TF-X / KAAN / Hürjet Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircrafts News & Discussions

[MMM-E]

No country will share its core documentation and data with another country.

in 1990s Russia sent thousands of assembly manuals, engine calibration data, part tolerance tables and technical maintenance documents of the AL-31F Engine to China.

Chinese engineers used this official Russian data as a benchmark to bring the WS-10 up to military standards

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Your China is a copycat master .. nothing else
China copied American and Russian engines - technologies

You should mind to live track the progress of the KAAN and its turbofan engine.

However, often miscited China with bad/misleading references is really starting to get annoying.

No country in the world can become a superpower by solely relying on the copycat tactic.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

in 1990s Russia sent thousands of assembly manuals, engine calibration data, part tolerance tables and technical maintenance documents of the AL-31F Engine to China.

Chinese engineers used this official Russian data as a benchmark to bring the WS-10 up to military standards

In the 1990s, it was Ukraine, not Russia.

Russia has always remained vigilant on China even during its most China-dependent era.

China at best has accessed the sensible information of the USSR via Ukraine, but it was mostly aircraft carrier design and its shipborne aircraft T-10K which was the prototype of the Su-33.

The most Russian-derived weapons in the current Chinese inventory are the J-16/J-11B/J-15 which obviously have Russian origin.

We don't hide anything, but stop depriving the credit of our later era weapons to Russia which has nothing to do with them.

 

[Anatolia]

Dude, you are talking how Russia was babysitting China like teaching its own kids.

No country will share its core documentation and data with another country.

China has no successful joint project with Russia, even the civilian jet like the CR929 got botched up because Russia refused to share any sensible data with China. Let alone the data from the military jet engine.

I see you got a Chinese flag, so you're naturally going to defend your country China.
But here're some facts:

China’s WS‑15 timeline is roughly 15–18 years depending on where you start the clock. Early development began in the mid‑2000s, the first credible flight tests were in 2017, and operational integration happened in 2023. China did receive some material and metallurgy support from Russia, but the engine still took well over a decade to mature.

What makes Turkiye’s situation different is that it receives no engine technology transfers at all. No materials support, no turbine blade know‑how, no hot‑section metallurgy, no compressor IP, and no access to Western or Russian high‑temperature alloys(NYET). Despite that, Turkiye launched the TF35000 program from zero and has already completed core design, compressor testing, turbine testing, and material qualification. First ignition is approaching without any foreign assistance.

So while China needed 15–18 years with external help(Russia, remember), Turkiye is pushing a 5th‑gen engine program under full embargo conditions and still hitting milestones at a competitive pace. The hurdles are far higher, yet the progress is real.

Turkiye is doing something that's never been attempted before and winning.

 

[Deino]

Its not my post you stupid idiot
That was from a Turkish enginer named Oguzhan Uygun from X platform

keep crying you so-called MOD who said KAAN is an ultra nationalist fake propaganda project which can not even fly

Then it is he, who is stupid and you are stupid since you repost it for propaganda purpose! So i was right again ...

And by the way ... so far all big words and a lot of bragging! We all wait for first Kaan to fly with the TF35000 and if it will fly some day we will all congratulate, but until then Kaan is nothing more than a pepped-up Tejas-like project with lots of hype and stil far far far awy from an operational fighter with a functioning engine, that not even had its first test!

As such, sit down and relax .... and most of all, shut up with your insults by spreading lies and propaganda!

 

[Deino]

I see you got a Chinese flag, so you're naturally going to defend your country China.
But here're some facts:

China’s WS‑15 timeline is roughly 15–18 years depending on where you start the clock. Early development began in the mid‑2000s, the first credible flight tests were in 2017, and operational integration happened in 2023. China did receive some material and metallurgy support from Russia, but the engine still took well over a decade to mature.

What makes Turkiye’s situation different is that it receives no engine technology transfers at all. No materials support, no turbine blade know‑how, no hot‑section metallurgy, no compressor IP, and no access to Western or Russian high‑temperature alloys(NYET). Despite that, Turkiye launched the TF35000 program from zero and has already completed core design, compressor testing, turbine testing, and material qualification. First ignition is approaching without any foreign assistance.

So while China needed 15–18 years with external help(Russia, remember), Turkiye is pushing a 5th‑gen engine program under full embargo conditions and still hitting milestones at a competitive pace. The hurdles are far higher, yet the progress is real.

Turkiye is doing something that's never been attempted before and winning.

Pardon, that's all wrong ... first, the WS-15 had no "operational integration happened in 2023" and on the other side, some Turkish guys especially this forums propaganda minister is constantly spreading you have so much understanding in all relevant engine technologies since you were assembling US engines since years!

As such Turky surely did not start from Zero, while China got all from Russia ...

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

I see you got a Chinese flag, so you're naturally going to defend your country China.
But here're some facts:

China’s WS‑15 timeline is roughly 15–18 years depending on where you start the clock. Early development began in the mid‑2000s, the first credible flight tests were in 2017, and operational integration happened in 2023. China did receive some material and metallurgy support from Russia, but the engine still took well over a decade to mature.

What makes Turkiye’s situation different is that it receives no engine technology transfers at all. No materials support, no turbine blade know‑how, no hot‑section metallurgy, no compressor IP, and no access to Western or Russian high‑temperature alloys(NYET). Despite that, Turkiye launched the TF35000 program from zero and has already completed core design, compressor testing, turbine testing, and material qualification. First ignition is approaching without any foreign assistance.

So while China needed 15–18 years with external help(Russia, remember), Turkiye is pushing a 5th‑gen engine program under full embargo conditions and still hitting milestones at a competitive pace. The hurdles are far higher, yet the progress is real.

Turkiye is doing something that's never been attempted before and winning.

The turbine inlet of the WS-15 reached the threshold of 1850K almost a decade ago.

And it was the result of by multi-decades of effort done by China which was observed by many Chinese military observer including the non-Chinese ones like @Deino .

We respect and welcome if Turkiye can breakthrough in its own turbofan engine by making more progress.

However, it is very disrespectful by framing other people's hard work as copycat or IP theft.

Even the Americans are our biggest adversary, but we wouldn't resort disrespectful manner on their achievement.

 

[Anatolia]

Pardon, that's all wrong ... first, the WS-15 had no "operational integration happened in 2023" and on the other side, some Turkish guys especially this forums propaganda minister is constantly spreading you have so much understanding in all relevant engine technologies since you were assembling US engines since years!

As such Turky surely did not start from Zero, while China got all from Russia ...

My guy… assembling an American engine is not the same thing as receiving the IP for a 5th gen hot section.If bolting parts together gave you full knowledge transfer, IKEA would’ve produced a stealth fighter by now.

Turkiye isn’t getting anyone’s turbine tech, cooling tech, alloys, or blade geometry. No one is holding its hand.That’s exactly why the progress is impressive.

Unless you can prove me wrong?

Point about China.

I never said China got all engine tech from Russia. But they got a lot of lending hand from Russia though. Unlike say ..erm Turkiye.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

My guy… assembling an American engine is not the same thing as receiving the IP for a 5th gen hot section.If bolting parts together gave you full knowledge transfer, IKEA would’ve produced a stealth fighter by now.

Turkiye isn’t getting anyone’s turbine tech, cooling tech, alloys, or blade geometry. No one is holding its hand.That’s exactly why the progress is impressive.

Unless you can prove me wrong?

Point about China.

I never said China got all engine tech from Russia. But they got a lot of lending hand from Russia though. Unlike say ..erm Turkiye.

You cannot keep framing China as a copycat of Russia when China is superior to Russia in almost every domains including the 5/6th gen aircrafts and its engines.

Do you think how absurd to frame that Russia was devoted to make China overshadowing themselves in all domains? Do you believe that kind of nonsense crap?

China is the manufacturing hub of the world with the capacity of 20-30 times to that of Russia, and it also controls over 90% of the indispensable rare earth refinery of the world.

Russia cannot keep up with China's enormous manufacturing capability which causes them lagging in almost everything.

Even the US cannot keep up with China in the 6th gen aircraft race. Otherwise, the US would never allow China to be the frontrunner of the 6th gen aircraft.

So there is nothing of shame for Turkiye to dismantle/re-assemble the US engine since everyone has to start from scratch.

The turbofan engine is not something that you can master overnight but with multi-decades of data and cumulative experience.

China also had many decades of painful experience, but our team keeps persisting to overcome all barriers and hurdles as no one would truly come to help you.

 

[MMM-E]

Then it is he, who is stupid and you are stupid since you repost it for propaganda purpose! So i was right again ...

Turks never doing propaganda you stupid idiot
But you made anti-Turkiye propaganda , in 2019-2020 you said that KAAN is an ultra nationalist fake propaganda project which can not even fly

This is how we'll bring it to your butt, KAAN even made its first flight 2 years early

Nobody is crying here , except you and Chinese

 

[royalharris]

Turks never doing propaganda you stupid idiot
But you made anti-Turkiye propaganda , in 2019-2020 you said that KAAN is an ultra nationalist fake propaganda project which can not even fly

This is how we'll bring it to your butt, KAAN even made its first flight 2 years early

Nobody is crying here , except you and Chinese

Even copying takes skill.
Idiots like the Turks couldn't reproduce the engine even if you handed them one to copy piece for piece.

 

[royalharris]

That's why the U.S. is extremely cautious about exporting its most advanced technologies to China. They believe that once China gains access to them, it can reverse-engineer and reproduce them very quickly.
By contrast, they're much more comfortable exporting advanced technologies to Turkey because they assume the Turks lack the capability to replicate them, even if the technology is handed to them intact.
Because they believe Turks are naturally unintelligent.

 

[MMM-E]

In the 1990s, it was Ukraine, not Russia.

Russia has always remained vigilant on China even during its most China-dependent era.

That was Russia who produced AL-31F Engine

in 1995 , China finalized a major contract with Russia to acquire the license and production lines to build the SU-27 domestically

Russia sent thousands of assembly manuals, engine calibration data, part tolerance tables and technical maintenance documents of the AL-31F Engine to China

Chinese engineers used this official Russian data as a benchmark to bring the WS-10 up to military standards

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China was unable to design the afterburner, supersonic exhaust nozzles and fuel injection systems that it would add to the rear of the CFM56 core. To overcome this problem, it directly integrated and copied the rear components, mechanical designs and aerodynamic schemes of the AL-31F Engine imported from Russia into the WS-10 project.

even China copied TVC technology from AL-41F1S Engines on the SU-35 Fighter Jet that China purchased from Russia in 2015

 

[MMM-E]

Even copying takes skill.
Idiots like the Turks couldn't reproduce the engine even if you handed them one to copy piece for piece.

Only idiots can use copycat tactics like China
WS-10 Engine : American-Russian technology


We are a state governed by the rule of law that abides by international agreements; Turkiye not a closed communist regime like China

Despite the embargoes, Turkiye is developing its weapons without transferring or copying technology from anywhere. Yes, it takes some time, but ultimately, not a single project has failed.


Those idiots who come here and laugh at the KAAN and TF-35,000 projects... go laugh at Copycat China instead.

 

[Deino]

...
This is how we'll bring it to your butt, KAAN even made its first flight 2 years early
...

And since then? Two flights made by a demonstrator! That ugly thing is maybe at best comparable to the Dassault Rafale-D or BAe EAP back then, it's barely comparable to the J-20 demonstrators no. 2001 & 2002 from 20011/12 and made less flights than the two next generation fighters from China you are contsantly bashing!

Oh, and by the way, regaring these two flight ... it made to short flights - the first on 21 February 2024 for 13 minutes reaching a speed of 230 knots (426 km/h) at an altitude of 8,000 feet (2,438 m) and a second flight on 6 May 2024, reaching 10,000 feet (3,048 m) that lasted 14 minutes.

Not really impressive within two years!