PTI freedom movement against Judiciary and Establishment: News, Discussion & Updates

[VCheng]

I think Pakistan is unlikely to become next Bangladesh for two reasons

1) Our people have a fake sense of self-pride but in reality most of them don’t want to lead any revolution

2) The economy is gradually improving and the situation is much better than 2023 or 2024.

In 2023 and early 2024, I feared people will commit suicide as the situation was so bad but now I spoke to the business community and they seems to be doing alright

Agreed. Mostly talk and very little walk means any journey will take a long, long, long time to complete.

 

[SaadH]

if student movement accelerated then it will be a big problem with pakistani jarnails

Dehli, home to their handlers, is a short flight away...nothing to worry about.

 

[krash]

Yeah, we need to be indifferent to whatever happens in our society like usual. Girl got raped? Come on TV and say it didn't even happen. Best.

I agree, anything short of burning things down in mob attacks obviously tantamounts to indifference. Especially when it's an educational institute, God knows we have too many of those.

We should also all gather at Minto Park and slap ourselves a few hundred times in unison. It will not only make the same amount of sense but will also have the exact same chance of providing justice to the victim and the degenerates. Most importantly, it will allow us an excuse to not do what actually needs to be done.

 

[SteppeWolff]

I agree, anything short of burning things down in mob attacks obviously tantamounts to indifference.

Yes mob attacks usually happen when Police comes with metal rods and tear gas shells. Then things tend to burn cause of the opposition from the other side.

it will allow us an excuse to not do what actually needs to be done.

And what is that exactly? Police DSP bringing a guy on TV as the father of that girl when he ain't even the father? And the girl who they say fell from stairs is actually a different girl? Or CM of a state turning the mic off a girl in Middle of Press Conference?

Pakistan has the law of jungle man, no due process to get justice. Mobs and protests is the only thing students can do, certainly better than keyboard warriors.

 

[krash]

Agreed. Mostly talk and very little walk means any journey will take a long, long, long time to complete.

I know this will sound like out of a 15 year old emo 's diary, but Pakistanis will need a few successive generations to go through an entire era of true desperation before they're able to produce a generation that is even willing to self-reflect. No guarantees after that either.

Yes mob attacks usually happen when Police comes with metal rods and tear gas shells. Then things tend to burn cause of the opposition from the other side.

Not necessarily. No civilized/sensible group will burn their own things down. The very existence of this country is based on exactly such a sensible movement. And our current state is the result of exactly its absence.

And what is that exactly? Police DSP bringing a guy on TV as the father of that girl when he ain't even the father? And the girl who they say fell from stairs is actually a different girl? Or CM of a state turning the mic off a girl in Middle of Press Conference?

Pakistan has the law of jungle man, no due process to get justice. Mobs and protests is the only thing students can do, certainly better than keyboard warriors.

I understand you're angry and that is how it should be. But surely you can realize that burning things down only serves to placate your own personal feelings and will achieve nothing for the victim, the rapist, or his enablers. Neither will it stop this from happening again.

There is no quick fix to our state. The changes need to be systemic and intrinsically rooted in the common populace. Rape and Police's corruption, are both not coming from the top. The top is the result of the rotten bottom. Specifically against Rape, along with peaceful protests, we can start by 1) not blaming the victims, 2) empowering and supporting them, and 3) educating our kids on how a woman has to be treated. Surely, you've heard some of the things said about women by people around you? It starts from there and ends with a polio worker being gangraped and then thrown out on the street by her husband for disgracing him. Many more never report it because what follows after is usually worse than the rape itself. That is saying something. Let's not sit here and pretend that this problem and all the others are caused by external forces. The lawlessness, for example, can only be countered with a broad spectrum tarbiyat of our children, which will include not burning things down and mob violence. After that the students will realize that the other option they have is to refuse to be a part of the status quo when it's their time.

 

[SteppeWolff]

Not necessarily. No civilized/sensible group will burn their own things down. The very existence of this country is based on exactly such a sensible movement. And our current sate is the result of exactly its absence.

Can you really blame students for doing that?

The first protest was peaceful, students ( both girls&boys ) in their respective campuses protesting with placards and loud slogans. Did the govt really had to send Police with metal rods and tear gas? I myself saw 2 traffic wardens taking 4 solid steel rods with em on their 70 to F up 17-18 year old dudes brev.

 

[krash]

Can you really blame students for doing that?

The first protest was peaceful, students ( both girls&boys ) in their respective campuses protesting with placards and loud slogans. Did the govt really had to send Police with metal rods and tear gas? I myself saw 2 traffic wardens taking 4 solid steel rods with em on their 70 to F up 17-18 year old dudes brev.

I don't blame them but we cannot also condone it. May Allah protect them and give the rest of us enough ghairat to go stand by them. And then also give us all the sense to not succumb to the same idiotic and typically Pakistani mentality when pursuing what is right, however rare that may be. If the change is to come, it will come through our students and exactly because of this we need to make sure that they are steered right and not veered off track by the opposing forces or our society's MO.

If the students resort to violence, the authorities will have every excuse to come down harder on them until they, inevitably, disperse. Whatever little that can be gained will all then be lost.

 

[SteppeWolff]

If the students resort to violence, the authorities will have every excuse to come down harder on them until they, inevitably, disperse. Whatever little that can be gained will all then be lost.

I understand and get where you coming from bro but we are dealing with Gullu butts, Jagga Gujjur type of people in the form of police and government.

Abusing, Lathi charge, shelling on students, unprovoked. I might have believed that students are somewhat on wrong but I myself experienced this, I was coming black from my Uni, passing through Muslim Town Morr in Lahore on ferozepur road ( location of main campus 10 of PGC ), 6-7 Prison vans, battalion of Police guys with danday, stopped there to see what's going on and next thing I know is a policeman who approaches me and says," Danday pen laggay na ona nu, aedro turr ja tenu wi boht pen gay". Wtf ? Is this how law enforcement is supposed to be?

There's only 2 ways, protest which will get chaotic eventually cause of state machinery's incitement or the other way is to just sit at home. I choose the first one.

 

[VCheng]

I know this will sound like out of a 15 year old emo 's diary, but Pakistanis will need a few successive generations to go through an entire era of true desperation before they're able to produce a generation that is even willing to self-reflect. No guarantees after that either.

I have been saying the same thing for more than a decade here, to no avail:

THERE ARE NO SHORTCUTS TO CREATING A CIVILIZED SOCIETY.

But no one wants to put in the actual hard effort over the several decades needed to put this society back on a proper track.

The worst are those that claim to have the magic quick fixes to everything to mislead the gullible, and they are the ones that rule the roost here too, just like in Pakistan.

 

[عقاب]

They always saw it coming and feared the uprising of students. There is a reason for prohibition of student associations long time ago, the way forward is reformation of student organizations who are critical enough to not accept compromised person as their leaders. Now is a time when Constructive and reforming way of leadership can be installed in students all across country and punjabi and kpk students taking lead, basically this will serve as the wakeup call for the entire generations of students, whose potential was useless since decades.

 

[Cash gk]

There is a confirmed report of Imran Khan being tortured . A source from the prison revealed that he is being subjected to inhumane treatment.

 

[Mr X]

How many times do I need to explain to you these are political threads and goes into Pakistani sections. I have to keep moving them away from Internal security

This is old news and already debunked by PTI Chairman confirming he is physically fit and did an exercise for about an hour about 3 days ago.

 

[Cash gk]

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[Cash gk]

,
Avoid the company of sycophants whose flattery serves only their personal interests. Their narrow, self-serving mindset is weakening not only the institution but also Pakistan itself. These advisors, after every failure, encourage the use of more force. However, the continuous and blind use of force has eroded the fear it once commanded, turning it into a cycle of oppression and brutality with diminishing results.
As a student of history and politics, I must remind you that similar advisors led to General Musharraf’s downfall. Musharraf, once comfortably seated in the presidency, sought to remain in uniform for life. His advisors frightened him into believing that the Supreme Court would not allow this, prompting him to take a disastrous decision out of fear: the imposition of emergency on November 3, 2007, and an attack on the judiciary. This marked the beginning of his downfall as everything collapsed around him. He faced arrest, trial for violating the constitution, and a death sentence. Musharraf ended his days in exile, living miserably in a two-room apartment, far from the power he once wielded. His advisors, who pushed him to such measures, fled, leaving him to suffer alone.
Had General Musharraf not imposed an emergency and attacked the judiciary, his exit could have been more honourable and peaceful. Instead, his actions widened the rift between the military and the public, creating a mountain of hatred that took over 12 years of painstaking effort to heal. In his era, military officers were so wary of public perception that they stopped wearing uniforms in public and used private license plates on official vehicles. The painstaking efforts to restore the bond between the public and the military were undone by General Bajwa’s policies and the “Power Doctrine” that you continue, deepening the divide between the people and the military.
The new generation of Pakistanis, unfamiliar with the past, witnessed the oppressive power of the military, security, and intelligence agencies for the first time. Mothers, sisters, daughters, and elderly parents were dragged from their homes, humiliated, and dishonored. Their scarves were ripped off, their clothes torn apart, and videos of these abuses circulated widely. Political opponents were subjected to mass imprisonment, with charges of sedition and treason brought against them. Rather than restoring order, these actions only fuelled greater hatred towards the military.

In the past, the public revered the military, considering it a guarantor of security and peace. People willingly vacated their homes and lands, trusting the military’s intentions as protectors of Pakistan’s interests. However, under your leadership, this sacred bond has been shattered. The power doctrine you have carried forward has destroyed the military’s image, reopening old wounds and undoing decades of goodwill.

General Asim Munir, your legacy of cruelty paints you as an occupier rather than a protector of your people. Your policies have left deep scars on the nation. Thousands of innocent civilians have been labelled traitors and jailed, fuelling a reign of terror that reflects your relentless desire for control.
These actions have eroded the public’s trust in the military, transforming the army from a protector to an enforcer of oppression. The people no longer see the military as a source of security but as a tool of suppression. Your power doctrine has done irreparable damage to the relationship between the military and the public, and this is no longer an issue solely concerning Imran Khan. The policies of the last two and a half years have made this a national crisis.
This brutal legacy, which you continue to build, echoes that of General Musharraf, who, under bad advice, made decisions that ultimately led to his destruction. If you truly believe that power and authority come from Allah, as I’m sure you do, then rise above earthly fears and think with complete faith about the future of Pakistan and its people. The military cannot continue to serve personal or political interests. It must return to its role as a national institution, loved and respected by the people, not feared.
The power doctrine of General Bajwa and General Nadeem Anjum is dead. They are gone, and their oppressive ideology should die with them. It is now up to you to review the situation and lead the military and ISI from a power doctrine to a doctrine of love. Learn from the wisdom of your ancestors and pull Pakistan’s people and the military out of this quagmire.
Lastly, and most importantly, reveal the killers of martyr Arshad Sharif. Only through such measures can you begin to heal the deep wounds inflicted on this nation.

Pakistan Zindabad.

 

[Cash gk]