POST WAR assessment of recent conflict.

[SoulSpokesman]

@TallGuy @WhispersFromThePast

Excellent posts, sirs! You are right about the threat of S400 and Brahmos. Pakistan will have to match with top of the line AD systems and have its own long range cruise missiles.

What will compound the situation is this:

S500 will replace S400 as the outer envelope of the AAD. S400s will be supplemented by Kusha, which has almost the same range and much cheaper projectiles.
Brahmos will be supplemented by Brahmos II which will be hypersonic (Mach 7 as against Mach 3 of Brahmos) and longer range (1500 km vs 600)
Rudra MIII, an air to ground anti radar weapon with a 600 km range will be in place.

All in all, Pak Fauj will have its task cut out. But I am sure it is good enough to leapfrog.

Regards

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

@TallGuy @WhispersFromThePast

Excellent posts, sirs! You are right about the threat of S400 and Brahmos. Pakistan will have to match with top of the line AD systems and have its own long range cruise missiles.

What will compound the situation is this:

S500 will replace S400 as the outer envelope of the AAD. S400s will be supplemented by Kusha, which has almost the same range and much cheaper projectiles.
Brahmos will be supplemented by Brahmos II which will be hypersonic (Mach 7 as against Mach 3 of Brahmos) and longer range (1500 km vs 600)
Rudra MIII, an air to ground anti radar weapon with a 600 km range will be in place.

All in all, Pak Fauj will have its task cut out. But I am sure it is good enough to leapfrog.

Regards

At longer ranges Brahmos will lose the advantage of INS and will become more susceptible to soft kill techniques such as GPS jamming but we will need the ability to jam deep within India. Alternatively, if we can track its launch deep inside India, its speed becomes useless because it enables even loitering ammunition to place itself in its path. At hypersonic speeds it will NOT be manoeuvrable and even a slight impact will explode the skin already plasma hot due to friction.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@WhispersFromThePast

I believe those challenges are being addressed. Let's see how it goes.

Regards

 

[TallGuy]

At longer ranges Brahmos will lose the advantage of INS and will become more susceptible to soft kill techniques such as GPS jamming but we will need the ability to jam deep within India. Alternatively, if we can track its launch deep inside India, its speed becomes useless because it enables even loitering ammunition to place itself in its path. At hypersonic speeds it will NOT be manoeuvrable and even a slight impact will explode the skin already plasma hot due to friction.

i understand this, my point is this how to respond? we did not have the response against Brahmos GLCM.

it speculative but in total from the attack on nur khan AFB indian fired over 36 GLCM Brahmos. (if you notice no air launched versions) that speaks for itself.

out of 36 (Spectulative number) we able to soft kill 23-24 remaining leaked at hit PAF basis. i must gave standing ovation to the EW unit for defending/spoofing GLCM Barrage in 10 seconds. its very hard.

we need aero-ballistic missiles as soon as possible does not matter where we get it we need type of missiles with range of 800-900km. that can perform evasive maneuvers. only window i see is Iran who has the stuff (from Fatah hypersonics to Zohair) off the shelf. its WAR TIME - we should not worry about USA.

I mean it - Off the shelf!

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@TallGuy

Will Iran be willing to sell such weapons given the tense relations between your countries. After all those weapons could be used against them some day.

Regards

 

[TallGuy]

@TallGuy

Will Iran be willing to sell such weapons given the tense relations between your countries. After all those weapons could be used against them some day.

Regards

its about Pakistan willing to buy!

Iran will sell if we ask to Buy!

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

i understand this, my point is this how to respond? we did not have the response against Brahmos GLCM.

it speculative but in total from the attack on nur khan AFB indian fired over 36 GLCM Brahmos. (if you notice no air launched versions) that speaks for itself.

out of 36 (Spectulative number) we able to soft kill 23-24 remaining leaked at hit PAF basis. i must gave standing ovation to the EW unit for defending/spoofing GLCM Barrage in 10 seconds. its very hard.

we need aero-ballistic missiles as soon as possible does not matter where we get it we need type of missiles with range of 800-900km. that can perform evasive maneuvers. only window i see is Iran who has the stuff (from Fatah hypersonics to Zohair) off the shelf. its WAR TIME - we should not worry about USA.

I mean it - Off the shelf!

With current Indian capability, we can simply clear forward airbases. Let them pound walls and dirt. As a matter of fact, let’s keep F7s and Mirages or other decoy assets and let the fool and his money part ways quickly. Why do you get scared of a few explosions and destroyed buildings?

 

[TallGuy]

With current Indian capability, we can simply clear forward airbases. Let them pound walls and dirt. As a matter of fact, let’s keep F7s and Mirages or other decoy assets and let the fool and his money part ways quickly. Why do you get scared of a few explosions and destroyed buildings?

i am not afraid ..i am angry, have you looked at our important military facilities HIT, PAC, POF and whatnot have you seen the locations? you must understand the flying time?

i want to shoot the person who planned and built these at these locations these important assets so close to indian border. they are undefendable against a Large barrage of GLCM Brahmos.

so what we can do now? if this ceasefire go south - what do think Brahmos attacks will only on AFBs? it will be on Pakistan military machine!

how do we create deterence? how we create response in such a short time?

that is why i request/suggest Iranian SRBM (Hypersonic with MaRVs) thats the only solution. you think India now will go for S-400 SAM , we are such a gullible creature. they will go for Iron dome/David Sling/Arrow Solution!..Mark my words!

that is why i ask for Pakistan Deep state to approach Iranians. we are sure that in GPS/Beudui denied enviorment those SRBMs will work 300km-1450km hypersonic will create deterence.

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

i am not afraid ..i am angry, have you looked at our important military facilities HIT, PAC, POF and whatnot have you seen the locations? you must understand the flying time?

i want to shoot the person who planned and built these at these locations these important assets so close to indian border. they are undefendable against a Large barrage of GLCM Brahmos.

so what we can do now? if this ceasefire go south - what do think Brahmos attacks will only on AFBs? it will be on Pakistan military machine!

how do we create deterence? how we create response in such a short time?

that is why i request/suggest Iranian SRBM (Hypersonic with MaRVs) thats the only solution. you think India now will go for S-400 SAM , we are such a gullible creature. they will go for Iron dome/David Sling/Arrow Solution!..Mark my words!

that is why i ask for Pakistan Deep state to approach Iranians. we are sure that in GPS/Beudui denied enviorment those SRBMs will work 300km-1450km hypersonic will create deterence.

You want to buy a system that you have never used before? No training, no planning, no integration? In all probability you will need Iranian operators to use these systems.

Brahmos is a threat only if you allow it to be launched. If you proactively hit their air defences, which they have recently revealed, and achieve air dominance, they are basically sitting ducks. At the moment, it’s a numbers game involving super-hypersonic projectiles that can be launched from systems that are integrated into our command and control. Otherwise, Nasr makes an appearance.

HQ-9 and CM400 both have the advantage of Chinese manufacturing capacity. The PAF Block 1 and 2 will have their job cut out for them. Time to make good on the training.

As a quick fix solution, since they claim they are able to track anything as soon as it is launched, place UAVs in all possible paths of incoming projectiles. Here again Chinese help can be sought.

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

@TallGuy I suppose you understand the difference between hypersonic ballistic warhead and hypersonic quasi-ballistic or cruise missile? The answer to Brahmos is not ballistic missiles. They can be used to generate more targets for air defences, but the main answer is quasi-ballistic/cruise missiles.

 

[TallGuy]

You want to buy a system that you have never used before? No training, no planning, no integration? In all probability you will need Iranian operators to use these systems.

Brahmos is a threat only if you allow it to be launched. If you proactively hit their air defences, which they have recently revealed, and achieve air dominance, they are basically sitting ducks. At the moment, it’s a numbers game involving super-hypersonic projectiles that can be launched from systems that are integrated into our command and control. Otherwise, Nasr makes an appearance.

HQ-9 and CM400 both have the advantage of Chinese manufacturing capacity. The PAF Block 1 and 2 will have their job cut out for them. Time to make good on the training.

As a quick fix solution, since they claim they are able to track anything as soon as it is launched, place UAVs in all possible paths of incoming projectiles. Here again Chinese help can be sought.

Sir,
That putting too much pressure on JF17s squadrons every weopen require employment training So will the Iranian missiles will require too. what about also we will put awful lot of pilots in to undue danger! please understand i see you are putting faith on Fattah 3 and 4 with are SSMs but they do not have first the warhead power nor the evasive capability. S-400 SAM or future Arrow 2/David sling will eat them.

in prespective
Fattah 1 GMRLS warhead 18kgs
Fattah 2 GMRLS warhead 18 kgs

Brahmos GLCM warhead 200-300kg

Fattah 3 and 4 ? warhead size?

average Iranian hypersonics warhead wait average is 300-480kg, we need range as well as destructive power as well.

 

[TallGuy]

@TallGuy I suppose you understand the difference between hypersonic ballistic warhead and hypersonic quasi-ballistic or cruise missile? The answer to Brahmos is not ballistic missiles. They can be used to generate more targets for air defences, but the main answer is quasi-ballistic/cruise missiles.

sir, i understand this!
that is why 600-900km Quasi ballistic missile includes Zohair SSM or Fateh I they all work in depressed trajectory.

or else if sun rises from west - you can ask Russia to but ISKANDER M or korean copy or South korean copy of Iskander

but we need them urgently.

unfortunately we have tried and test weapons available next door! but our biased and will to act gets in the way! and it will cost us dearly.

 

[MirageV3ff]

Did we lose any assets during the strikes on our air bases?

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

Sir,
That putting too much pressure on JF17s squadrons every weopen require employment training So will the Iranian missiles will require too. what about also we will put awful lot of pilots in to undue danger! please understand i see you are putting faith on Fattah 3 and 4 with are SSMs but they do not have first the warhead power nor the evasive capability. S-400 SAM or future Arrow 2/David sling will eat them.

in prespective
Fattah 1 GMRLS warhead 18kgs
Fattah 2 GMRLS warhead 18 kgs

Brahmos GLCM warhead 200-300kg

Fattah 3 and 4 ? warhead size?

average Iranian hypersonics warhead wait average is 300-480kg, we need range as well as destructive power as well.

OK hold on a second. Are we talking about war in a month, a year, or 10 years?

 

[WhispersFromThePast]

Did we lose any assets during the strikes on our air bases?

Shrapnel damage to AEWACs, easily recoverable. Reports of radar taken out. Shahadats amongst airmen, reportedly due to strike shortly before ceasefire start.