Sea Sultan Long-Range MPA | Updates & Discussion

[Par 5]

Embraer is not too happy with PN developing an LRMPA on its platform without involving it in any way or shape.

When a commercial Lineage is purchased by the PN, its categorization changes from commercial to military jet which is than only dealt by Emabraer exclusively as far as the spares and consumables are concerned. Embraer is making it dfficult to provide after sales support of the Sea Sultan becase it does not want to see Leonardo or Paramount gain an upper hand on the credit of developing this platform.

The market brokers who sell the comemrcial platforms make a quick buck and eject and parts, spares and consumables for Sea Sultan become export controlled since the jets come under military aircraft categorization.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Embraer is not too happy with PN developing an LRMPA on its platform without involving it in any way or shape.

When a commercial Lineage is purchased by the PN, its categorization changes from commercial to military jet which is than only dealt by Emabraer exclusively as far as the spares and consumables are concerned. Embraer is making it dfficult to provide after sales support of the Sea Sultan becase it does not want to see Leonardo or Paramount gain an upper hand on the credit of developing this platform.

The market brokers who sell the comemrcial platforms make a quick buck and eject and parts, spares and consumables for Sea Sultan become export controlled since the jets come under military aircraft categorization.

I think Embraer will be very very happy with Sea Sultan because it shows how versatile their core platform is that it can be successfully used in this role. It is good marketing for their platform.

 

[Ak01]

I think Embraer will be very very happy with Sea Sultan because it shows how versatile their core platform is that it can be successfully used in this role. It is good marketing for their platform.

problem is it cut them out of the equation.

They already had an offering.





But, they can go and **** themselves really. They're far too interested in the Indian market so thus neglected this one.

The only issue is if they blacklist the airframes, parts and spares will need to be smuggled, causing problems. I think PN/Emb will have to work out n agreement eventually.

 

[Starlord]

problem is it cut them out of the equation.

They already had an offering.

View attachment 187328

View attachment 187329

But, they can go and **** themselves really. They're far too interested in the Indian market so thus neglected this one.

The only issue is if they blacklist the airframes, parts and spares will need to be smuggled, causing problems. I think PN/Emb will have to work out n agreement eventually.

Wonder how their own E190-E2 is vis v vis to Sea Sultan ?

 

[puttputt]

problem is it cut them out of the equation.

They already had an offering.

View attachment 187328

View attachment 187329

But, they can go and **** themselves really. They're far too interested in the Indian market so thus neglected this one.

The only issue is if they blacklist the airframes, parts and spares will need to be smuggled, causing problems. I think PN/Emb will have to work out n agreement eventually.

It'd be a good call for the PAF to step in and procure the E190-E2 special-mission variant directly from Embraer for a future AEW&C program or something (e.g., SIGINT, ELINT, testbed for PFX radar, etc.). This way, the PAF and PN can work out an official support agreement with Embraer re: Sea Sultan and future PAF applications.

 

[rAli]

its on a swivel with an a2a mode, one of the reqs for sea sultan was for it to be able to have a secondary awacs role, via a2a radar mode.

Yeah,I didn't find much on a2a role either but the max range is 320NM as per Leonardo's website.

Radar Seaspray 7500E

Leonardo AESA multi-mode surveillance radar. X-band frequency for maritime surveillance and ground mapping capabilities.

www.leonardo.us

 

[kimjongun]

testbed for PFX radar

LOL , eid ke din hain iska mtlab nai ap kuch bhi kaho

 

[kimjongun]

Embraer is not too happy with PN developing an LRMPA on its platform without involving it in any way or shape.

When a commercial Lineage is purchased by the PN, its categorization changes from commercial to military jet which is than only dealt by Emabraer exclusively as far as the spares and consumables are concerned. Embraer is making it dfficult to provide after sales support of the Sea Sultan becase it does not want to see Leonardo or Paramount gain an upper hand on the credit of developing this platform.

The market brokers who sell the comemrcial platforms make a quick buck and eject and parts, spares and consumables for Sea Sultan become export controlled since the jets come under military aircraft categorization.

so they didnt think this beforehand? maybe what if they did , cuz i dont want to see a promising LRMPA program suffering due to spare parts issue

 

[Ali_Baba]

It'd be a good call for the PAF to step in and procure the E190-E2 special-mission variant directly from Embraer for a future AEW&C program or something (e.g., SIGINT, ELINT, testbed for PFX radar, etc.). This way, the PAF and PN can work out an official support agreement with Embraer re: Sea Sultan and future PAF applications.

That is a good idea - esp if they work with them where the Radar kit is Pakistani designed, a bit like what India did with the NETRA programme.

 

[MirageV3ff]

PAF would be better off fast tracking the J-35AEs and then trying to sell off the J10CEs once the J-35AEs arrive. It can use the money saved on setting up new depo-level maintenance and support infrastructure for J10CE's on other programmes instread. PAF has the advantage of making that play, and it will help reduce 1 additional type in the fleet, where the future ideal fleet can look like J-35AE, KAAN's, JF17's and what is left of the 16's ..

You still have a medium weight fighter aircraft requirement. F-16s won't exactly stay for long (ADFs and Peace gate 1s are near retirement age)

I do expect to see J-10 numbers increase but gradually. If anything J-10s make real good sense in maritime strike missions

 

[Yasser76]

Were they customised ? Given the compressed procurement timeline I don’t think they were, but instead a standard export variant with comms changes etc?

Really not sure, thought they would have been to data link to Pak specific assets

 

[Ali_Baba]

problem is it cut them out of the equation.

They already had an offering.

View attachment 187328

View attachment 187329

But, they can go and **** themselves really. They're far too interested in the Indian market so thus neglected this one.

The only issue is if they blacklist the airframes, parts and spares will need to be smuggled, causing problems. I think PN/Emb will have to work out n agreement eventually.

The Embraer design looks good - looking forward to see what PN managed to do with their approach.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Really not sure, thought they would have been to data link to Pak specific assets

The software changes, and custom datalink integrations would be easy to wind back imho.

To me, getting the J-35AE even in Block 1 variant(my designation) with Day #1 bugs is worth more than getting more J10CE's given the capability increase with the offset of removing a platform(J10CE) that we are not that invested in at the moment to save on costs there.

It is the bang for buck equation, and the J-35AE yields alot.

 

[Yasser76]

The software changes, and custom datalink integrations would be easy to wind back imho.

To me, getting the J-35AE even in Block 1 variant(my designation) with Day #1 bugs is worth more than getting more J10CE's given the capability increase with the offset of removing a platform(J10CE) that we are not that invested in at the moment to save on costs there.

It is the bang for buck equation, and the J-35AE yields alot.

Oh for sure, 100% agree, leave aside the amazing capabilities it would bring, there would be a massive psychological effect for PAF being the only 5th Gen operator in the region and the muslim world....

 

[Toxic]

LOL , eid ke din hain iska mtlab nai ap kuch bhi kaho

IMO if we are able to get a decent airborne radar out of the PFX I would call the project a success, it also isn't all that unrealistic unlike building a fifth gen.