The Case for Pakistan as a Civilizational State

[vasanthm]

Ummm how do you know it's continuation

Honestly hindu traditions as a phrase is amorphously defined, you guy's can worship in many ways

Fair question, that is why I gave specific examples. Vedic chanting involves ancient texts still being taught and recited. Koodiyattam has scripts and performance methods passed from teacher to student. UNESCO documents both.

Vedic chanting -
https://www.unesco.org/archives/multimedia/document-4671

Koodiyattam -
https://www.unesco.org/archives/multimedia/document-9

I’m not saying nothing changed. I’m saying we can trace what was passed down. Hindus worshipping in different ways doesn’t undo that.

 

[El Sidd]

Indeed, which is why people think what is today commonly called "urdu" started in the Dehli Sultunate. No wait it started in the Mughal Empire. No wait it started in....

It's inconsequential where it began.

 

[r3alist]

Fair question, that is why I gave specific examples. Vedic chanting involves ancient texts still being taught and recited. Koodiyattam has scripts and performance methods passed from teacher to student. UNESCO documents both.

Vedic chanting -
https://www.unesco.org/archives/multimedia/document-4671

Koodiyattam -
https://www.unesco.org/archives/multimedia/document-9

I’m not saying nothing changed. I’m saying we can trace what was passed down. Hindus worshipping in different ways doesn’t undo that.

So can the Spanish with Catholicism
It means you stayed static, minus the English you speak that you take pride in

It's amorphous, a little bit here and there

 

[r3alist]

 

[r3alist]

 

[Master Chief]

Ask a hundred hindus what Hinduism is...

And yet, they still claim Harappans were hindu saar.

 

[r3alist]

Ask a hundred hindus what Hinduism is...

And yet, they still claim Harappans were hindu saar.

They are literally learning their history as others teach and taught them

A covetous brahmin class to this day created a sub race in their own society and sucked up to whoever had power monopolising the benefits

How does that count as civilization if no one was part of it

 

[ThunderCat]

It's inconsequential where it began.

Since you & I weren't alive back then we go by the evidence. The poetic texts analyzed by Shirani & Bailey as well as other linguists and it's grammatical composition strongly indicate it descends from medieval Punjabi, with Khari influences plus other influences.

There is also no mention of "urdu" before Mashafi's time. Even Bharati sources who claim this language for themselves argue it to be from the Dehli Sultunate which was before the Mughal empire.

 

[ThunderCat]

Ask a hundred hindus what Hinduism is...

And yet, they still claim Harappans were hindu saar.

It's an English/British invention. Also unfortunately some Western Orientalist academicians are claiming Harrappans to be "hindu."

Brahman nationalists love to cite them on Wikipedia.

Each time I point out to Pakistani Muslim radicals online that "hinduism" is fictional they accuse me of being a "hindu" in disguise.

They need their imaginary enemy to exist in order to spur their hate.

 

[El Sidd]

Since you & I weren't alive back then we go by the evidence. The poetic texts analyzed by Shirani & Bailey as well as other linguists and it's grammatical composition strongly indicate it descends from medieval Punjabi, with Khari influences plus other influences.

There is also no mention of "urdu" before Mashafi's time. Even Bharati sources who claim this language for themselves argue it to be from the Dehli Sultunate which was before the Mughal empire.

well color me a more darker shade of informed on the subject

 

[mythbuster]

Don't understand this obsession with indus valley civilization , only the Dravidian can claim indus valley civilization.... Pakistan of today shares nothing with indus valley civilization other than geography.

 

[peacemaker99]

These type of articles should not refer to a "India" in the context of ancient civilizations of South Asia, as India did not exist until 1947.

It would be best to change the terminology to refer to "South Asia" instead as that is a more descriptive and valid description. In Europe, people refer to the history of individual countries, but there is no country named "Europe", never has been nor will there be.

Lets take that out of the discussion for ancient civilizational discussions, but there is shared history post the creation of "India".

( Good article btw ).

The concept of bharat varsha or akhand bharat has been in place for 1000s of years. It is a single civilization running for 1000s of years.

 

[r3alist]

The concept of bharat varsha or akhand bharat has been in place for 1000s of years. It is a single civilization running for 1000s of years.

Minus the kingdoms, invasions and caste systems that make it something for fairytales