H-1B visas must end’: Wife of US citizen shares plight of landing IT jobs

[vasanthm]

There are enough guys on celebration mode. Not you but majority. I don’t need to point it out.

H1B wasn’t cast in stone that it can’t be undone. Largest community affected by it is Indians. Those who exploited the systems would learn a tough lesson.
All expats being kicked out is inconceivable.
Go to any US hospital and it would be clear why.
Every difficult situation throws open opportunities for those who are willing to exploit it.
So the story isn’t finished yet. Who gains and who looses would be known in some time.

This one time $100k mark for new applicants looks like a sweet spot, high enough to discourage entry level or body shopping hires, but not prohibitive for genuinely skilled staff. It’ll still allow strong Indian professionals to come in, while gradually pushing lower end roles to be offshored to India. Over time, that also accelerates the setup of GCCs by firms who’d rather build teams here than keep paying that premium.

 

[r3alist]

There are enough guys on celebration mode. Not you but majority. I don’t need to point it out.

H1B wasn’t cast in stone that it can’t be undone. Largest community affected by it is Indians. Those who exploited the systems would learn a tough lesson.
All expats being kicked out is inconceivable.
Go to any US hospital and it would be clear why.
Every difficult situation throws open opportunities for those who are willing to exploit it.
So the story isn’t finished yet. Who gains and who looses would be known in some time.

It may well totally reverse.

Or as good as, I already said that very early on before

However this is not down to individual Indians per se, but the whole infrastructure set up around funneling people in on the basis that they are skilled and educated beyond anything America has to offer.

And then the disingenuous and frankly absurd claim that there is nothing stopping Americans from getting these jobs, when they are never even made aware of them, all those coming from a third world education somehow have the skills that Americans would not

Remember that tech and tech companies are desirable, graduates want to work their, so would plenty people around the world, and plenty of other Americans.

If you want to insist that Indians are entitled to the American dream then my word prepare to have disagreement



Finally I watch the brief clip of the pgurus chap, even he doesn't suggest that Americans cannot do the jobs, he simply says that these h1b guys are subsidizing the American investor class as they are driving up the magnificent seven price to earnings ratio

And finally that Americans would not be willing to do the grunt work that Indians are..... All of this he freely admitted.

 

[Watandar]

Costa Rica, Buenes Aires, and surprisingly Amman have quietly started to attract a lot of attention. But Indian back office casts a long shadow just because of all their brethren now at the helm of a lot of west based companies.

Indians only hire Indians and only send business to India. Its why they are so disliked by everyone else. The quality of the work done by Indian IT had also steadily declined since the 2000s because of all the warm bodies that were inducted by India just to make money.

You are right about the long shadow but IT industry had begun attempt to move away from India about 10 years back. I am hoping that accelerates and some other nationalities, including Pakistan, get a chance to work in IT. The overall IT workforce will also improve by moving away from entitled stinky incompetent Indians.

 

[samsite84]

As an Indian on H-4 (previously H1-B), I welcome the decision. Here is a thing: almost 20% of Indians from my B school class had to migrate to other countries as they couldn't secure a lottery (mostly due to Infy/TCS folks applying as well). This is not tenable. All of them had offers of $200K+ and were masters from a top US university.

This decision sets this injustice (in my view) right. Although, the implementation has to be seen but OPT to H1-B is a change of status so $100K not required. Even if $100K is required, top companies will pay for it (one time). Start-ups will loose out, so will smaller companies.

Students doing masters from top univs and the top top companies will be the winners

Most of all, Indian IT and other US based body shops will loose - which has been the gripe of US folks and many Indians alike.

 

[BrigSmart]

As an Indian on H-4 (previously H1-B), I welcome the decision. Here is a thing: almost 20% of Indians from my B school class had to migrate to other countries as they couldn't secure a lottery (mostly due to Infy/TCS folks applying as well). This is not tenable. All of them had offers of $200K+ and were masters from a top US university.

This decision sets this injustice (in my view) right. Although, the implementation has to be seen but OPT to H1-B is a change of status so $100K not required. Even if $100K is required, top companies will pay for it (one time). Start-ups will loose out, so will smaller companies.

Students doing masters from top univs and the top top companies will be the winners

Most of all, Indian IT and other US based body shops will loose - which has been the gripe of US folks and many Indians alike.

Dont really disagree with you on how the H1B programme should have been structured, but that change has to be made by Congress amending the law , not through Presidential proclamation. It will almost certainly be set aside by the courts.

 

[r3alist]

Dont really disagree with you on how the H1B programme should have been structured, but that change has to be made by Congress amending the law , not through Presidential proclamation. It will almost certainly be set aside by the courts.

It's up to the Americans to decide how they want to do it.

This entitlement to American affairs and the American dream is really a big part of the problem


The h1b is not a monopoly of one country but there are many many others who could theoretically contribute if the system only allowed it


And why shouldn't silicon valley benefit from someone from Denmark or Switzerland or Australia who will an average be much much better educated

 

[Meengla]

I don't really care about the H1B programme now. In fact, I think it would be better for India if it were to end and the brain drain from India were to stop

"Brain Drain from India"? Now that's a real copium! You know you guys have too many people to absorb--just like Pakistan's situation.
As to this debate, my guess is companies will figure out a way to mostly bypass the restrictions being imposed even though I don't see Trump will face major court challenges. He has been using Executive Orders a lot and getting away with them.

 

[Ali_Baba]

There are, as many have said, 600k H1B visa's in the USA as of now. The measure of success is how that number moves in 6months, 12 months from now for both the USA government, and Indians. Indians at a minimum want that value to stay constant, or move up whereas the American government will want to see that go down.

If the policy for the American administration and the people is to be effective then that number has to go down over time..

There has been enough commentary that the L1 Visa route will also be changed, as will the OPT route. This is the start of that process, with the low hanging fruit of new H1Bs having some direction set on them. Things are changing, so clinging onto hope that all the change that will be done on this front, has been done, is very a optimistic wish list.

Lastly, and more importantly, it is important to view how American companies will react operationally. What is cost effective for them right now ? Try and setup ways of trying to circumvent changes that are/will be made across the L1/H1/OPT routes, or to setup and operationalise training programmes for graduates to be trained and inducted as part of their resourcing pipeline? They wont want to invest "twice", that is not cost effective.

The policies have been crafted to move the dial on the direction of travel, but not cause immediate chaos ...

Let see how it plays out.

 

[Meengla]

Get used to it. Christmas is over freeloader.

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I don't blame the Indians for jumping the ship (aircraft in this case): India is very unlivable country, even for the rich!

 

[Watandar]

As an Indian on H-4 (previously H1-B), I welcome the decision. Here is a thing: almost 20% of Indians from my B school class had to migrate to other countries as they couldn't secure a lottery (mostly due to Infy/TCS folks applying as well). This is not tenable. All of them had offers of $200K+ and were masters from a top US university.

This decision sets this injustice (in my view) right. Although, the implementation has to be seen but OPT to H1-B is a change of status so $100K not required. Even if $100K is required, top companies will pay for it (one time). Start-ups will loose out, so will smaller companies.

Students doing masters from top univs and the top top companies will be the winners

Most of all, Indian IT and other US based body shops will loose - which has been the gripe of US folks and many Indians alike.

The 100k fee to H1b is Trump's typical sledgehammer approach. There are industries besides IT that suffer from genuine shortages and also use the H1b, like healthcare.

I am expecting Trump to update this order in next few weeks to exempt healthcare and other industries and limit this to tech only. He also expects negotiations and so the 100k fee will likely come down to between 20k and 40k in the end. The intent is to prevent this visa from being used to kick out locals and bring in cheaper foreign workers.

A reasonable tax on outsourcing services and remittances needs to come next.

Globalization's MO that jobs, labor and money would freely move from your country to cheaper lands and the resulting profits gobbled up by corporations is now seen as a major blunder that hurt society and citizens. It needs to be reversed.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Dont really disagree with you on how the H1B programme should have been structured, but that change has to be made by Congress amending the law , not through Presidential proclamation. It will almost certainly be set aside by the courts.

The American administration has announced/made these changes. They will either be dismissed on the basis of procedural issues you suggest, or they will come into force(which implies that they complied with procedural processes correctly as part of the process ). Lets see how long they last

 

[Vkdindian1]

If you want to insist that Indians are entitled to the American dream then my word prepare to have disagreement

Fully agree on this. The system has been exploited and no expat has a right over it.

But there is a method to the madness. And that madness can’t be implemented like this. It can be done in a structured and organised way. Those who are on H1B aren’t criminals (majorly). They don’t need to suffer and get into panic for no fault of theirs. Imagine a person who had gone back to attend to an emergency back home and was subjected to this situation. What was the intent of declaring a deadline of 24 hrs. Couldn’t it have been made 30 days?

Trump is the president and has all the power to do what he wants. But this was a blatant misuse of power.

Joy and cheers being displayed by many on this thread shows deplorable character. Indian statement to say that it would inconvenience families was laughed at by many idiots. They should remember that a person like Trump can bring his arbitrariness to affect their domain and life anytime.

 

[r3alist]

it is important to view how American companies will react operationally. What is cost effective for them right now ? Try and setup ways of trying to circumvent changes that are/will be made across the L1/H1/OPT routes, or to setup and operationalise training programmes for graduates to be trained and inducted as part of their resourcing pipeline? They wont want to invest "twice", that is not cost effective

A lot of the h1b heavy departments will have fat in them, you will need senior management to look freshly at the requirements, and have a process of phasing them out whilst introducing young grads, trying to juggle overall cost and operational viability

The easiest part is knowledge transfer, just demand that the h1b guys provide the necessary knowledge and information because after all someone gave it to them.


And that's why I think this trump bill is initially designed to make a big impact but practically will work over time

You can't suddenly phase the h1b people out, internally you can imagine the politics that will go on for job preservation, a lot of delay tactics will be used.

I think these tech guys need to organise a parallel system to make hiring seamless for American citizens, in the way the Indian body shops have, because from what I can see the Indians really really want the American dream and we'll use the advantage of being in the system

 

[BrigSmart]

"Brain Drain from India"? Now that's a real copium! You know you guys have too many people to absorb--just like Pakistan's situation.
As to this debate, my guess is companies will figure out a way to mostly bypass the restrictions being imposed even though I don't see Trump will face major court challenges. He has been using Executive Orders a lot and getting away with them.

You seriously think India cannot absorb the top 500 IIT graduates, who mostly leave India, in its own economy of almost 1.5 billion ? Even outside the very top people , the quality of Indians on H1B is good enough that they will all easily find employment in India.

Trump has already withdrawn the most substantive parts of the order even without a court fight. Everyone who already has a visa is , and will stay, exempt from the order. I don't know how deep your knowledge of US Constitutional Law is, but this is the EO with probably the weakest legal basis he has issued. If he had banned entry for certain nationalities or those meeting reasonable criteria he would have stood a chance . But he is going far beyond that, far beyond even a blanket entry ban for all foreigners, because the power to raise and spend money is indisputably solely with Congress .

 

[vasanthm]

I don't blame the Indians for jumping the ship (aircraft in this case): India is very unlivable country, even for the rich!

It's quite luxurious if you are upper middle class and above