From Absolutely Not to America Please?

[mythbuster]

Men of substance like Manekshaw grab opportunities to become written in history, how many else can claim to be creators of one of the largest nations on earth.

Defeating Pakistan in east Pakistan was not much of a military accomplishment .....even a subedar in command of the Indian army could have done that.....my respect for Manekshaw is for his strength of character and for being an honourable soldier.

 

[dabbu]

Pakistanis have enough heroes to admire and emulate. Founders of Bangladesh, Mujib and Bhutto are not considered as such.

No one credits Manekshaw for Bangladesh in India. They all firmly believe that it was an ambition of 2 Pakistanis that created Bangladesh.

Ive heard of Punjabi heroes like Maharaja Ranjit Singh if thats what you allude to.

As for Manekshaw, that guy needs no introduction, i shall leave here the words of famous Jinnah biographer Stanley Wolport-
“Stanley Wolpert is most known for his biography "Jinnah of Pakistan" and a quote about leadership: "Few individuals significantly alter the course of history. Fewer still modify the map of the world.".”
That parsi field marshal created the two most powerful muslim entities single handedly alone.

 

[dabbu]

Defeating Pakistan in east Pakistan was not much of a military accomplishment .....even a subedar in command of the Indian army could have done that.....my respect for Manekshaw is for his strength of character and for being an honourable soldier.

We can agree on the character part

 

[El Sidd]

Ive heard of Punjabi heroes like Maharaja Ranjit Singh if thats what you allude to.

As for Manekshaw, that guy needs no introduction, i shall leave here the words of famous Jinnah biographer Stanley Wolport-
“Stanley Wolpert is most known for his biography "Jinnah of Pakistan" and a quote about leadership: "Few individuals significantly alter the course of history. Fewer still modify the map of the world.".”

You would need to introduce Manekshaw to 99 percent of Pakistanis and Bangladeshis.

Why don't you try and convince your own kind that Manekshaw created Bangladesh?

 

[dabbu]

You would need to introduce Manekshaw to 99 percent of Pakistanis and Bangladeshis.

Why don't you try and convince your own kind that Manekshaw created Bangladesh?

Nothing that I need to do, historians on either side bear the responsibility of schooling the new generation.

“Joi Sam Bahadur” kinda Slogans in primary school history would suffice.

 

[Blain2]

Sir - The hypocrisies and U turns of PTI are not anything new -- However, there is no justification for the sort of political persecution we all witnessed, either. The military should have respected the constitutional rights of people.

I believe that this is one of those threads which we all'd rather avoid.

Memories are either too short or realities not known. Look up the 1970-71 crises or the MRD movement. In both of those cases, the political "persecution" was far worse. I am not supportive of jailing IK and launching all these witch-hunts against dissent, however, unfortunately, in Pakistan, a lot of this is not unprecedented.

 

[El Sidd]

Nothing that I need to do, historians on either side bear the responsibility of schooling the new generation.

“Joi Sam Bahadur” kinda Slogans in primary school history would suffice.

You want historians to teach Pakistanis that Manekshaw created Bangladesh and take away their 'heroes' something you already accused me for.

 

[Blain2]

In general, anytime we have our politicians turn to external powers for support on the internal political landscape, it is bad for the country. This goes both ways. Even when military is looking for support for its extra-constitutional acts and the politicians looking for someone outside of the country to reign in their tormentors at home.
Our people have to learn to manage our politics locally.
Who wants the US or ANY other country including KSA etc. to be the arbiter?
These PTI walay, and prior PPP, PML-N, and MQM have all engaged in this foreign nonsense. However, bringing the Americans has only been the forte of the PPP and PTI.
What would be the cost of such support?

 

[Blain2]

You want historians to teach Pakistanis that Manekshaw created Bangladesh and take away their 'heroes' something you already accused me for.

Over-hyped Indian propaganda. In the history of India, the natives have surrendered far more times with far better odds than the hand that our troops were dealt.

 

[El Sidd]

In general, anytime we have our politicians turn to external powers for support on the internal political landscape, it is bad for the country. This goes both ways. Even when military is looking for support for its extra-constitutional acts and the politicians looking for someone outside of the country to reign in their tormentors at home.
Our people have to learn to manage our politics locally.
Who wants the US or ANY other country including KSA etc. to be the arbiter?
These PTI walay, and prior PPP, PML-N, and MQM have all engaged in this foreign nonsense. However, bringing the Americans has only been PPP and PTI.
What would be the cost of this support?

United Kingdom is the only entity which holds sway in Pakistani politics.

 

[El Sidd]

Over-hyped Indian propaganda. In the history of India, the natives have surrendered far more times with far better odds than the hand that our troops were dealt.

Indians are not known to be shy nor humble, the member made no mistake in saying that Manekshaw was not a native either.

I think with Simla agreement in question, Pakistan should revisit sending back those 90k soldiers back to Bengal.

 

[dabbu]

You want historians to teach Pakistanis that Manekshaw created Bangladesh and take away their 'heroes' something you already accused me for.

What I want doesn’t matter brother.

Theres a history for the current state Pakistanis to teach their kids, its up to them to decide how they find their own heroes and villains .

Then their is the history of the world taht will be taught.

Lastly, their is the history ex-Pakistani Bangladeshis will teach their kids.

If it were up to me, I would dedicate a short chapter in ex-Pakistani history to the pauper Parsi Manekshaw. I would title it-“FM Manekshaw-Veni, Vidi Vici”.

Cheers!

 

[El Sidd]

What I want doesn’t matter brother.

Theres a history for the current state Pakistanis to teach their kids, its up to them to decide how they find their own heroes and villains .

Then their is the history of the world taht will be taught.

Lastly, their is the history ex-Pakistani Bangladeshis will teach their kids.

If it were up to me, I would dedicate a short chapter in ex-Pakistani history to the pauper Parsi Manekshaw. I would title it-“FM Manekshaw-Veni, Vidi Vici”.

Cheers!

If victors do write history, where is mention of India in Bangladesh? They seem more dedicated to the chicken neck than any Manekshaw bakht.

 

[dabbu]

If victors do write history, where is mention of India in Bangladesh? They seem more dedicated to the chicken neck than any Manekshaw bakht.

I can tell you are only aware of west Pakistan propaganda all your life when you raise that kinda question.

Ill guide you as much as I can, but remember it’s your primary responsibility to dig thru to the truth.

To help you along the journey to truth, might I suggest reading up on Bangladesh’s national holiday, Bijoy Diwas on December 16th every year, where the og banglas award Indian soldiers for liberation from an israel-esque genocide.

 

[El Sidd]

I can tell you are only aware of west Pakistan propaganda all your life when you raise that kinda question.

Ill guide you as much as I can, but remember it’s your primary responsibility to dig thru to the truth.

To help you along the journey to truth, might I suggest reading up on Bangladesh’s national holiday, Bijoy Diwas on December 16th every year, where the og banglas award Indian soldiers for liberation from an israel-esque genocide.

Do they also claim India created Bangladesh? It's a simple question