Operation Ghazab Lil Haq (Pakistan - Afghanistan War)

[ghazi52]

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[Starlord]

The " imaginary line has been crossed "

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Hey they were the one keep crying over Durand line doesn't matter or exists, but I am still against Pakistan taking Afghan Territory, just create a no man buffer zone, but we should not take anyone's territory. We hold this principle against Israel's annexation of Palestinian lands, and India taking Kashmir, so lets not do what we criticize others for as a country.

 

[Starlord]

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Would've been amazing if the one who operate that gun also perish with it.

 

[I*R*A]

Hey they were the one keep crying over Durand line doesn't matter or exists, but I am still against Pakistan taking Afghan Territory, just create a no man buffer zone, but we should not take anyone's territory. We hold this principle against Israel's annexation of Palestinian lands, and India taking Kashmir, so lets not do what we criticize others for as a country.

Temporary occupation of Nuristan makes sense, though I am not sure from which direction the incursion took place. Kunar is right next to it and borders Pakistan. Till these border areas are cleared off all the terrorist havens and launch pads, Pakistan should keep its ground presence there. I believe one of the TTA excuse was they do not hold much influence in some areas and are spread thin.

 

[ghazi52]

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[Starlord]

Temporary occupation of Nuristan makes sense, though I am not sure from which direction the incursion took place. Kunar is right next to it and borders Pakistan. Till these border areas are cleared off all the terrorist havens and launch pads, Pakistan should keep its ground presence there. I believe one of the TTA excuse was they do not hold much influence in some areas and are spread thin.

I support destroying the Posts, and making a buffer zone but holding Afghan territory will not sit well with common Afghan and international community. I agree taking territory will help a lot but we can also reduce the terror incidents by taking care of enemy within, going after supporters of TTP/BLA, cutting off their funding/supply lines, zero tolerance for extremism etc.

 

[ghazi52]

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[SABRE]

Hey they were the one keep crying over Durand line doesn't matter or exists, but I am still against Pakistan taking Afghan Territory, just create a no man buffer zone, but we should not take anyone's territory. We hold this principle against Israel's annexation of Palestinian lands, and India taking Kashmir, so lets not do what we criticize others for as a country.

I second your sentiments. Recognised territorial boundaries and sovereignty should be respected. However, I am also beginning to find it very difficult to reconcile with my beliefs (the aforementioned sentiment) and the security necessities. There is no good solution, but the least worst probably would be for Pakistan to hold on to Afghan territories (if possible) while recognising them as part of Afghanistan and restrict own agenda to "security administration." Governance and economic activities should remain with the local population of the territories.

 

[Starlord]

I second your sentiments. Recognised territorial boundaries and sovereignty should be respected. However, I am also beginning to find it very difficult to reconcile with my beliefs (the aforementioned sentiment) and the security necessities. There is no good solution, but the least worst probably would be for Pakistan to hold on to Afghan territories (if possible) while recognising them as part of Afghanistan and restrict own agenda to "security administration." Governance and economic activities should remain with the local population of the territories.

Any Dialog/respect and business with Afghan regime and people should be related to their support for BLA/TTP, you want trade than handover TTP leadership and dismantle their training centers, buffer zone must be negotiated. This particular Taliban 2.0 they will not have peace with Pakistan, even if we bend over backwards, because their demands include taking over parts of Pakistan, plus we have India who will pay poor Afghans to fight this war, for Indians the money is not a issue as they have a much larger economy, they can fund this terrorism campaign for decades if they want to.
I would suggest total border closure, no trade and send every Afghan back. Track and hunt TTP/TTA lovers in Pakistan, put them in jail for software update, zero Tolerance for Terrorism or its support under the guise of Political parties.
We also have to keep bombing Taliban for now, at least take out much of their offensive capabilities like Ammo depots, armored cars, military HQ's, drones manufacturing warehouses, etc. Once they are weaken, let NRF engage them in a slow/low-hi intensity insurgency, if Tali's are busy fighting each other we can take TTP/BLA out.

 

[iron shrapnel]

so we took noristan?

I don't think we can take whole of Nuristan this quick but some vantage points

 

[Blain2]

Please bro - who let the talibs seek sanctuary in Pakistan - Gen Musharraf!!!

That was simply a continuation of policies from the Afghan Jihad. There was a foreign occupation going on in Afghanistan in Musharraf's tenure. What was our choice? Let Americans dominate and supplant a power structure of their choosing or provide support to those resisting?

People make it sound as if Pakistani establishment committed a crime by doing so. Had they not done it, the Pakhtun power structure in the government, military and the civil society would have agitated massively in case Pakistan sat out of that mess.

As I have said in my earlier post, the blame (if you call it that, I think it was making hard choices from very challenging options on the table), has to be shared. The supporters of a particular party cannot just say "it was the establishment" when they ran the government and had their PM's hand-picked DGISI running the show. Perhaps that was the best option available then but now we are dealing with the blowback of it and that responsibility should be shared and not appropriated to the establishment only which some member of a particular political affiliation have a tendency to do.

 

[Starlord]

These scam artists started worshipping Bin Laden thinking through him they would be able to conquer Pakistan

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Understanding Islam is not for these monkey's, remember that although Rasool Allah was illiterate but he had help from the divine and many of the early and famous companions were those who were able to read and write, hence the understand of Islam was very strong. Abu Bakr RA, Umar Khattab RA and Uthman RA, with exception of Ali RA all 3 Rashidun Calips were very smart literate individuals. These Jahil Afghans has literally created some other version of Islam which 80-90% based on culture, and other BS. I don't expect any positive from them, but some of the overseas Muslims are very fond of Taliban's Islam and their primitive mentality and see it as connecting with the Original roots of Islam.

 

[Taimoor]

The real problem may be your own selective hearing, which EVERYONE on this thread knows is funneled in one direction only, willfully ignoring ANY positive statements made by those who exist anywhere outside of that hallucinogenic auditory spectrum.

I have no interest in specific parties or specific politicians, but when they demonstrate their educational pedigree and defend Pakistani interests, I take note:

"Bilawal (Bhutto) said that Prime Minister Narendra Modi has claimed India is heir to a civilisation thousands of years old, “But that civilisation lies in Mohenjo-daro, in Larkana. We are its true custodians, and we will defend it.” "

Redirect Notice

The message to Pakistan is simple - get educated and defend your legacy rights. I will agree ONLY on this one point - that we could do better in terms of education and realisation of our true potential.

You are clearly pissing in the air, you have zero clue about Pakistani society and its intellectual level when it comes to what Pakistaniyat actually means due to years of indoctrination through education system. I can talk about it since I have gone through that system. Bilawal bhutto? Lol. Is that policy of state and those who have assumed the role of the State? Show me the map of Greater Pakistan, have you?

 

[SABRE]

Any Dialog/respect and business with Afghan regime and people should be related to their support for BLA/TTP, you want trade than handover TTP leadership and dismantle their training centers, buffer zone must be negotiated. This particular Taliban 2.0 they will not have peace with Pakistan, even if we bend over backwards, because their demands include taking over parts of Pakistan, plus we have India who will pay poor Afghans to fight this war, for Indians the money is not a issue as they have a much larger economy, they can fund this terrorism campaign for decades if they want to.
I would suggest total border closure, no trade and send every Afghan back. Track and hunt TTP/TTA lovers in Pakistan, put them in jail for software update, zero Tolerance for Terrorism or its support under the guise of Political parties.
We also have to keep bombing Taliban for now, at least take out much of their offensive capabilities like Ammo depots, armored cars, military HQ's, drones manufacturing warehouses, etc. Once they are weaken, let NRF engage them in a slow/low-hi intensity insurgency, if Tali's are busy fighting each other we can take TTP/BLA out.

Total border closure is unfortunately difficult to the point of being impossible. The border is just too porous, and every time the Pakistan Army puts up a fence, the Afghans cut chunks of it and sell it, from what I have heard.

TTA will also not hand over TTP leadership or the operatives, much as they didn't hand over Osama Bin Laden. Besides, some/many TTP operatives seem to be Afghan nationals, perhaps belonging to TTA ranks.

 

[Master Chief]

You are clearly pissing in the air, you have zero clue about Pakistani society and its intellectual level when it comes to what Pakistaniyat actually means due to years of indoctrination through education system. I can talk about it since I have gone through that system. Bilawal bhutto? Lol. Is that policy of state and those who have assumed the role of the State? Show me the map of Greater Pakistan, have you?

Regardless of facts and regardless of your upbringing or my upbringing, all you will ever talk about on this forum is how terrible every government official or every government policy or every government statement is unless and until a certain messiah is the source and ultimate arbiter of any of the above. Your discourse would hold far more leverage if it was grounded in merit as opposed to biased beliefs.

I have listened to plenty of people on this forum, including yourself, who profess to the importance of ownership of Pakistan's true ethnic, civilisational, and genealogical origins with regards to our ongoing legacy as a nation state.

In fact, I challenge you to identify ONE SINGLE Pakistani (whether educated formatively in Pakistan or abroad) forum member who does subscribe to this "bin Qasim is our genealogical father" narrative.

The ONLY forum goers who subscribe to the "arab-origin" narrative are actually Indians, as it is Indians who have indoctrinated themselves with this convenient parallel narrative, a narrative that suits their agenda. So the question then becomes, why are YOU, a Pakistani, subscribing to that narrative?