AJK govt bans Joint Awami Action Committee, notification issued

[Olympus81]

Pakistan has effectively lost its moral standing on AJK with these moves.

The establishment doesn’t know any better. Words like kinetic, bear knuckle are well and good when it comes to battlefields, but when dealing with your own people there will only be long term negative repercussions.

Under this administration, you’ve got uptick in TTP, BLA and now violence in AJK.

Yet still the establishment fanboys want more of a hammer approach. True definition of a cult mentality.

 

[Oscar]

Pakistan has effectively lost its moral standing on AJK with these moves.

The establishment doesn’t know any better. Words like kinetic, bear knuckle are well and good when it comes to battlefields, but when dealing with your own people there will only be long term negative repercussions.

Under this administration, you’ve got uptick in TTP, BLA and now violence in AJK.

Yet still the establishment fanboys want more of a hammer approach. True definition of a cult mentality.

Agreed but then Pakistanis like their cults. Easier to follow then actual thinking.
Cult of establishment, cult of Imran, Nawaz, Zardari and so on.

Very few could be free from a cult tendency primarily because they have developed the cognitive autonomy, critical infrastructure (independent income, secure social networks, exposure to pluralistic thought), and psychic bandwidth that allow for genuine first principles thinking rather than outsourcing judgment to a figurehead.

It is the path of least resistance when a population is trapped under compounding, multi spectral chronic stress. When the mind is perpetually taxed by economic precarity, political violence, institutional betrayal, and existential insecurity as it is for the vast majority of Pakistanis, educated or not; the brain's prefrontal cortex, responsible for rational deliberation and critical thought, is systematically degraded.

Simple explanations become neurologically rewarding.
Charismatic leaders who offer clean narratives of blame and salvation whether it is the establishments "pan militaristic class" nationalism , Imran, Nawaz, Zardari then can exploit this cognitive exhaustion, filling the vacuum that functional accountable institutions and trustworthy systems should occupy.

Ironically, the educated middle class is not immune with extremist and cult sympathies are actually strongest among them as evidenced in this forum and beyond.

Because they possess sophisticated tools for rationalizing emotional loyalty rather than genuinely interrogating it. Pakistan's doctrinal education system compounds this by producing credentialed graduates who have never built the habit of adversarial self questioning.

Escaping this dynamic requires a very specific and rare stack of conditions whether financial independence from patronage networks, diverse non partisan social exposure, psychological security, and a community where dissent carries no social cost.

Since Pakistan's chronic stress ecosystem systematically dismantles each of these conditions for most of its population, independent thinking remains the exception, and the cult whether of a general, a populist, or a dynasty remains the rule.

Or in short,
Yeh galiyon ke aawaaraa bekaar kutte
Ke bakshaa gayaa jinko zauq-e-gadaai,
Zamaane ki phatkaar sarmaayaa unkaa
Jahaan bhar ki dhatkaar unki kamaai.

Na aaraam shab ko na raahat sawere;
Ghilaazat mein ghar, naaliyon mein basere.
Jo bigde to ek doosare se ladaa-do;
Zaraa ek roti kaa tukdaa dikhaa-do.

Yeh har ek ki thokarein khaanewaale,
Yeh faaqon se uktaake mar jaanewaale,
Yeh mazloom makhlookh gar sar uthaa-e
To insaan sab sarkashi bhool jaaye.

Yeh chahein to duniyaa ko apnaa banaalein,
Yeh aaqaaon ki haddiyaan tak chabaadein.
Koi inko ehsaas-e-zillat dilaa-de,
Koi inki soyee hui dum hilaa-de.

 

[kambhakt]

Education of what, producing babies without marriage and dump the woman, smoking cocaine having orgies even in prime minister house?

Producing babies without marriage creates problems for him. Allowing Afghans into Pakistan creates problems for all Pakistani. You might be better off looking after problems created for you and let he and Allah look after his problems.

 

[hussain0216]

Pakistan has effectively lost its moral standing on AJK with these moves.

The establishment doesn’t know any better. Words like kinetic, bear knuckle are well and good when it comes to battlefields, but when dealing with your own people there will only be long term negative repercussions.

Under this administration, you’ve got uptick in TTP, BLA and now violence in AJK.

Yet still the establishment fanboys want more of a hammer approach. True definition of a cult mentality.

These forces were ALWAYS there

We are simply finally taking them on


We let afghans run rampant in Pakistan, our stupid concept of brotherhood let this foreign enemy cause chaos

In one form or the other BLA, TTP etc have existed since 1947

Same in AJK, expecting Pakistani soldiers and state to do the heavy lifting, tax payers money going to protect Kashmir and they can just swan around expecting subsidies and insulting the country??????


At some point you have to stop walking on egg shells and deal the problems

If a population is intelligent maybe that means a peaceful political route.

However when a population is like ours, Jahil and ethnocentric that means you have to enforce the state writ

TTP or BLA may inflict violence, BUT Pakistan can inflict more crushing violence on them and their peoples and make them suffer Indefinitely and that's what we are doing

Afghanistan is SUFFERING, it will suffer intensely

We have got Iran onside, and now it's time to hunt the BLA leaders

We need to take this fight to our enemies, not wait around for every lannats to cause chaos

 

[Olympus81]

Agreed but then Pakistanis like their cults. Easier to follow then actual thinking.
Cult of establishment, cult of Imran, Nawaz, Zardari and so on.

Very few could be free from a cult tendency primarily because they have developed the cognitive autonomy, critical infrastructure (independent income, secure social networks, exposure to pluralistic thought), and psychic bandwidth that allow for genuine first principles thinking rather than outsourcing judgment to a figurehead.

It is the path of least resistance when a population is trapped under compounding, multi spectral chronic stress. When the mind is perpetually taxed by economic precarity, political violence, institutional betrayal, and existential insecurity as it is for the vast majority of Pakistanis, educated or not; the brain's prefrontal cortex, responsible for rational deliberation and critical thought, is systematically degraded.

Simple explanations become neurologically rewarding.
Charismatic leaders who offer clean narratives of blame and salvation whether it is the establishments "pan militaristic class" nationalism , Imran, Nawaz, Zardari then can exploit this cognitive exhaustion, filling the vacuum that functional accountable institutions and trustworthy systems should occupy.

Ironically, the educated middle class is not immune with extremist and cult sympathies are actually strongest among them as evidenced in this forum and beyond.

Because they possess sophisticated tools for rationalizing emotional loyalty rather than genuinely interrogating it. Pakistan's doctrinal education system compounds this by producing credentialed graduates who have never built the habit of adversarial self questioning.

Escaping this dynamic requires a very specific and rare stack of conditions whether financial independence from patronage networks, diverse non partisan social exposure, psychological security, and a community where dissent carries no social cost.

Since Pakistan's chronic stress ecosystem systematically dismantles each of these conditions for most of its population, independent thinking remains the exception, and the cult whether of a general, a populist, or a dynasty remains the rule.

Or in short,
Yeh galiyon ke aawaaraa bekaar kutte
Ke bakshaa gayaa jinko zauq-e-gadaai,
Zamaane ki phatkaar sarmaayaa unkaa
Jahaan bhar ki dhatkaar unki kamaai.

Na aaraam shab ko na raahat sawere;
Ghilaazat mein ghar, naaliyon mein basere.
Jo bigde to ek doosare se ladaa-do;
Zaraa ek roti kaa tukdaa dikhaa-do.

Yeh har ek ki thokarein khaanewaale,
Yeh faaqon se uktaake mar jaanewaale,
Yeh mazloom makhlookh gar sar uthaa-e
To insaan sab sarkashi bhool jaaye.

Yeh chahein to duniyaa ko apnaa banaalein,
Yeh aaqaaon ki haddiyaan tak chabaadein.
Koi inko ehsaas-e-zillat dilaa-de,
Koi inki soyee hui dum hilaa-de.

Valid points bro.

Now the question is, what corrective measures should Pakistan take to improve on its shortcomings?

Institutions operating under constitutional parameters, elections that aren’t rigged, leaders that are held accountable, judiciary working, maybe?

Or straightforward martial law. Although it would be in direct contradiction to what our forefathers envisioned Pakistan to be, but just come out in the open and do it full on rather than half measures.

Because the status quo is certainly not working.

 

[Olympus81]

These forces were ALWAYS there

We are simply finally taking them on


We let afghans run rampant in Pakistan, our stupid concept of brotherhood let this foreign enemy cause chaos

In one form or the other BLA, TTP etc have existed since 1947

Same in AJK, expecting Pakistani soldiers and state to do the heavy lifting, tax payers money going to protect Kashmir and they can just swan around expecting subsidies and insulting the country??????


At some point you have to stop walking on egg shells and deal the problems

If a population is intelligent maybe that means a peaceful political route.

However when a population is like ours, Jahil and ethnocentric that means you have to enforce the state writ

TTP or BLA may inflict violence, BUT Pakistan can inflict more crushing violence on them and their peoples and make them suffer Indefinitely and that's what we are doing

Afghanistan is SUFFERING, it will suffer intensely

We have got Iran onside, and now it's time to hunt the BLA leaders

We need to take this fight to our enemies, not wait around for every lannats to cause chaos

Bhai,

When the next Field Martial arrives, whose to say Taliban won’t be back in good books.

Musharraf, Kiyani were of good Taliban breed. Rahil Sharif started with the TTPs, Bajwa was pretty much mute but to his credit built a fence and was neutral. And Munir eventually came out all guns blazing.

Not like the Taliban became what they are overnight.

Next Chief? Who knows. And the DG ISPR is always there to turn around the narrative and not long before Pakistanis will be singing songs of Taliban mujahid.

All I am trying to say is, this is what happens when an institution becomes too strong and its policy overshadows the interests of the state which in effect has long term negative repercussions.

The absence of a functioning parliament means a certain other institution views every problem that needs to be solved through violence and stamping everyone else as traitors.

JAAC se aap baat kar sakte the. Listen to their issues, take it to the AJK parliament, have a debate on it. You had a great opportunity to show the IoK folks what they’re missing on the other side. Magar nahi..

 

[Hazard]

Kashmirisi have to understand, and eventually accept that you're extremely unlikely to be an independent state. Your fate is either with India or Pakistan, not independence. The current LOC is widely accepted to be international border between both sides. For residents of our side, you have had it good since 1947. Time to accept you won't be getting independence and start making the most of your lives as citizens of Pakistan.

 

[mythbuster]

Valid points bro.

Now the question is, what corrective measures should Pakistan take to improve on its shortcomings?

Institutions operating under constitutional parameters, elections that aren’t rigged, leaders that are held accountable, judiciary working, maybe?

Or straightforward martial law. Although it would be in direct contradiction to what our forefathers envisioned Pakistan to be, but just come out in the open and do it full on rather than half measures.

Because the status quo is certainly not working.

Forget the vision of your forefathers , ( they had no vision , we shall ditch ancestral worship) ....our constitution is a curse on Pakistan , it's borrowed from the intellectually more evolved and civilised west...it doesn't suit a primitive society like ours....come up with something that's in sync with our cultural moorings

 

[hussain0216]

Even if w accept sharifs, Bhutto's ets are corrupt and need to change

Who will replace them????

I keep asking this, what comprehensive manifesto does PTI or anyone else have???

And how bad will the chaos in the aftermath of change be??


Democracy can be manipulated, and we live in a time where social media is a weapon against you

Our awam are thick
They are easily manipulated and convinced especially of you use ethnic, cultural, religious statements

Democracy in the current time is DANGEROUS for a country like Pakistan, where the population is too stupid to understand the world and the dangers we face


I even like IK, but ITS ALL A PERSONALITY CULT

their is no policy behind the face or the movement



Pakistan doesn't need this, for all the faults and problems we are on the correct path

A period of autocratic rule where we can plan against India, Afghanistan, the Zionists, the world and deal with the donkeys at home

 

[mythbuster]

Even if w accept sharifs, Bhutto's ets are corrupt and need to change

Who will replace them????

I keep asking this, what comprehensive manifesto does PTI or anyone else have???

And how bad will the chaos in the aftermath of change be??


Democracy can be manipulated, and we live in a time where social media is a weapon against you

Our awam are thick
They are easily manipulated and convinced especially of you use ethnic, cultural, religious statements

Democracy in the current time is DANGEROUS for a country like Pakistan, where the population is too stupid to understand the world and the dangers we face


I even like IK, but ITS ALL A PERSONALITY CULT

their is no policy behind the face or the movement



Pakistan doesn't need this, for all the faults and problems we are on the correct path

A period of autocratic rule where we can plan against India, Afghanistan, the Zionists, the world and deal with the donkeys at home

Until recently, I also believed we are on the right path.
Alas , we got mesmerized by our newfound glory as a mediator and forgot what's needed to be done to restructure the economy and purge the country from black sheep and white elephants.

 

[Olympus81]

Even if w accept sharifs, Bhutto's ets are corrupt and need to change

Who will replace them????

I keep asking this, what comprehensive manifesto does PTI or anyone else have???

And how bad will the chaos in the aftermath of change be??


Democracy can be manipulated, and we live in a time where social media is a weapon against you

Our awam are thick
They are easily manipulated and convinced especially of you use ethnic, cultural, religious statements

Democracy in the current time is DANGEROUS for a country like Pakistan, where the population is too stupid to understand the world and the dangers we face


I even like IK, but ITS ALL A PERSONALITY CULT

their is no policy behind the face or the movement



Pakistan doesn't need this, for all the faults and problems we are on the correct path

A period of autocratic rule where we can plan against India, Afghanistan, the Zionists, the world and deal with the donkeys at home

This experiment started with Ayub Khan’s martial law and has been intact for majority of Pakistan’s life.

Safe to say, it’s not working as expected.

 

[hussain0216]

Until recently, I also believed we are on the right path.
Alas , we got mesmerized by our newfound glory as a mediator and forgot what's needed to be done to restructure the economy and purge the country from black sheep and white elephants.

Absolutely, we need to change

We are a hybrid system, my worry like yours is that we will change to slowly

When we need IMMEDIATE policy implementation



People think mistakenly, oh look terrorism has increased
Baloch/BLA, TTP, JCCP etc

It's because we a re finally confronting these animals that they are agitated, and for the sake of Pakistan we need to CRUSH THEM


We can't have a system where the local and ethnic supercedes the state, we will all be pulling in different directions


Now is the time and opportunity, to put our military and security forces to task and start destroying our enemies

BLA, TTP/Afghans etc are under intense pressure
As Pakistan is closing border crossings, ending trade, hitting targets

The best they can do is terrorism, which is now hurting them more then it's hurting us

We have to drag this thick as shit awam up whether they like it or not

 

[mythbuster]

Absolutely, we need to change

We are a hybrid system, my worry like yours is that we will change to slowly

When we need IMMEDIATE policy implementation



People think mistakenly, oh look terrorism has increased
Baloch/BLA, TTP, JCCP etc

It's because we a re finally confronting these animals that they are agitated, and for the sake of Pakistan we need to CRUSH THEM


We can't have a system where the local and ethnic supercedes the state, we will all be pulling in different directions


Now is the time and opportunity, to put our military and security forces to task and start destroying our enemies

BLA, TTP/Afghans etc are under intense pressure
As Pakistan is closing border crossings, ending trade, hitting targets

The best they can do is terrorism, which is now hurting them more then it's hurting us

We have to drag this thick as shit awam up whether they like it or not

That's all good , however we are forgetting one crucial lesson ! Economy is the pivot around which every thing revolves.....our top priority should be economy , BLA and TTP are nothing more than a nuisance that can be easily tackled.

 

[313Ghazi]

Agreed but then Pakistanis like their cults. Easier to follow then actual thinking.
Cult of establishment, cult of Imran, Nawaz, Zardari and so on.

Very few could be free from a cult tendency primarily because they have developed the cognitive autonomy, critical infrastructure (independent income, secure social networks, exposure to pluralistic thought), and psychic bandwidth that allow for genuine first principles thinking rather than outsourcing judgment to a figurehead.

It is the path of least resistance when a population is trapped under compounding, multi spectral chronic stress. When the mind is perpetually taxed by economic precarity, political violence, institutional betrayal, and existential insecurity as it is for the vast majority of Pakistanis, educated or not; the brain's prefrontal cortex, responsible for rational deliberation and critical thought, is systematically degraded.

Simple explanations become neurologically rewarding.
Charismatic leaders who offer clean narratives of blame and salvation whether it is the establishments "pan militaristic class" nationalism , Imran, Nawaz, Zardari then can exploit this cognitive exhaustion, filling the vacuum that functional accountable institutions and trustworthy systems should occupy.

Ironically, the educated middle class is not immune with extremist and cult sympathies are actually strongest among them as evidenced in this forum and beyond.

Because they possess sophisticated tools for rationalizing emotional loyalty rather than genuinely interrogating it. Pakistan's doctrinal education system compounds this by producing credentialed graduates who have never built the habit of adversarial self questioning.

Escaping this dynamic requires a very specific and rare stack of conditions whether financial independence from patronage networks, diverse non partisan social exposure, psychological security, and a community where dissent carries no social cost.

Since Pakistan's chronic stress ecosystem systematically dismantles each of these conditions for most of its population, independent thinking remains the exception, and the cult whether of a general, a populist, or a dynasty remains the rule.

Or in short,
Yeh galiyon ke aawaaraa bekaar kutte
Ke bakshaa gayaa jinko zauq-e-gadaai,
Zamaane ki phatkaar sarmaayaa unkaa
Jahaan bhar ki dhatkaar unki kamaai.

Na aaraam shab ko na raahat sawere;
Ghilaazat mein ghar, naaliyon mein basere.
Jo bigde to ek doosare se ladaa-do;
Zaraa ek roti kaa tukdaa dikhaa-do.

Yeh har ek ki thokarein khaanewaale,
Yeh faaqon se uktaake mar jaanewaale,
Yeh mazloom makhlookh gar sar uthaa-e
To insaan sab sarkashi bhool jaaye.

Yeh chahein to duniyaa ko apnaa banaalein,
Yeh aaqaaon ki haddiyaan tak chabaadein.
Koi inko ehsaas-e-zillat dilaa-de,
Koi inki soyee hui dum hilaa-de.

People need to read this multiple times and understand what @Oscar is saying.

If you don't understand read these papers

https://www.lse.ac.uk/pbs/research/...rty-affects-peoples-decision-making-processes

Poverty, Scarcity, and the Psychology of Decision-Making – UAB Institute for Human Rights Blog

sites.uab.edu