in favor of Palestinians and saying that Israel has to get back to the pre-1967 borders.

Am I against Israeli expansion? Yes. Am I against their genocide of the Palestinians? Yes. Do I want them to get back to the pre-1967 borders and recognize a Palestinian State without Hamas? Yes. Is Netanyahu's government a problem for the region and for even the Jewish people themselves? Yes.

And is Erdogan's Turkey a problem for us? Yes. Do I want us to get weapons and ToT from Israel when the Americans and many Western Europeans aren't sharing? Yes,we need it to defend against such threats as you guys have been posting above.

 

[Foinikas]

You just don't want to admit it here because we're Turks.

No,I don't think they are being manipulated. But then again,I don't know what's going on behind closed doors. Is he a typical freemason centrist leader who doesn't truly want to uphold the Church and nation? Yes,he seems to be. But you see,this is a chance. Americans have been going back and forth with their promises. You've seen that,the Pakistanis have seen that. For you it was the F-35s,the Patriot,the engines. For the Pakistanis it was the embargo during wars with India.

Now the Israelis feel threatened,I say it's a chance for us to modernize our Armed Forces after some 15 years of being heavily neglected by our governments.

 

[Foinikas]

Greece's 12-mile territorial waters: Ministers signal expansion ahead of Turkey talks

Greek ministers signal potential expansion of territorial waters to 12 miles ahead of crucial Turkey talks, raising stakes in Mediterranean diplomacy.

en.parapolitika.gr

this is greek

Yes,Dendias went around and said something. What did he say? That it is our sovereign right to do so. And by international law,it is. If you look it up,it is. But that's all he said. There's no announcement,there's no schedule,no plan to do it anytime soon and especially on the eastern part of the Aegean.

Just like when I show you photos of Bahceli claiming he will take the Dodecanese and Western Thrace and you say "Oh that's just talk for internal consumption".

 

[hyperman]

Just like when I show you photos of Bahceli

Bahceli is not a foreign minister and defense minister. But you guys seem to be in the mood to create the conditions to make it into a reality by breaking the status quo.

Israel is trying to use you to fight Turkey.

 

[Eşbah]

1. I know this won't have any meaning to you,because you're Muslim and not Orthodox but some saints here have foretold of Turkish destruction by mainly the Russians,after Turkey provokes a war with Greece. And allegedly,that would happen with the expansion of the territorial waters to 12 miles. So,if this comes true you shouldn't be happy about it.

Your entire political and ideological framework of beliefs, assumptions, and values is based on some Orthodox prophecy of questionable origin?!

The Russians will fight against Turkey so a NATO and EU member state can control the entire Aegean Sea?

You do understand that this is not in Moscow’s interest?

 

[Eşbah]

No,I don't think they are being manipulated. But then again,I don't know what's going on behind closed doors. Is he a typical freemason centrist leader who doesn't truly want to uphold the Church and nation? Yes,he seems to be. But you see,this is a chance.

What chance?

The Eastern Europeans will isolate you in the EU and try to shred you into pieces for strengthening Russia.

The Americans won't deliver you the F35s in case there's a kinetic exchange between the two countries.

The French will hold back the delivery of spare parts for your fighters and ships to push you into a ceasefire agreement while publicly supporting you.

The Turks probably regain control of a bunch of small islands located next to our shores. These are practically indefensible for the Greeks.

Where does Greece win anything in this scenario? Where's your victory in this vision?

I only see Turkish gains and a temporary, limited advantage for Zios.

 

[Foinikas]

Bahceli is not a foreign minister and defense minister. But you guys seem to be in the mood to create the conditions to make it into a reality by breaking the status quo.

Israel is trying to use you to fight Turkey.

You're always using this excuse: Somebody is using Greece to attack Turkey.

That's like ignoring all the problems you have been adding to Greco-Turkish relations the past 50 years. We had some 50 years of peace and no problems in the Aegean with the exception of occasional trouble in Cyprus,and suddenly in the '70s when oil and gas are rumored to be around somewhere in the Aegean,you forget Treaties,you ignore the era from the late 20s to the early 70s and start revising everything: Suddenly you remember "demilitarization" of islands,suddenly you remember "grey zones",you invent rules that have nothing to do with the International Law of the Seas,you talk about war if we expand to 12 miles,you come up with demands about the Aegean,things like the Turco-Libyan EEZ memorandum.

It's literally Turkey that's been adding problems to the Greco-Turkish relations,yet you keep saying "Oh Yunan are threatening us! Oh,they are escalating,they are asking for war! They want to go to war! They are being used by others!"

Guys,take a look back at your governments the last 50 years. From where we had no problems(except Cyprus),suddenly decade after decade Turkey invented new rules and new demands.

 

[Foinikas]

Your entire political and ideological framework of beliefs, assumptions, and values is based on some Orthodox prophecy of questionable origin?!

The Russians will fight against Turkey so a NATO and EU member state can control the entire Aegean Sea?

You do understand that this is not in Moscow’s interest?

Yes and no. I believe in preparedness,but I also believe we should have faith and trust in God.

As for the prophecies,what they say is Russians will not do we for us,they will have their own interests. One version I've heard says the Americans will convince Turkey to close the Straits so no Russian ship can pass. To do that,Turks might use a crisis with Greece in order to justify that. That's when the Russians will move against Turkey. And according to many other old and newer prophecies both from Byzantine,modern Greece and Russian sources,many European nations will go to war against Russia, supposedly for Turkey's sake,but in fact in order to grab some parts for themselves.

Anyway,Russia would be helping us without doing it for us,they would be acting out of their own interests.

 

[hyperman]

,suddenly decade after decade Turkey invented new rules and new demands.

There are no new rules. Turkey never signed these new rules that decided to expand EEZ and things of that nature.

You think Turkey would have ever let you keep the Islands in the treaty if it was known this bullshit would happen with EEZs in the first place? or that Italy would give the Islands and they would be militarized?

The current element being suggested is a compromise solution, don't extend the martime boundaries, otherwise there may be some thinkers that will think the only way to fix this is to take half the Islands in the Aegean.

Mitsotakis is foolishly bringing peril by breaking the current status quo. Its like that Moron in Armenia talking about Miatsum and breaking the status quo in Karabakh.

Keep the status quo, don't change it, this way ok, people argue and have disagreements but it never goes beyond that.

Netanyahu wants Greeks to die for Israel, I'm not exaggerating, not everyone who hands you a weapon and whispers in your ear, go get him, "you have take him", is your friend. They have their own agenda which invites fighting Turkey though Greeks.

 

[GoatsMilk]

There are no new rules. Turkey never signed these new rules that decided to expand EEZ and things of that nature.

You think Turkey would have ever let you keep the Islands in the treaty if it was known this bullshit would happen with EEZs in the first place? or that Italy would give the Islands and they would be militarized?

The current element being suggested is a compromise solution, don't extend the martime boundaries, otherwise there may be some thinkers that will think the only way to fix this is to take half the Islands in the Aegean.

Mitsotakis is foolishly bringing peril by breaking the current status quo. Its like that Moron in Armenia talking about Miatsum and breaking the status quo in Karabakh.

Keep the status quo, don't change it, this way ok, people argue and have disagreements but it never goes beyond that.

Netanyahu wants Greeks to die for Israel, I'm not exaggerating, not everyone who hands you a weapon and whispers in your ear, go get him, "you have take him", is your friend. They have their own agenda which invites fighting Turkey though Greeks.

knowing the greek mindset, if they did start a war and then Turks smashed them and took half the agean islands for themselves. The greeks would turn round and claim it was a Turkish/Zionist conspiracy to get the greeks to attack the Turks so that the Turks had the excuse to take the islands.

These people are muppets. When it was Azerbaijan they were celebrating that they were sending 800 spartans. When it was the Kurds it was the same shit with them. Now Turkiye for the first time in a long long time, can divert 90% of her attention towards Greece. Fun days are coming.

 

[Watandar]

knowing the greek mindset, if they did start a war and then Turks smashed them and took have the agean islands for themselves. The greeks would turn round and claim it was a Turkish/Zionist conspiracy to get the greeks to attack the Turks so that the Turks had the excuse to take the islands.

These people are muppets. When it was Azerbaijan they were celebrating that they were sending 800 spartans. When it was the Kurds it was the same shit with them. Now Turkiye first the first time in a long long time, can divert 90% of her attention towards Greece. Fun days are coming.

Turkey diverting 90% of its attention to Greece is the Zionist goal.

 

[GoatsMilk]

Turkey diverting 90% of its attention to Greece is the Zionist goal.

Turkiye has no choice, if the greeks play their imperial games as they have tried many times in the past. They have to get taken out. Once taken out, then focus can shift to Isreal.

If you look at how the Ottomans expanded. It was always a campaign to the west, then a campaign to east, then a campaign to the west.

I just hope this time the Muslims don't yet again fall for western propaganda when they try to portray the christian greeks as heroes and the Turkish Muslims as barbarians. Many Arabs today can see how the PKK game is being relayed in the western media. All Syrians are isis terrorists, while the PKK shitheads are gloried.

The sun owned by zionist news corp.

 

[Foinikas]

There are no new rules. Turkey never signed these new rules that decided to expand EEZ and things of that nature.

You think Turkey would have ever let you keep the Islands in the treaty if it was known this bullshit would happen with EEZs in the first place? or that Italy would give the Islands and they would be militarized?

The current element being suggested is a compromise solution, don't extend the martime boundaries, otherwise there may be some thinkers that will think the only way to fix this is to take half the Islands in the Aegean.

You're now in a similar logic as let's say "I sold you my field,but if I knew there was treasure in my field,I wouldn't have sold it to you,so now you can't dig that treasure out". It's got no basis.

It wasn't in your hand to "give" the islands. You lost a war. You had to give them up. And we're talking about islands for millenia hellenic and with a constant hellenic presence. But even if you ignore this historical view and look at the legal one and the solely the legal one:

The islands are part of Greece since the Balkan Wars,WWI and the end of WWII.

UNCLOS,is the international law of the seas. By the international Law of the Seas,it is Greece's legal right to expand to 12 naval miles. What Turkey is doing is actually causing all the tension and preventing us from truly being friendly neighboring countries. As you have nothing to be afraid of from a friendly Greece even with 12 naval miles EEZ.

Mitsotakis is foolishly bringing peril by breaking the current status quo. Its like that Moron in Armenia talking about Miatsum and breaking the status quo in Karabakh.

Keep the status quo, don't change it, this way ok, people argue and have disagreements but it never goes beyond that.

You don't understand a single thing I'm telling you: You threaten us with war and "interventions" constantly and you're here blaming Greece for trying to..."change the current status quo"? You literally have the Turkish side DEMANDING half the Aegean and Cyprus to share any drilling profits with the North and you're playing victim,saying we're the ones escalating?

Netanyahu wants Greeks to die for Israel, I'm not exaggerating, not everyone who hands you a weapon and whispers in your ear, go get him, "you have take him", is your friend. They have their own agenda which invites fighting Turkey though Greeks.

Yeah sure it's Netanyahu's fault It's not Erdogan's who's been shouting for months and years "HEEEY YUNAN,we'll throw you to the sea!"

Oh no,it's that Netanyahu's fault,not Erdogan's who was standing in public shouting "Remember Izmir! We might come one night,suddenly..."

Nor was it Bahçeli saying "We'll take the Dodecanse and Ikrit back" nor was it Akar saying "We'll teach you a lesson". Did you forget 1996's Imia? 30 anniversary this year. It was 30 years ago. Do you remember Tansu çiller's messages when Tassos Isaak and Solomos Solomou were literally executed live on camera? "We will break the hands of anyone who touches our flag". Do you remember your pilots' reckless maneuvres causing the death of a HAF pilot in the 2000s? The Turkish police and Army throwing immigrants at us and trying to pull down part of the border fence at Evros in 2020?

No you don't. Everything for you is Netanyahu. It's the Jews,it's the Americans,it's the French,it's the Egyptians. Always somebody else. For you,Greece is always "being used". You never take a look back to see it's all because of your actions. You never take a critical look on your foreign policy in regard to us,except to demand more intervention.

These people are muppets. When it was Azerbaijan they were celebrating that they were sending 800 spartans. When it was the Kurds it was the same shit with them. Now Turkiye for the first time in a long long time, can divert 90% of her attention towards Greece. Fun days are coming.

Who sent 800 "Spartants" re malaka? Some Armenians from Greece went there and you're media made a circus out of it.

Turkiye has no choice, if the greeks play their imperial games as they have tried many times in the past. They have to get taken out. Once taken out, then focus can shift to Isreal.

If you look at how the Ottomans expanded. It was always a campaign to the west, then a campaign to east, then a campaign to the west.

You have bases and/or soldiers in Syria,Azerbaijan,Northern Iraq,Libya,Qatar,Somalia,
Albania,Bosnia,Kosovo and you talk about imperial games? Are you fing kidding me? Are you trolling or are you so blind to irony?

 

[hyperman]

You're now in a similar logic as let's say "I sold you my field,but if I knew there was treasure in my field,I wouldn't have sold it to you,so now you can't dig that treasure out". It's got no basis.

It wasn't in your hand to "give" the islands. You lost a war. You had to give them up. And we're talking about islands for millenia hellenic and with a constant hellenic presence. But even if you ignore this historical view and look at the legal one and the solely the legal one:

The islands are part of Greece since the Balkan Wars,WWI and the end of WWII.

UNCLOS,is the international law of the seas. By the international Law of the Seas,it is Greece's legal right to expand to 12 naval miles. What Turkey is doing is actually causing all the tension and preventing us from truly being friendly neighboring countries. As you have nothing to be afraid of from a friendly Greece even with 12 naval miles EEZ.

Its not the field thats being contested, but using the field to contest the lake being yours. They didn't sell you the lake, it was assumed that they would be able to share the lake. Now you feel the whole late belongs to you, and thats not acceptable.

Turkey btw, didn't lose the war, Turkey fought until it reached terms, The Turks had already taken all fo Anatolia when the treaty was signed. You think if they wanted they couldn't take the islands bordering Anatolia? No the questions of EEZs wasn't even posed, b/c back then no one thought this nonsense would have happened.

if you want to negotiate over other matter and a mutual thing can be found over EEZ ok, but don't declare and then call your decree law. Turkey is NOT bound to anything it has not signed.

I'd advise you to keep the status quo and be content with your current 6, you try to get 12, you will get 0 and lose half the islands. And don't let anyone try to convince you otherwise.

This happened before and the Greeks wisely kept the status quo as 6. The idea that somehow you have changed the equation and now have the advantage over Turkey push for this b/c you have the zionist backing now, is a misread of the situation. If anything, its the other way around, its Turkey which has grown in capacity not Greece in terms of the gap that was present, the first time this disagreement came about. A conflict with the assumption of Israelis having your back and somehow being enough to be more aggressive in claiming more than 6 being viable is foolishness. Keep the Status quo.