JF-17 - Updates, News & Discussion

[Pakistan Space Agency]

I think there should be one standard block for JF-17s which is block lll. PAF doesn't have the financial capability to upgrade aircraft like the US does. They may have the capability but without the money it's a waste of time and effort. Hst block ll can be upgraded to block lll which would mean a 100 block lll aircraft.
Priority is being given to induct additional J-10CE aircraft.
View attachment 200155
Possible J-10CE seen in China. No Serial No.

If Pakistan can acquire J-10Cs in large numbers, then JF-17 Thunders becomes irrelevant.

Whatever work Pakistan does on the JF-17s can be shifted to the J-10s in my humble opinion.

A combat air force made up of J-10Cs and J-35s would fulfill all of PAF's combat needs for good three-four decades.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

What was the outcome of all the rumours about JF17 Sales

a) Saudi (Sudan)
b) Bangladesh
c) Samalia
d) Indonesia

What actually materialized and what turned out to be just potential Opportunity

Erie silence about JF17 induction since we got J10C

For Sudan, wait couple of more years.
Bangladesh is going Europe.
Somalia?
Indonesia is not interested.

Let's concentrate on Azerbaijan for now and the other 5 customers we can't mention.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

View attachment 201626

I think this maybe the first time that I have seen a photo of the Prototypes 01 and 04 parked together.

Thanks @ghazi52 for the upload.

 

[Fatman17]

If Pakistan can acquire J-10Cs in large numbers, then JF-17 Thunders become irrelevant.

Whatever work Pakistan does on the JF-17s can be shifted to the J-10s in my humble opinion.

A combat air force made up of J-10Cs and J-35s would fulfill all of PAF combat needs for good three-four decades.

Very optimistic comment.
JF-17s will be the workhorse of the PAF. J-10CE will be the cutting edge but it's numbers will be limited. Too early to comment on the J-35A. The 80 odd F-16s are still around for a a decade or more if upgrades are available.

 

[puttputt]

If Pakistan can acquire J-10Cs in large numbers, then JF-17 Thunders becomes irrelevant.

Whatever work Pakistan does on the JF-17s can be shifted to the J-10s in my humble opinion.

A combat air force made up of J-10Cs and J-35s would fulfill all of PAF's combat needs for good three-four decades.

We've already set up the facilities and know-how to integrate weapon systems to the JF-17. This is crucial for our entire SOW deployment strategy at this point, especially locally-made SOWs.

As it stands, the PAF is procuring more J-10CEs specifically for the A2A (which these fighters were originally optimized for by the PLAAF), with the JF-17s taking on an MR role with a stronger SOW (e.g., IREK, CM-400AKG, Taimur ALCM, and future SOWs) role.

Pivoting fully to the J-10CE would mean, basically, letting the Chinese shake us down again each time we ask them to integrate a NESCOM SOW for us.

 

[rafale]

Nice, another confirmation (after a long gap) that Dashings have recieved upgraded block-1s.

What upgrade Block 1s have?

Radar? Computers? Control system (i believe it was digital in 2 axis and analog in 1)???

 

[air marshal]

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[LX1111]

Hi, I was lucky enough to attend RIAT 2025 last year. I spoke to JF-17 maintenance crews about the RD93. They said they loved that engine and it had great diagnostics. You could pretty much run diagnosics on all the components of the engine. I was told they had evaluated other engines, but were satisfied with the RD93.

Moreover, let's backtrack to two decades ago... Pakistan did not have much choice back in 2003. China's did not have a reliable turbofan engine, and no Western country would even think of supplying an engine to the PAF.

From a structural design perspective, the RD-33 is not outdated. Like its , the F404, it adopts a modular construction philosophy that facilitates condition-based maintenance—meaning maintenance is determined by the engine's actual operating condition rather than by fixed time intervals. The RD-33 is divided into 11 modules, each of which can be independently disassembled, inspected, and replaced. This modular design not only greatly simplifies the engine's overall structure, but also significantly reduces the difficulty of routine maintenance and battlefield repair, thereby improving mission readiness and overall maintainability.

 

[LX1111]

And apparently engine life also reduced by almost half with lower MTBO. I wonder wouldn't this severely affect availability rates? IAF has struggled a lot with RD33 and AL31 series engines and is the sole reason why LCA was not built around RD-33 series even though the engines are made in India.

,

The RD-33MK has an MTBO of 1,000 hours and a total service life of 4,000 hours. This engine model was redesigned by Russia with the use of better superalloys for high-temperature applications.

As for the RD-93MA, according to my sources, its service life is only half that of the RD-33MK. To reduce development costs, Russia did not significantly increase the turbine inlet temperature. These engines still use directionally solidified superalloys rather than nickel-based single-crystal superalloys

 

[AeronautIR]

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Thank you mate

 

[Trailer23]

Btw are dual missile rails standard on all JF-17s now? We first started seeing them on later block 2s.

Pretty sure it's not on earlier Blocks.

If memory serves, it was introduced when Block III was about to go into Production.

Wings were actually redesigned/made stronger for that very purpose.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

,

The RD-33MK has an MTBO of 1,000 hours and a total service life of 4,000 hours. This engine model was redesigned by Russia with the use of better superalloys for high-temperature applications.

As for the RD-93MA, according to my sources, its service life is only half that of the RD-33MK. To reduce development costs, Russia did not significantly increase the turbine inlet temperature. These engines still use directionally solidified superalloys rather than nickel-based single-crystal superalloys

So that might translate to even lower MTBOs for the 93? I think for single engine it might not be as bad as twin RD-33 on a MiG-29 per se in terms of affecting availability.

 

[Ak01]

So that might translate to even lower MTBOs for the 93? I think for single engine it might not be as bad as twin RD-33 on a MiG-29 per se in terms of affecting availability.

the IAF struggled particularly with theirs, and there we're modifications to improve the engine, the germans for example developed a kit which added another 400 hours to its tbo.

with the rd33 series the biggest issue is design life anyway...each rd33 series engine will be replaced twice or three times (or overhauled) by the time one f404 is etc

 

[Ali_Baba]

the IAF struggled particularly with theirs, and there we're modifications to improve the engine, the germans for example developed a kit which added another 400 hours to its tbo.

with the rd33 series the biggest issue is design life anyway...each rd33 series engine will be replaced twice or three times (or overhauled) by the time one f404 is etc

Engines have been a curse on the entire JF17 programme from the outset.

Originally when the Super-7 project was not giving what the PAF wanted, they came up with the FC-1 design and at that time they approached the Russians for the Saturn AL-31 series of engines to power the FC-1.

This would have given a platform far closer to the F16 than what it is now. India was successful in convincing Russia to not supply the Saturn AL-31, and instead the Russians only authorized the RD-93 series for the project. This was unfortunate as a JF17 with the Saturn AL-31 would have been a beast.

Unfortunately the internet forgets, and I am recalling this from memory from the time at the inflection point between the Super-7 and FC-1 programmes and the discussions at the time on the internet.

(happy to be wrong if my memory is giving out on this fact!)