India Lucky Not To Lose More Than Four Rafales

[flyingorca]

Can also came from the hit to the ground.

Well atleast you admit Rafale was hit and not down due to technical glitch.

 

[Blain2]

All their taunts such as "Pakistan did not even claim their fallen in Kargil" ring hollow today when they have lost airmen and troops on the ground who cannot even be named/recognized for their sacrifice in service to their country because of Modi and BJP's political survival.
I am just calling out the shamelessness and hypocrisy of GoI and its supporters which stand exposed today.

 

[Oscar]

All their taunts such as "Pakistan did not even claim their fallen in Kargil" ring hollow today when they have lost countless airmen and troops on the ground who cannot even be named/recognized for their sacrifice in service to their country because of Modi and BJP's political survival.

They definitely have lost people but wouldn’t some news leak eventually?
It gets difficult to hide dead bodies and their associated kin be silenced after a while especially in this day and age of instant communication.

 

[Blain2]

They definitely have lost people but wouldn’t some news leak eventually?
It gets difficult to hide dead bodies and their associated kin be silenced after a while especially in this day and age of instant communication.

Like the S-400 operator?
Not all news leaks specially when the families have been bought into the government narrative.

 

[Vkdindian1]

All their taunts such as "Pakistan did not even claim their fallen in Kargil" ring hollow today when they have lost airmen and troops on the ground who cannot even be named/recognized for their sacrifice in service to their country because of Modi and BJP's political survival.
I am just calling out the shamelessness and hypocrisy of GoI and its supporters which stands exposed today.

There is no hiding of casualties. Buying of narrative angle is also a lame one.
With every person holding a mobile and ready to become a video blogger, there is no way to hide such things.
That death of a so called S400 operator is also a stretch of imagination stretched too far.
The entire attempt seems to be peddled with an aim to claim a successful hit on S-400. There are better ways to do that then though the death of a BSF jawan.

 

[Blain2]

There is no hiding of casualties. Buying of narrative angle is also a lame one.
With every person holding a mobile and ready to become a video blogger, there is no way to hide such things.
That death of a so called S400 operator is also a stretch of imagination stretched too far.
The entire attempt seems to be peddled with an aim to claim a successful hit on S-400. There are better ways to do that then though the death of a BSF jawan.

Ok, you must be right since you and your government are the fountain of truth. Everything is always a stretch of imagination when it comes to your losses because in your mighty minds, you have suffered none. Your aircraft being shot down, your sites being hit is all fantasy conjured up by the world and our limited minds, all evidence be damned. So carry on, carrying on.

 

[Vkdindian1]

Ok, you must be right since you and your government are the fountain of truth. Everything is always a stretch of imagination when it comes to your losses because in your mighty minds, you have suffered none. Your aircraft being shot down, your sites being hit is all fantasy conjured up by the world and our limited minds, all evidence be damned. So carry on, carrying on.

Indian CDS had accepted the losses. What exact losses weren’t acknowledged for narrative building. And many nations have done it and would keep doing it.
During Kargil, the shahadat of NLI soldiers was acknowledged after a couple of years by your very own establishment. The precedence is right there, very close to you, provided you are ready to look.
There is no doubt about aircraft lost and there is also no doubt about our sites NOT being hit.
You are mixing two things and claiming moral high ground.

 

[Windjammer]

@Blain2
I wonder since when have the BSF started donning this uniform .

 

[Blain2]

Indian CDS had accepted the losses. What exact losses weren’t acknowledged for narrative building. And many nations have done it and would keep doing it.
During Kargil, the shahadat of NLI soldiers was acknowledged after a couple of years by your very own establishment. The precedence is right there, very close to you, provided you are ready to look.
There is no doubt about aircraft lost and there is also no doubt about our sites NOT being hit.
You are mixing two things and claiming moral high ground.

We ran a covert operation at Kargil. Operational security and the need to keep casualties out of public eye were specifically communicated to the formations involved. Your side was the one constantly trying to remind "you did not own up to your fallen" etc. when we knew what the operational expectations were. We don't need a band-baja to remember our fallen given their sacrifices were acknowledged to be in support of our Kashmir cause.

I am just calling out the hypocrisy of the situation. Now when your side has taken losses, not a word except brief leaks to help with what you call "narrative building".

The context of Kargil was different from a full blown conflagration, which is what the May affair was, in which your side took losses. We openly accepted ours...while your government is playing politics hiding losses and failures for its own survival.

I'd be fine if Indians never claimed the moral high ground earlier by reminding us of our fallen in Kargil. But since your side did, the hypocrisy of not claiming your fallen now needs to be exposed.

 

[Oscar]

Like the S-400 operator?
Not all news leaks specially when the families have been bought into the government narrative.

But the larger the “conspiracy” it becomes more difficult to hide.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

@Blain2
I wonder since when have the BSF started donning this uniform .

View attachment 136497

S-400 is under IAF

 

[Vkdindian1]

We ran a covert operation at Kargil.

You gave away your logic in the very first sentence of your reply.
Military action is a military action whether a covert or an overt one. Even a covert operation has an expiry date especially when it was exposed to the world from the day one of its start.
I still remember the day when Sharif was standing at the doors of White House trying to save face from this so called “covert ops”?

Once the entire scandal was exposed and whole world knew about it, it was dishonourable to not acknowledge the fallen for a couple of years. Come on man?

You can try and give whatever spin you want, but that would remain the bottom line.

India lost fighters. CDS has accepted this on camera. But all the pilots are safe was also clearly mentioned. Now, don’t tell me that you don’t know if pilots can’t eject from a crippled fighter?

In the recent skirmish, India has acknowledged each and every fallen solider. There is no hypocrisy here. You may try and give a spin to each one of them the way you like. In a country as vast and as diverse as India, it is not possible to hide death of a soldier. No way.
You desperately want something to show for success of your ground attacks which were a miserable failure. And only way you hope is through back door by claiming the death of a S-400 operator.

Please sell this snake oil to people who are ready to gulp it.

It’s also high time that atleast consultants start accepting that your attacks against ground targets were poorly planned and executed.

 

[Blain2]

You gave away your logic in the very first sentence of your reply.
Military action is a military action whether a covert or an overt one. Even a covert operation has an expiry date especially when it was exposed to the world from the day one of its start.
I still remember the day when Sharif was standing at the doors of White House trying to save face from this so called “covert ops”?

Once the entire scandal was exposed and whole world knew about it, it was dishonourable to not acknowledge the fallen for a couple of years. Come on man?

You can try and give whatever spin you want, but that would remain the bottom line.

India lost fighters. CDS has accepted this on camera. But all the pilots are safe was also clearly mentioned. Now, don’t tell me that you don’t know if pilots can’t eject from a crippled fighter?

In the recent skirmish, India has acknowledged each and every fallen solider. There is no hypocrisy here. You may try and give a spin to each one of them the way you like. In a country as vast and as diverse as India, it is not possible to hide death of a soldier. No way.
You desperately want something to show for success of your ground attacks which were a miserable failure. And only way you hope is through back door by claiming the death of a S-400 operator.

Please sell this snake oil to people who are ready to gulp it.

It’s also high time that atleast consultants start accepting that your attacks against ground targets were poorly planned and executed.

The reality is that it does not even matter if every target was hit with accuracy as we were not looking to further attrit after the 6-7 IAF aircraft shoot-down, rather it was to manage an escalation with deterrence put back in place. As such, even if Pakistani strikes did not hit a single target as you claim (without being factual), it was still successful in registering a message to the Indian side.

Our response (deliberately after two long days of considerations given to escalation management) showed that Pakistan can hit at will and there is NOTHING that India can do to stop it. If the intent was to deliver serious damage, the volume and target selection would have been far greater and more painful (and we have ample wherewithal to deliver that). There was not a thing that India could have done in the moment to hold Pakistan back except it was our own calculations and considerations which led to the limited action taken by us.

On your defense of Indian hypocrisy, the less said the better.

 

[Master Chief]

There is no hiding of casualties.

For GOD'S sake man. Have you people got ZERO shame? You still won't criticise and call out your shameless government for refusing to disclose and honour your martyrs because "operation is ongoing"??

This shameless toeing of the party line is why all you establishment men are a laughing stock around here, or indeed any where outside of Indian echo chamber whatsapp groups.

Tell us about Shivangi.

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

They definitely have lost people but wouldn’t some news leak eventually?
It gets difficult to hide dead bodies and their associated kin be silenced after a while especially in this day and age of instant communication.

We will eventually find out about Shivangi, but other pilots? Only Indian army/government can honour them.