China Can Beat the U.S. Air Force in a War

[Yommie]

Lol it's a multirole jet with stealth, J10 has no stealth capability

Stealth is unproven.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Stealth is unproven.

Only in your delusional mind, and than tell me why China developed J-20 and developing J35 if stealth jets are unproven lol

 

[Yommie]

Only in your delusional mind, and than tell me why China developed J-20 and developing J35 if stealth jets are unproven lol

It has less RCS but not good enough in modern warfare. Modern warfare is dominated by drones. Drones have far less RCS than manned jets.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

It has less RCS but not good enough in modern warfare. Modern warfare is dominated by drones. Drones have far less RCS than manned jets.

Drones have carry much less payloads than manned fighter jets as well as they have several limitations over manned fighter jets

 

[Yommie]

Drones have carry much less payloads than manned fighter jets as well as they have several limitations over manned fighter jets

Drones are controlled by AI network. Drones are far more efficient than man. Microchip is much faster than human brain.

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[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Drones are controlled by AI network. Drones are far more efficient than man. Microchip is much faster than human brain.

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AI is still in its infancy stage and tell me who design and develop microchip?

 

[Yommie]

AI is still in its infancy stage and tell me who design and develop microchip?

Earliest microchips were built in the US and the USSR in the 1970s.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Earliest microchips were built in the US and the USSR in the 1970s.

And its still not comparable to human brain and we will not able see all drones/UCAVs airforces in our lifetime its a long way to go

 

[Yommie]

And its still not comparable to human brain and we will not able see all drones/UCAVs airforces in our lifetime its a long way to go

Human brain is slow compared to microchip. Human brain takes milliseconds to work. Microchip takes microseconds to work. Drones slaughter manned jets.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Human brain is slow compared to microchip. Human brain takes milliseconds to work. Microchip takes microseconds to work. Drones slaughter manned jets.

Still not comparable to human brain whether it is faster than human brain, doesn't mean nothing

 

[BHAN85]

China is world leader in reverse engineering to copy Western machines.

And USA is world leader in lies, deceivements, arrogance, backstabbings and likely all their military hi tech hardware, including fighter jets, it has a zillion electronic backdoors to hack it remotely.

So maybe China someday could shot down whole USA air force with a few mouse clicks in electronic warfare. Maybe that day it has already happened.

Several Western fighter jets strange crashes happened last years.

 

[jzrmt]

Shanlung said:
Why is the silence on F35 so deafening now?
After the huzzahring and palm leaves waving and drum beating of F35s being build by the hundreds
Doing elephant walking or hippopotmust waddling
and giving out like cupcakes and pizzas to all USA brown nosers?

After the USA secretary of air admitted less than a third of F35s actually operational

F35 Operational Status of less than 33%​

@RepMattGaetz BREAKING: U.S. Air Force Secretary ADMITS that less than a third of F-35s built by Lockheed Martin are operationally capable!The Pentagon has given too much power to the defense contractors that are bilking American taxpayers. It’s not going to get better unless we demand...

We find SILENCE SILENCE AND LESS THAN A SQUEAK (OTHER THAN SOME RUBBISH ABOUT ZIONIST NAZIS WANTING TO USE F35 TO NUKE IRAN WITH EMPS)

Israel initially wanted to do an EMP Attack on Iran with a Nuclear Weapon from F35epe Escobar​

Pepe Escobar: Russia and Iran Brace for War as Leaked Israeli F-35 Attack SHOCKS World What do you guys think?

LESS THAN A THIRD CAN EVEN MEAN JUST 10% OF F35S BEING OPERATIONAL AND ABLE TO FLY.
MUCH MORE A LEMON THAN SOMETHING TO FRIGHTEN FOLKS WITH

PROBABLY AS USEFUL AS THE PATRIOT AND THAAD RUBBISH RIYADH PAID TO PROTECT AND FAIL TO PROTECT OIL INSTALLATIONS IN KSA

And as demonstrated so clearly in KSA the Aegis and Patriot systems defending Saudi a joke as the Aegis and Patriot cannot even detect a few sub Mach cruise missiles not to talk of taking them down. Even to now, no one sure where those came from and who flown them. Despite overlapping coverage of those Patriot and Aegis systems.

And now easy peasy and no sweat in taking out Mach 3 missiles effortlessly out of Ukraine sky

The American systems dunno where the slow poke missiles came from and if missiles did not go off with bangs leaving smoke and fire, might not even have existed at all

New sales pitch? US makes the world’s ‘finest’ anti-air systems, but sometimes they just don’t work, Pompeo explains
Saudi air defenses like Patriot & Aegis don’t match their advertised properties, unfit for real combat – Russian Army (MAP)

 

[Persian Gulf]

depends where the war is fought

in or near China? then China has the advantage

anywhere else, the USA has the advantage

 

[GoMig-21]

After the USA secretary of air admitted less than a third of F35s actually operational

F35 Operational Status of less than 33%​

That X post manipulated the title to make it sound a lot worst than it really is. When they say "the F-35's operational status is less than 33% of the total fleet" makes it sound like the rest of the other 67% is completely non-operational which is completely false.

The truth is that out of the total number of the F-35s built to date, only 33% of them have "Full Operationally Capability," meaning all their systems are working to their fullest and not just most of them. That's a big difference. In other words, the other 67% (it's actually 71% to be more accurate) are not performing at their "FULL" capability and still have some systems within the aircraft that are still not working. Doesn't mean they're hangar queens.

 

[Nilgiri]

Hahaha, one has to hand it to China, though. Not saying you're not doing that, I just think that too many have the tendency to dismiss any potential foe to the mighty United States military and in many cases, rightfully so. A practically unlimited budget with some of the most brilliant minds on earth is an almost unbeatable combination. Why the US is at the forefront of nearly every technological & industrial field. But to the basically knowledgeable individual, it's not too difficult to see that China has its own qualities and advantages and has risen to superpower level and in many ways surpassed Russia not so much a belligerent threat to the United States, but as a competitive.

Unfortunately, some of that threat conception is taken and used to propagate the military industrial concept exactly for that reason. The MIC lobby can't use Russia so much anymore, like it used to extensively during the cold war and for much of the time after. But now China has taken that spot.

You look at how quickly they developed and put the J-20 into operation it's remarkable. Unabashedly reverse-engineering or copying or basically doing whatever it had to in order to get it done, and boy did it ever.

The Su-57 is hardly a threat to the USAF anymore not because of its threat level, but because of that aircraft's developmental stagnation, if it can be called that. It's taken too long to develop the engine (similar to the demise of the MiG-35 and its issues with the AESA radar). Taken too long to get the production line rolling. Too many instances where it's faced criticism and never put up a fight or counter that criticism in any meaningful way.

Then you have the J-20 which exploded out of nowhere and onto the scene and took over 1st place to its Russian counterpart. Almost like the favored track runner in first place at the Olympics coming around the last corner and suddenly some Chinese dude who started in last place catches up to him and passes him to the finish line lol. Because of all that, the Su-57's threat level to the F-22 or even the F-35 is nowhere near that of the J-20, at least on paper anyway.

And if the F-22 or F-35 -- and particularly the NGAD -- need funding from Congress, then the J-20 and the China threat need to be played to get paid.

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This is the new age we're at now. Long gone are the days of moving from 4th generation fighters to the new concept of stealth and so on. It's all about hyper technology advancement, sensor fusion, counter stealth and unmanned concepts.

And an aerial battle between China and the US even at this stage of the game would be something out of this world. The problem the US would find itself in is that it might not have enough advanced platforms between both, the Raptors and the F-35s to go up against China's J-20s, so it would be forced to bring in its F-15s, F-16s and F/A-18s. At the same time, we really don't know how good the J-20 is since we have no samples to go by like we do with the Raptor and F-35s. Or even the F-15s, 16s & 18s vs J-10Bs & Cs, J-9s & J-11s. It would be a dream to watch, especially with all the visual recording technology available today.

If you study modern China, its case of a grievous non-virtuous highly immoral extreme-statist contraption imposed for a very large duration of the 20th century (and ongoing in its various ways)....that has only introduced a number of virtuous cycles nested inside it after the major perpetrator of the former one passed away.....the person that justified and even praised the Japanese doing what they did to the Chinese nation, simply because it brought him to power in his immoral depraved zero-sum extremist statist thinking. While the Soviets went out of their way to hold Stalin's excesses to some account afterwards, no such thing has been done in the PRC regarding its cult image dude.

The US, on the other hand, in this same juncture of time had cultivated a larger virtuous system (through a number of trial and tribulations from the era before it) and now nests a number of non-virtuous cycles by way of number of reasons (but the very nature of this addressal systematically is also magnitudes lower than the problem that confronts China by having it other way around).

Really its best discussed in the book thread, you can quote this post there if you want to continue....as largely I lose interest in most other sections of the forum unless a worthy or friend tags me like you have.

But really the force levels, and that too just the Airforce alone have to be understood through this larger prism of context first.

As to the importance of things like mobilisation + war experience rather than schrodinger reliant goosestepping, posturing and brochures. There are huge pitfalls of FAFO when this is indulged as it is by the Chinese statist model as seen in 1979 Vietnam notably, when the boxes were best left unopened as the cats were all clearly dead given the objectives and investments of that real war....rather than whichever one the planners had convinced themselves on paper. Similar to the experience Russia has had with Ukraine in its own way right now (on paper Russia convinced itself of a great many things that simply didnt pan out).

This impacts everything in the schrodinger strategy since too, as say @gambit can tell you with the J-20 quite specifically (among other technologies)....or @j_hungary more broadly w.r.t modern China itself.

Till there is a revolution that re-orients the "extreme-statism" first, the mainland component of the Chinese nation is slaved and stockholm syndromed to the CCP and its grievous legacy and unaccountability on it.....and the doom already imposed in long term ways with the severe baked in demographic crunch or the continued festering of SOE and real estate ponzi w.r.t "labour theory of value" approaches enveloping, clouding and burdening what China has progressed on since the Mao era.

Anyway its best dicussed in the other thread. So yeah I will sympathise with some aspects of the Chinese nation and the virtuous cycles allowed some living room and time now compared to before......but the state is a completely different inverted contraption and continues to be the nationstates borrowed time doom.

In any case it also needs someone further up the ladder from even the statist edifice to be here on this forum..... not the commiebot types that permeate instead with the stale one-liners and propaganda spiel. Like Han told the Hutt, next time come yourself, dont send one of these punks....