Iran Plans to Buy Chinese J-10C Instead of Russian Su-35

[SteppeWolff]

In return for an israel-free bordering country with which you share 900+ km border. What else do you want ?

They pay for everything concerning them and we should be willing to help and accommodate them.

That would be too generous. You are forgetting Iran has been in cahoots with India against us, fueling unrest in Pakistan.

 

[SecularNationalist]

So Iran doesn't just lack weapons, it lacks good pilots. Their pilots have been out of modern air warfare for too long.

Iran needs to ditch India and repair its relationship with Pakistan so that the two air forces can exchange and cooperate.

Yea that's what I said.
You can immediately buy a fighter jet but training a pilots takes years. And to make them experienced take a decade atleast. That's where iran lacks seriously.

 

[r3alist]

If we can issue passport to an Algerian diplomat within 24 hours just so that he can present cause of Algerian independence in UN session, share nuclear blueprints with Iran, Iraq, And Libya. Send it's F-16 pilots to turkey after failed Turkish military coup. Pakistan can atleast host 2 dozen Iranian J-10Cs and it's pilots for a while.

So you mean do even more?

The problem I raise with Iranian cooperation is actually more of my lack of faith on the Pakistan side, they always jump to brotherhood whilst the other side thinks in hard power terms.... Arguably with most bilateral relationships there is an effort needed to gain more parity let's say

 

[wangdefa]

Yes, I have heard about these. Iranian government doesn't seem to be a trusted and committed ally of anybody, they seem to go wherever they can gain some short-term benefit. They don't have long-term strategic alliance mindset and they are hellbent on acceptance from the west and they hope the west will like them and somehow they will lift all sanctions and everything will be good after that. I don't see this changing anytime soon. Under these circumstances if China doesn't want to commit to Iran, China can't be blamed.

This is an interesting topic. We all know that the whole of Iran has been infiltrated by spies. In addition to leaking military secrets, he can also threaten Iranian officials and even help Iranian officials manage Western property.
Under the infiltration of a large number of spies,Iran must deal with these internal spies first, deal with the internal contradictions first, and then do the next thing. As everyone said, even if Iran buys the best fighter planes and radar, they will be destroyed by spies before they can use them. This is meaningless.
Since the armed forces are in the situation of insecurity in Iran as a whole, it is better to directly request the external garrison in Iran and hand over the national defense construction to China. This is the fastest way.
Building a political system, like a military system, requires a long-term investment of time. What Iran lacks most is time, not to mention the external threats and internal contradictions. You have to gamble.

 

[Lulldapull]

China doesn't need US's permission to do anything. This isn't the 90s and early 2000s. Time to update your timeline.

And talking about Iran being militarily ahead of Pakistan, even most Iranians would doubt that now after their abysmal performance in the recent war.

When you let hubris overshadow your logic, you find out the hard way. Iranians are in the process of finding out.

What the Iranians did to Israel, we couldn't for the life of us do that. That bit is crystal.

We don't have anything to hit back with. Same goes for that AL-Turkiya.

So weak.

 

[vmro]

The Chinese government should demand that Iran buy the entire combat system, not just the fighter jets.

Israel has the complete American combat system, and if Iran only has fighters, it will be very difficult for the J10C to win, which will ultimately hurt the reputation of China's military industry.

That is exactly planed, jets, AD systems, radars and the last but not least, Iran will finally get rid of GPS for chinese Baidoo, what will finally solve problem of targeting across Iran so precisely...

 

[Flotilla]

too late in the day for iran.
iran u have missed the bus some years ago.

Try to help... Pakistán could be the next.

 

[r3alist]

One thing many people don't realize is that all of China's military-industrial enterprises are state-owned, and their control belongs entirely to the Chinese government.

The outside world indeed are ignorant and in fact intentionally turn the other way, but Pakistan is very well know about the eco system and everything within

First adopters.....

I would say in ballistic missile technology, and home grown radars and SAMs, they are miles ahead of Pakistan. Miles. The performance of the AD/IADS of Iran in the 12day war was compromised due to local sabotage taking out their systems before they could get activated. In TP1/2, they managed to fend off alot of the IAFs operations, which is why the IDF has to resort to local spies, and special forces operations to take out the AD/IADS before the main operation could kick in.

But they dedicate all of their scientific, intellectual and technological capital to basically have missiles and missile defense

Pakistans overall army would seem as if it's coming from the future compared to some parts of the Iranian army.....

But then again, this is all a silly conversation in comparison and we are only discussing it because lull always forces us to


A country which bases its main defense and offense around missiles really does not sound like a country that's trying to take itself too seriously, we keep ignoring the fact that Iran, as it's defined now, has been a revolutionary movement to export to the region, it's offensive capability is completely linked to missiles, if you can somehow degrade the missiles, which are a finite resource anyway, you have nothing don't you?

 

[r3alist]

That is exactly planed, jets, AD systems, radars and the last but not least, Iran will finally get rid of GPS for chinese Baidoo, what will finally solve problem of targeting across Iran so precisely...

@Lulldapull .... So smart they use GPS? Really?

 

[Flotilla]

The freeze on the $400 billion 25-year deal was not due to U.S. sanctions; Chinese SOEs have never cared about U.S. sanctions, and the Chinese government surely took U.S. sanctions into account when it signed the deal. The real reason is Iran's failure to honor the prerequisite terms of the 25-year deal.

First of all, the prerequisite for China to provide armaments was for the Iranian military to completely abandon GPS in favor of China's Beidou, but Iran has not done so. Secondly the prerequisite for the $400 billion investment was ports and oil traded in CNY, but Iran gave the ports to India and only part of the oil trade was switched to CNY.

the Iranian government is in chaos internally, and there are very large forces that are preventing cooperation with China. It is difficult for China and Iran to cooperate until Iran cleans up the internal surrenderists and Mossad.

Thanks for explaining the reasons about this hypothetical misstruth. Anyway Irán keeps nearly 100.000 troops stationed in MENA región that could be giving better service circumventing China. That reason should be enough to keep Irán working.

 

[vmro]

@Lulldapull .... So smart they use GPS? Really?

there are not many alternatives, gps of usa, some russian edition and this chinese.... powerful presence in space with satellites is necessary...

 

[Flotilla]

One thing many people don't realize is that all of China's military-industrial enterprises are state-owned, and their control belongs entirely to the Chinese government.

This results in the business practices of China's military-industrial enterprises being politically oriented rather than profit-oriented.

In the case of Iran It is impossible to get the Chinese government to compromise on technical security or long-term interests with some money or oil. The Chinese government does not need to rely on the arms conglomerates to make money.

That is nonsense. It is a historical mistake to rely just on domestic orders. China always fight hard for exportation contracts and that is more than good. It is necessary.

 

[r3alist]

there are not many alternatives, gps of usa, some russian edition and this chinese.... powerful presence in space with satellites is necessary...

Yes I know, kind of making a point how come that's not there?

 

[Flotilla]

Unlike Russia, China has the Ability to manufacture advanced fighter jets in mass numbers.China is the only major oil importer that dares to buy Iranian oil and do business with iran directly or indirectly.Personally, Selling J10 is a bit risky. If it is not matched with AWACS HQ-9B, and HQ-19 will not form a system. If it is matched with them, not to mention the funds, the Iranian government has been infiltrated like a sieve, and the data of the AWACS will immediately become shared by the US and Israel but u have to start from somewhere. Iran needs to take its own internal security seriously maybe work with chinese intelligence agency to root out mossad agents.

Don't mess sabotage or spy Mossad activities with IRIAF performances. I don't recall any fighter, helicopter or tanker destroyed by spy or saboteurs. They we're destroyed all by bombs/missiles of IDF fighters.

 

[Flotilla]

Iran has no choice but to try and move down that path, I think they can do it and i don't think it is as hard as you make it out either. The Iranians are a smart people, and once they have the tools, they will be able to make full use of them quickly. The problem for Iran has always the poor decision making of their mullahs, not their professionals.

You only have to look at how much of their own ecosystem they have built at home despite being under the most severe of sanctions to understand how capable they are. Much of what Iran has done and achieved, Pakistan has either not started on, or are decades behind Iran interms of capability to do right now.

I think you did bullseye. Seems that the Regime have been funding happily IRGC forces because the historical mistrust over Artesh corps (IRIAF, IRIN among them). Because for the Regime red is priority over blue. That is good for a non conventional war doctrine, but whenever a conventional powerful Air Force roll over the country, you miss that conventional Air and Navy forces.