Hangor Class Submarine | Updates & Discussion
- Thread starter ghazi52
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blueboy7862
Registered Member
and we are not in a state of naval war.
Yasser76
Elite Member
PN will need time.. We will need to train at least 16 crews (2 per sub). That is over 570 men.
Take into account land based engineers, mechanics, support staff, maybe we may need over 1,000 trained men to handle all 8 subs.
Pakistan Navy only has 30,000 men. So a full 3% of our entire navy , possibly more, will be part of operating these machines. They will have to be housed and fed and looked after near the bases.
They will need to be trained on very advanced equipment and weaponry and reach a standard where we can confidently send them out in patrol in the Indian Ocean with US, Iranian, Indian and others lurking around.
This will be now easy or short task....
Take into account land based engineers, mechanics, support staff, maybe we may need over 1,000 trained men to handle all 8 subs.
Pakistan Navy only has 30,000 men. So a full 3% of our entire navy , possibly more, will be part of operating these machines. They will have to be housed and fed and looked after near the bases.
They will need to be trained on very advanced equipment and weaponry and reach a standard where we can confidently send them out in patrol in the Indian Ocean with US, Iranian, Indian and others lurking around.
This will be now easy or short task....
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kimjongun
Registered Member
New storage sites , Fuel barrows , Dry docks , C2 centers
New comms and a lot of other facilites will be needed and built .
Yasser76
Elite Member
Yup, all of that stuff i did not even mention. You are right, this is not just 8 subs, infrastructure wise this is probably one of the largest projects PN may have undertaken in it's history. Normal surface warships require much less support
Starlord
Trusted Member
I think PN realize and rightly so that they can not match with IN surface fleet, so they decided to do the next best thing which was creating a powerful submarine fleet and coastal defense batteries to keep IN ships from completely blocking the Karachi port. With these subs we can set up ambushes for IN ships and if we get lucky we may even build a new coral home for millions of fishes with INS Vikramaditya AC.
But now as the subs will be coming soon, I think we need to full operationalize Gwadar port and create a alternative in case Karachi comes under fire we can use Gwadar port to keep the country alive, we should also look towards under ground sub bases which can survive initial attacks and even nuclear weapons, and lastly which should be put on priority is to raise a dedicated naval Air arm sq, with J-10CE or JF-17 block 3's, not from PAF but Navy's own sq which they use for Anti-ship and air to air roles.
AZADPAKISTAN2009
Elite Member
Should have been possible
-4 Subs in Pakistan
-4 Subs in China
However I think we currently don't have Capacity to build 4 Subs at once
Focus had been also on the Milgem "Corvettes" or Jinnah Class Frigates
Our Current development efforts are pretty ok for Nation , in early periods of Submarine development
Still 4 new Submarines should be great acquisition
Well during world war 2 , 1000+ ships were Floating around oceans in Pacific , almost all resources were being used to build ships (I think around Japan) , near end of conflict
-4 Subs in Pakistan
-4 Subs in China
However I think we currently don't have Capacity to build 4 Subs at once
Focus had been also on the Milgem "Corvettes" or Jinnah Class Frigates
Our Current development efforts are pretty ok for Nation , in early periods of Submarine development
Still 4 new Submarines should be great acquisition
Well during world war 2 , 1000+ ships were Floating around oceans in Pacific , almost all resources were being used to build ships (I think around Japan) , near end of conflict
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Aamir Hussain
THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
We are not in the "Early" development phase of submarine ops. We have been operating sub since the 60's.
The issue is absorption rate.....Human Resource, Docking infra, vibrant Maint. & Service Support Program, and overall logistics and supply infra. We have never absorbed more than 1 sub per two years. We will have some trained manpower to man the sub fleet once we will let go of the two older Agosta 70's. PN must have increased its intake of officer and ratings to ensure proper absorption of 6 more subs., and 2 more Corvettes.
We are already at an all time peak numbers of our surface force and very soon, our sub surface force. PN has its hands full, I believe.
The issue is absorption rate.....Human Resource, Docking infra, vibrant Maint. & Service Support Program, and overall logistics and supply infra. We have never absorbed more than 1 sub per two years. We will have some trained manpower to man the sub fleet once we will let go of the two older Agosta 70's. PN must have increased its intake of officer and ratings to ensure proper absorption of 6 more subs., and 2 more Corvettes.
We are already at an all time peak numbers of our surface force and very soon, our sub surface force. PN has its hands full, I believe.
kmc_chacko
Registered Member
PN presently operates 5 subs and by 2030 PN will be replacing all of them with 8 Hangor class subs and as of now PN has not disclosed any other plans for induct more subs.
Whereas by 2030 IN will be having 6 Scorpène-class submarine and 6 Type-214 under production, further IN will be either inducting or building indigenous SSKs, SSNs along with larger SSBNs.
If Pakistan plans have a powerful submarine to counter IN surface fleet then PN needs to inducts more Subs in short time.
Problem with PN is who is going to finance it, IN is getting more attention and funding, whereas PN is in short of funding.
Yasser76
Elite Member
Pipe down.
3 Agosta AIP subs have been upgraded. PN will field 11 AIP subs.
Talks in place for Turkish options.
IN has not even signed for Type 214 yet, in your fantasy they are already inducted in 4 years?
Right now IN is relying on ancient submarines (Kilos and Type 209s) that are over 30 years old, only had 6 modern subs, even these have no AIP.
Go read some more then post on here....
kimjongun
Registered Member
Indian VDAM on Indian ASW systems , its capabilities and remarks on hangor SSKs ( 23:55) .
-he said something about how ASW is always weighted infavour of subs in the Indian ocean due to geography or something and how IN is trying to balance this ratio , Can somebody explain how is that so?
- Never thought about the "out admiral them"
Dalit
Elite Member
We can be any moment. India often threatens Karachi.
Dalit
Elite Member
You don't worry about the funding, Indian. Didn't Pakistan get the J-10C and shoot down Rafale fighters in front of the whole world? Pakistan is working day and night to address India.
the PN has 5 subs currently.
3 will remain.
8 will be inducted
5 of the fincantieri S800's will be inducted (most probably)*.
The winner (fincantieri) will then support the PN's original submarine program.
16 SSK's, all AIP equipped, supported by a longer term follow up order of more SSK's.
Sounds pretty well countered to me.
*fincanteri has a base at PMSTP alongside Damen. Only logical reason to set that up would be to provide long term support/design assistance to the PN for their platforms. S800 is a great boat, Fuel Cell AIP, sensors and systems from the U212. Oh and not to mention, the U212NFS was presented at IDEAS on offer to the Pak Navy.
The next gen sub program will build on that. Probably some of the most capable electric boats to exist will be used as the basis for the PN's submarine prog.
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hasssanali8998
Elite Member
any timeline on this i havent seen much on it , also are these small subs because i honestly think that is the wayfor pn , to go small but many subs to perform area denial while 8 hangors used for offensive ops
