Iranian Chill Thread

[tsunset]

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358 the return

 

[Tehrani021]

So you are saying that we shouldn't mess with anyone who can attack us disproportionately? Then what's stopping Israel or US now from attacking us directly if they feel they need to? What will happen the next time we try another Abqaiq? You think the Saudis wont respond?

This only shows that Mossad or whoever can do whatever they want against us and we will retaliate against Syria, Iraq and Pakistan (not anymore though). A terrible message to send.

You are the one that needs a reality check here, An attack on Iran is an attack on Iran, it doesn't matter where it happens. No country with any shred of self-respect will tolerate another country bombing them with jets under the excuse of "its ok, they attacked an unimportant area, and none of our soldiers died anyways"

They flew into our airspace and bombed us. Why are you trying to play it down like nothing happened. What's stopping Turkey from doing the same thing in Northwestern Iran and say "We didn't attack Iran, we attacked Kurdish terrorists"

If what you say is true, then Pakistan wouldn't have retaliated, but they did because we crossed their red line, which we apparently do not have.


First of all, you should ask yourself who is benefiting from all the smuggling. If the border is such a big deal, how about we do something about it on our side of the border? How about doing something against the backers and funders of these terrorist groups? You think they will run out of new terrorists to recruit? I can give you the answer for free; it's "no"

I may not have the best solutions, but it is very easy to see that launching the attacks was a grave mistake that will come to haunt us in the future.

Where did I say "we shouldn't mess"? Killing their operatives and proxies in the region where they operate is a good amount of messing that Iran can do. Yes I'd love Iran, as well as the biorzeh Arab and Pakistanis, to attack directly, but the reality is we are not there yet to do that level of messing. A half decent airforce and a nuclear deterrence is vital imho.

Well if these nations are allowing Israel to do their dirty work from their lands then they share some responsibility and they can hardly complain when their sovereignty gets violated. How many times did Iran ask Iraq to clean up the mess in Erbil? Same with Pakistan? Come on where are your red lines? Seems you'd either sit on your hands, capitulate and do nothing or do a suicide mission against Israel or US when our forces aren't ready like a fool, you clearly are extremist in your methodology either way you look at it.

No country with a shred of self respect would allow an enclave like Balochistan to exist while terrorists are in broad daylight practicing assassinations! Im sure if this was the case in those nations who you have respect for there would be a zero tolerance attitude. There would be cooperation and those terrorists would be allowed to be established like that. So stop comparing apples with oranges.

If Kurds kept attacking Turkey from Iranian soil and Iran did sweet f all about it then Turkey has a right to act. Why should they tolerate it. See how nationalism has blinded you to see the real threats and understand the concerns of your neighbour?

Well if they were upset merely over sovereignty issues it's more of an insight into how backwards their priorities are. Of course they would retaliate! They are happy for terrorists to kill Iranians and Iran should show restraint and drink tea with them endlessly while nothing gets resolved. Dont be so naive.

It's clear you have no solution, or are going to extremes which actually would hurt Iran even more. There is no doubt Israel and west are responsible so I dont see how Iran is going to stop them financing them. But that is no reason for Iran to do nothing. Iran has lost enough men trying to fight terrorists on our side, but Pakistan has done nothing against the anti-Iran groups operating there they focus only focus on the ones that threaten them. Watch how Pakistan will do nothing to help the situation by continuing their stalling tactics and more Iranians will get killed, but it seems you dont care.

 

[SecularNationalist]

We should fully corporate to eliminate these terrorists on our boarder sides and don't let these sandal wearing terrorists make unwanted tensions between us

We need to fully root out terrorism in both countries (especially boarder areas) by making one especial force from two countries

I second that.
But bro you must accept that the initial extreme step taken by Iran towards a friendly brother Islamic country pakistan was highly irresponsible and arrogant.
We are not supposed to storm the house of our neighbor without telling him what he is doing wrong to us.

 

[Tehrani021]

I second that.
But bro you must accept that the initial extreme step taken by Iran towards a friendly brother Islamic country pakistan was highly irresponsible and arrogant.
We are not supposed to storm the house of our neighbor without telling him what he is doing wrong to us.

Please dont try to make out nothing wrong has happened from your soil. We targetted terrorists who have been observed by drones flying into your territory, and you have done nothing to stop them after years of pleading for you to take action. Did you want an ultimatum like we gave Iraq?

 

[mangekyo]

Where did I say "we shouldn't mess"? Killing their operatives and proxies in the region where they operate is a good amount of messing that Iran can do. Yes I'd love Iran, as well as the biorzeh Arab and Pakistanis, to attack directly, but the reality is we are not there yet to do that level of messing. A half decent airforce and a nuclear deterrence is vital imho.

Well if these nations are allowing Israel to do their dirty work from their lands then they share some responsibility and they can hardly complain when their sovereignty gets violated. How many times did Iran ask Iraq to clean up the mess in Erbil? Same with Pakistan? Come on where are your red lines? Seems you'd either sit on your hands, capitulate and do nothing or do a suicide mission against Israel or US when our forces aren't ready like a fool, you clearly are extremist in your methodology either way you look at it.

No country with a shred of self respect would allow an enclave like Balochistan to exist while terrorists are in broad daylight practicing assassinations! Im sure if this was the case in those nations who you have respect for there would be a zero tolerance attitude. There would be cooperation and those terrorists would be allowed to be established like that. So stop comparing apples with oranges.

If Kurds kept attacking Turkey from Iranian soil and Iran did sweet f all about it then Turkey has a right to act. Why should they tolerate it. See how nationalism has blinded you to see the real threats and understand the concerns of your neighbour?

Well if they were upset merely over sovereignty issues it's more of an insight into how backwards their priorities are. Of course they would retaliate! They are happy for terrorists to kill Iranians and Iran should show restraint and drink tea with them endlessly while nothing gets resolved. Dont be so naive.

It's clear you have no solution, or are going to extremes which actually would hurt Iran even more. There is no doubt Israel and west are responsible so I dont see how Iran is going to stop them financing them. But that is no reason for Iran to do nothing. Iran has lost enough men trying to fight terrorists on our side, but Pakistan has done nothing against the anti-Iran groups operating there they focus only focus on the ones that threaten them. Watch how Pakistan will do nothing to help the situation by continuing their stalling tactics and more Iranians will get killed, but it seems you dont care.

Brother, look. I share your concern. I am only saying exposing ourselves like this will hurt us more in the long game than what we will benefit from it. That is all.

 

[Tehrani021]

Brother, look. I share your concern. I am only saying exposing ourselves like this will hurt us more in the long game than what we will benefit from it. That is all.

Give me solutions of what we should do not what we shouldn't do.

 

[mangekyo]

Give me solutions of what we should do not what we shouldn't do.

Baluchistan region is the least developed region in all of Iran, and surprise surprise, its the region causing us the most problems. Resorting only to bombing them doesn't work. It will only make it easier for foreign agents to exploit them and recruit them as terrorists. We need to target the root of the problem, which is radicalisation as an effect of poverty, lack of economic opportunities and poor living standards. People are less likely to become radicalised and recruited by terrorist groups when they are educated, employed and have something to live for.

We can set up anti radicalisation programs and invest more in infrastructure, education, healthcare, job creation, and economic opportunities. Improving access to education can play a significant role in countering their extremist ideologies. Healthcare can contribute to their wellbeing. That should help tackling our problems from within. But we also need to allocate more assets to the border and invest in better counter terrorism task forces, they can't hurt us from the other side if they can't cross our border.

For what it's worth, I am not a politician, it's not my job to come up with solutions. But so far, what our politicians have done hasn't worked. As long as we are not tackling the root of the problem, they will continue to breed, become radicalised and foreign agents will continue to recruit them as terrorists.

 

[Tehrani021]

Baluchistan region is the least developed region in all of Iran, and surprise surprise, its the region causing us the most problems. Resorting only to bombing them doesn't work. It will only make it easier for foreign agents to exploit them and recruit them as terrorists. We need to target the root of the problem, which is radicalisation as an effect of poverty, lack of economic opportunities and poor living standards. People are less likely to become radicalised and recruited by terrorist groups when they are educated, employed and have something to live for.

We can set up anti radicalisation programs and invest more in infrastructure, education, healthcare, job creation, and economic opportunities. Improving access to education can play a significant role in countering their extremist ideologies. Healthcare can contribute to their wellbeing. That should help tackling our problems from within. But we also need to allocate more assets to the border and better counter terrorism task forces, they can't hurt us from the other side if they can't cross our border.

For what it's worth, I am not a politician, it's not my job to come up with solutions. But so far, what our politicians have done hasn't worked. As long as we are not tackling the root of the problem, they will continue to breed, become radicalised and foreign agents will continue to recruit them as terrorists.

So if you have no solution and are incapable of coming with anything practical, then it's better leave it to the decision makers or those who have some knowledge.

I like your first paragraph as a long term solution, but I dont see how that will deweaponise the region which is what's causing the killing. There has to be a military solution as well as a long term solution, otherwise we give in to the terrorists and they win. Not everyone is desirous of a good life, some want power and will do anything to get it. I am beginning to think that Pakistan is not a credible partner in this and may even be making the situation worse, so we have to guard the border and use more of our attack drones. I couldn't help but wonder seeing all those drones take pictures so easily of the terrorists, had they been armed drones then they could be easily taken out.

You also have to remember, these people dont want modernity or the development youre thinking. They are set in their way and will always see the Iranian government as an enemy because of sectarianism and will look for a way to fight it. You cant just deradicalise people like that even if you do something drastic like the Chinese are doing with the Uyghurs which is abhorrent.

 

[Cthulhu]

Well, We have seen one of the modern day Mullahs' fetishes in action, The fetish of having "Eghtedar", Don't know what the exact English equivalent of "Eghtedar" is, It think it's like having "Absolute power" or something, And what happened in the past 3 days is the direct outcome of this fetish.

 

[mangekyo]

So if you have no solution and are incapable of coming with anything practical, then it's better leave it to the decision makers or those who have some knowledge.

I like your first paragraph as a long term solution, but I dont see how that will deweaponise the region which is what's causing the killing. There has to be a military solution as well as a long term solution, otherwise we give in to the terrorists and they win. Not everyone is desirous of a good life, some want power and will do anything to get it. I am beginning to think that Pakistan is not a credible partner in this and may even be making the situation worse, so we have to guard the border and use more of our attack drones. I couldn't help but wonder seeing all those drones take pictures so easily of the terrorists, had they been armed drones then they could be easily taken out.

You also have to remember, these people dont want modernity or the development youre thinking. They are set in their way and will always see the Iranian government as an enemy because of sectarianism and will look for a way to fight it. You cant just deradicalise people like that even if you do something drastic like the Chinese are doing with the Uyghurs which is abhorrent.

If you don't agree with my solutions, then what would you suggest we do then, bomb Pakistan into submission until they give in and fix their side of the border? What about our side of the border? We have issues from within too.

What we have done so far doesn't work. Can we at least agree on that?

 

[Tehrani021]

If you don't agree with my solutions, then what would you suggest we do then, bomb Pakistan into submission until they give in and fix their side of the border? What about our side of the border? We have issues from within too.

What we have done so far doesn't work. Can we at least agree on that?

I am actually happy with what Iran did, and they need to now bolster the security of our eastern border against not only terrorists but also a so called sovereign state who turns a blind eye to terrorists on their border. I think our response has been too restrained before this, especially with Taleban and Balochis, and has emboldened these terrorists. Pakistan can choose to be a partner in this, but we know they won't so if it means that we have to deal with their protection of terrorists Iran has to be ready.

 

[313Ghazi]

Please dont try to make out nothing wrong has happened from your soil. We targetted terrorists who have been observed by drones flying into your territory, and you have done nothing to stop them after years of pleading for you to take action. Did you want an ultimatum like we gave Iraq?

You keep talking about the border like you guys don't also control the same border? Assume for a second the Pakistani side is a complete flop and don't care about the border - what are you doing? Why haven't you mined/fenced/manned the border on your side entirely?

Truth is on both sides, the people responsible for securing that particular border are getting rich off of human trafficking, drug smuggling and oil smuggling. Whatever the border guards take to turn a blind eye gets kicked upstairs to their seniors too. There is no way this border would remain so porous despite both countries constantly complaining about the security threats, if so much money was not being made.

The corruption in your security services is as much responsible for this as anyone. Iranian govt anger at Pakistan is a deflection tactic, when they should look in house.

It is common knowledge in Pakistan that the people responsible for our border security are corrupt. Look at the level of Iranian diesel being smuggled.

Iranian diesel captures 25pc local market, says S&P

Fuel oil consumption plunges 83pc to just 70,000 tonnes from a year earlier while diesel sales drop 50pc YoY.

www.dawn.com

Fortunes are being made by politicians and Generals alike.

 

[313Ghazi]

Give me solutions of what we should do not what we shouldn't do.

I think Pakistan AND Iran both need the same solutions in Balochistan.

1. Both have to admit the corruption of their security forces who allow the huge smuggling across the border.

2. Both have to re-build the security personnel and the facilities on the border to keep it secure. The only way to cross should be legal crossing points.

3. Both need to develop the population of the areas, and build infrastructure/jobs for them. People who have jobs and hopes, don't take up weapons.

 

[SecularNationalist]

Please dont try to make out nothing wrong has happened from your soil. We targetted terrorists who have been observed by drones flying into your territory, and you have done nothing to stop them after years of pleading for you to take action. Did you want an ultimatum like we gave Iraq?

The same applies to you.
You have done nothing to stop terror outfits like BLA. Even that indian terrorist kulbushan yadav was launched from Iran.
But we didn't attack on irani soil.
Pakistan is not a country who takes any ultimatum from a country like Iran. Talk to us like friends in a proper way and we will deal with you like friends. If you will behave like an enemy we will treat you like one.
Show your little muscles to Iraq or Syria we don't care.

 

[Tehrani021]

You keep talking about the border like you guys don't also control the same border? Assume for a second the Pakistani side is a complete flop and don't care about the border - what are you doing? Why haven't you mined/fenced/manned the border on your side entirely?

Truth is on both sides, the people responsible for securing that particular border are getting rich off of human trafficking, drug smuggling and oil smuggling. Whatever the border guards take to turn a blind eye gets kicked upstairs to their seniors too. There is no way this border would remain so porous despite both countries constantly complaining about the security threats, if so much money was not being made.

The corruption in your security services is as much responsible for this as anyone. Iranian govt anger at Pakistan is a deflection tactic, when they should look in house.

It is common knowledge in Pakistan that the people responsible for our border security are corrupt. Look at the level of Iranian diesel being smuggled.

Iranian diesel captures 25pc local market, says S&P

Fuel oil consumption plunges 83pc to just 70,000 tonnes from a year earlier while diesel sales drop 50pc YoY.

www.dawn.com

Fortunes are being made by politicians and Generals alike.

What are WE doing about YOUR side of the border?! We send BMs into your territory, after your side is incapable of dealing with the terrorists as you just admitted and majority of the attacks are coming from your end...after decades of pleading to Pakistan to cooperate and sort your side of the border, which I think was too long of a wait personally.

There is no evidence of Iranian security guards having corruption like that, please share of any such cases if I'm wrong. I think you are mistaking Pakistani guards who are more susceptible to corruption and assuming Iranians are the same. The border is pourous because of weaponisation which for sure is coming from Pakistan and Afghanistan, and their side business is what makes them the money. Furthermore, Pakistan is an ally of America and the west, so I can't rule out rougue elements in your secret services getting money from state backers to allow this to happen to counter Iran and keep it destabilised.

I think Pakistan AND Iran both need the same solutions in Balochistan.

1. Both have to admit the corruption of their security forces who allow the huge smuggling across the border.

2. Both have to re-build the security personnel and the facilities on the border to keep it secure. The only way to cross should be legal crossing points.

3. Both need to develop the population of the areas, and build infrastructure/jobs for them. People who have jobs and hopes, don't take up weapons.

1) corruption is primarily from your side as discussed above.

2) agreed and joint patrols, anti-terror strikes with drones and jets, and generally using thst military might that we keep hearing about on those who are training assassinations in broad daylight!

3) in theory this is good, but culturally Balochi people enjoy living that way and don't want to change except a few. Also sanctions get in the way due to Pakistans lack of sovereignty when it comes to obeying US. So isnt easy.

But cooperation is needed with action, not the empty words we've been used to the past few decades.

The same applies to you.
You have done nothing to stop terror outfits like BLA. Even that indian terrorist kulbushan yadav was launched from Iran.
But we didn't attack on irani soil.
Pakistan is not a country who takes any ultimatum from a country like Iran. Talk to us like friends in a proper way and we will deal with you like friends. If you will behave like an enemy we will treat you like one.
Show your little muscles to Iraq or Syria we don't care.

Iran has been doing way more to combat terrorism on our end, and quite frankly the majority of the terrorist are coming from your end. Why? Because they get money from US, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Pakistan does absolutely nothing to target groups like JuA! Your only saving grace is "kUlBasHaaaN" which is an isolated incident where India took advantage of Iranian territory. Iran aided you in arresting him inside Iran! If you put that on a scale next to all the Pakistani terrorists then it is light and day! The problem lies with the Pakistani side as they have caused more problems and killed more people.

You will just have to get used to ultimatums, a built up IRGC presence on the border that is not only anti-terrorist but also anti-PAF and more strikes unless you pull your finger out and solve the issue with Iran. We don't need fake friends who smile and make empty promises but never deliver once the dollars and shekels hit their accounts.

To be honest with you, Pakistani Balochistan is a million times worse than Syria and Iraq, we fly drones and missiles in there uncontested, pray those drones dont one day become armed. We know you don't care about terrorism, you show your true colours.