J-35 Over J-10C? How Bangladesh’s Choice Could Redefine Its Air Power

[Michael Corleone]

@Michael Corleone

Thanks. Any reasons Australian govt chose Indians alone for this favour?

Regards

not sure.... i was recently looking at post graduate oppurtunities and came across it... it's for allowing indian students to migrate along with their families.
special priority for people looking to study to become doctors, IT, engineers etc

 

[Bengal71]

@Bengal71

Ekattor dada,

So why are Pakistanis and BDs not emigrating to OZ in droves, why only Indians.

Regards

Indians have a higher population.

I don't really have anything against Indians migrating, just confirming that the Aussies like the Americans and Europeans are now sick of them. The immigration policy should put a number cap on people of every country of the world.

 

[Bengal71]

Recently I learnt that Indians can get 8 year permit post graduation without the need for sponsored jobs and they can bring their whole family. Also there will be a way to become permanent resident if graduating in specific fields. Doesn’t have to work in said fields. This law changes only benefits Indians and to me it sounded not only crazy and unfair but against australias national interest.

Not sure about this law. I became PR more than 20 years back, don't know the specific rules now.

I actually doubt it unless you can show some source. Whatever opportunity is there, it's there for everyone, no special treatment for Indians.

 

[Bengal71]

It was not just the previous AL government(2009-2024) that was weak on air defence but also the previous BNP government of 20 years ago.

BD saw what happened if you are weak with Myanmar back in 2017 and to this day there are 1 million Rohingya refugees still in BD.

It is extremely fortunate for BD that it is now spoilt for choice, as in it will have access to both J-10C and the J-35A in as little as 3-4 years from now.

I do not favour 1-2 squadrons of J-10CE as "stop-gap" before a purchase of J-35As as the cost in infrastructure setup, maintenance and training for such a small number of planes would mean it would not save any money in the end.

Better BD places an order for 1 squadron(16 planes) of J-35A by 2027-2028 and also has option for 2 more squadrons later on as finance allows and Chinese production capability allow. Even the export version with WS-21 engine will be far superior to anything India can get before 2040.

After J-35As have arrived, then it will be clearer as to the exact status of Turkish KAAN and if Turkey has sorted out a reliable engine supply and the aircaft meets minimum standards, then BAF can start procuring KAAN over the later half of the 2030s in similar numbers to J-35A.

Time for BAF to start planning for a new airforce based around 5th generation fighters from China and potentially Turkey. Yes it will be expensive but even going back to historical 1.3-1.4% GDP spend on defence BD can afford it. It is not an impoverised and tiny country.

A hi-lo mix is really required. I don't buy it that because BD is a small country we must have a bespoke or out-of-the-box solution. There are countries smaller than ours that have a normal air force doctrine. We should go for 100-150 4.5 gen such as J-10c and 60-8o stealth. We have the ability to house them in 8-10 airbases which we should build and protect them with hardened shelter. 4.5 gen is really required for any kind of respectable strike capability, 5th gen with internal bays simply don't have enough payload capacity.

 

[UKBengali]

A hi-lo mix is really required. I don't buy it that because BD is a small country we must have a bespoke or out-of-the-box solution. There are countries smaller than ours that have a normal air force doctrine. We should go for 100-150 4.5 gen such as J-10c and 60-8o stealth. We have the ability to house them in 8-10 airbases which we should build and protect them with hardened shelter. 4.5 gen is really required for any kind of respectable strike capability, 5th gen with internal bays simply don't have enough payload capacity.

BAF can grow to those numbers but we are talking over the next 20-25 years and so up to 2050. That 80-100 number of mine is up to 2040.

What would be the point of still having 4.5 generation aircraft in 2050 when BAF could be flying a 5th/6th generation mix by then?

It makes little sense and like I mentioned already, when BD is finally ready to place an order in 2027/2028 then J-35A export version should be available.

Also BD for strategic reasons would not want to solely rely on China and so could "split" purchase of 80-100 J-35A between J-35A/KAAN. Hopefully Turkey sorts the engine out and then BAF can order this aircraft for delivery in the late 2030s.

In the 2040s BD can add to this 5th generation fleet of J-35As and KAANs and then look at smaller numbers(40-50) of 6th generation fighters.

BAF needs to be a relatively small but extremely high-tech force in order to properly deter India. Massess of 4.5 generation jets will simply be overwhelmed by the much larger IAF and so be little to no deterrent.

 

[Bengal71]

BAF can grow to those numbers but we are talking over the next 20-25 years and so up to 2050. That 80-100 number of mine is up to 2040.

What would be the point of still having 4.5 generation aircraft in 2050 when BAF could be flying a 5th/6th generation mix by then?

It makes little sense and like I mentioned already, when BD is finally ready to place an order in 2027/2028 then J-35A export version should be available.

Also BD for strategic reasons would not want to solely rely on China and so could "split" purchase of 80-100 J-35A between J-35A/KAAN. Hopefully Turkey sorts the engine out and then BAF can order this aircraft for delivery in the late 2030s.

In the 2040s BD can add to this 5th generation fleet of J-35As and KAANs and then look at smaller numbers(40-50) of 6th generation fighters.

BAF needs to be a relatively small but extremely high-tech force in order to properly deter India. Massess of 4.5 generation jets will simply be overwhelmed by the much larger IAF and so be little to no deterrent.

I don't think BD needs to wait that long. Chinese are able to supply J-10 very fast. 80 aircraft can be ordered right now and the order can be fulfilled in 3-4 years. We don't have the luxury of time, it has become very urgent now. As for diversification of hardware, I agree. If it was up to me, I would have ordered an aircraft manufacturing plant as well, with some aircraft coming from China, the rest being assembled or manufactured in BD.
Our small minded low class politicians neither have the vision nor the will to do anything like that. But if BD really wanted, it's completely within our financial capability to build a military the size of that of Pakistan's.

Vast majority of AFs in the region will have bulk of their inventory with 4.5 gen. An AF can't have all high tech, you need a work horse that does most of the job cheaply while high end being the tip of the spear.

 

[SteppeWolff]

I don't think BD needs to wait that long. Chinese are able to supply J-10 very fast. 80 aircraft can be ordered right now and the order can be fulfilled in 3-4 years. We don't have the luxury of time, it has become very urgent now. As for diversification of hardware, I agree. If it was up to me, I would have ordered an aircraft manufacturing plant as well, with some aircraft coming from China, the rest being assembled or manufactured in BD.
Our small minded low class politicians neither have the vision nor the will to do anything like that. But if BD really wanted, it's completely within our financial capability to build a military the size of that of Pakistan's.

Vast majority of AFs in the region will have bulk of their inventory with 4.5 gen. An AF can't have all high tech, you need a work horse that does most of the job cheaply while high end being the tip of the spear.

Building up a huge military isn't just ordering hardware bro. Yall would have to train pilots, technicians, infrastructure. After that youll take years to operationalize that hardware. I think BD should build up incrementally. Quality over Quantity any day.

 

[Bengal71]

Building up a huge military isn't just ordering hardware bro. Yall would have to train pilots, technicians, infrastructure. After that youll take years to operationalize that hardware. I think BD should build up incrementally. Quality over Quantity any day.

I know, it will take time. I was only referring to our financial capability to do so.

 

[UKBengali]

I don't think BD needs to wait that long. Chinese are able to supply J-10 very fast. 80 aircraft can be ordered right now and the order can be fulfilled in 3-4 years. We don't have the luxury of time, it has become very urgent now. As for diversification of hardware, I agree. If it was up to me, I would have ordered an aircraft manufacturing plant as well, with some aircraft coming from China, the rest being assembled or manufactured in BD.
Our small minded low class politicians neither have the vision nor the will to do anything like that. But if BD really wanted, it's completely within our financial capability to build a military the size of that of Pakistan's.

Vast majority of AFs in the region will have bulk of their inventory with 4.5 gen. An AF can't have all high tech, you need a work horse that does most of the job cheaply while high end being the tip of the spear.

1. BD has an interim government that has no mandate to commit BD to a decades long financial and military relationship with China on this scale.

2. Where is the billions of dollars going to come from as initial payment for such a large number of J-10s? Just the 80 aircraft are likely to come to 20 billion US dollars when you add in weapons, infrastructure, training etc.

BD is broke and once it has had elections and the economy slowly recovers an order can be placed in 2027/2028.

 

[Bengal71]

1. BD has an interim government that has no mandate to commit BD to a decades long financial and military relationship with China on this scale.

2. Where is the billions of dollars going to come from as initial payment for such a large number of J-10s? Just the 80 aircraft are likely to come to 20 billion US dollars when you add in weapons, infrastructure, training etc.

BD is broke and once it has had elections and the economy slowly recovers an order can be placed in 2027/2028.

The interim govt has far greater mandate than any other govt in BD's history. The people put them in there and the people want them there. That is mandate.

The economy is already recovering, it will again go down rapidly when an 'elected' government comes, they will immediately start with looting. If BNP comes, there will be no order for their entire tenure, I am pretty sure. They are another party of cheaters and fraudsters.

BTW, 20 billion for 80 aircraft with weapons, training and infra? May be Typhoons will cost that much, J-10 should be a far cheaper aircraft. Chinese loan can be secured to purchase those.

 

[UKBengali]

The interim govt has far greater mandate than any other govt in BD's history. The people put them in there and the people want them there. That is mandate.

The economy is already recovering, it will again go down rapidly when an 'elected' government comes, they will immediately start with looting.

China won't deal with it and anyway BD does not have the money.

It will take years before BD can commit to such a large financial transaction and by then J-35A will be available.

Wish that BD had money but it is simply broke and the IG has far more pressing issues now like mending the economy, recapitalising the banks and also the administrative and political reforms before elections take place.

Yunus has said that he would like elections end of 2025/early 2026 and so in a year we will have a democratic government in place. I personally think that is early and end 2026/early 2027 is more likely.

After that BAF can be instructed to seriously look at buying fighters but a strategic defence and air warfare review will need to be carried out first. This does not need to wait and should be started now!

 

[Bengal71]

China won't deal with it and anyway BD does not have the money.

It will take years before BD can commit to such a large financial transaction and by then J-35A will be available.

Wish that BD had money but it is simply broke and the IG has far more pressing issues now like mending the economy, recapitalising the banks and also the administrative and political reforms before elections take place.

Yunus has said that he would like elections end of 2025/early 2026 and so in a year we will have a democratic government in place. I personally think that is early and end 2026/early 2027 is more likely.

After that BAF can be instructed to seriously look at buying fighters but a strategic defence and air warfare review will need to be carried out first. This does not need to wait and should be started now!

What do you mean China won't deal with it, why won't they? Did they tell you they won't deal with the interim government? BD has money. If Pakistan has money to continue procurement, BD defo has more money.

 

[UKBengali]

What do you mean China won't deal with it, why won't they? Did they tell you they won't deal with the interim government? BD has money. If Pakistan has money to continue procurement, BD defo has more money.

This is an interim government and China knows this.

BD has had a revolution and China knows it won't be around for longer than 1-2 years. Anything it signs can just be overturned as soon as a new government with a democratic mandate comes in with a 5 year term.

Even when a democratic government comes in, China will take a "wait and see" attitude.

Ordering such a large number of advanced platforms like J-10C is not like shopping on Amazon as there are strategic relations between countries to take into account. China will want to make sure that BD will be aligned with its security interests and not move too close to either India or USA.


Pakistan is different as China has a strategic relationship with it and they spend 3-4x GDP on defence as BD does. BD focuses on economy while Pakistan is a military state.

 

[Bengal71]

This is an interim government and China knows this.

BD has had a revolution and China knows it won't be around for longer than 1-2 years. Anything it signs can just be overturned as soon as a new government with a democratic mandate comes in with a 5 year term.

Even when a democratic government comes in, China will take a "wait and see" attitude.

Ordering such a large number of advanced platforms like J-10C is not like shopping on Amazon as there are strategic relations between countries to take into account. China will want to make sure that BD will be aligned with its security interests and not move too close to either India or USA.


Pakistan is different as China has a strategic relationship with it and they spend 3-4x GDP on defence as BD does. BD focuses on economy while Pakistan is a military state.

All of that is speculation about what the Chinese will do. You simply don't know. Yunus has very good relationship with China and the J-10 is cleared for export. They will supply anything we want to buy.


Pakistan is different as China has a strategic relationship with it and they spend 3-4x GDP on defence as BD does. BD focuses on economy while Pakistan is a military state.

That does not mean BD doesn't have the money as you said. BD has the money, what BD doesn't have is political will.

 

[UKBengali]

That does not mean BD doesn't have the money as you said. BD has the money, what BD doesn't have is political will.

Last post as we are not getting anwhere.

BD can barely pay for crucial imports with forex reserves at just 25 billion US dollars(halved over last 3-4 years) and we are thinking they will find 20 billion US dollars over next 3-4 years?

At this moment BD is still getting emergency loan support to tie it over and so importing expensive fighters like J-10 in numbers is low down on the list of prioroties.