I invite Iran loving Pakistani members to explain this

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Karabakh is internationally recognized as Azerbaijani territory by every country, not "disputed" but clear recognition. This was the case even when it was under occupation. Btw, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia refused to even recognize Armenia because of it , while Turkey closed its borders with Armenia.

Iran on the other hand became a lifeline for Armenia which were blockaded from two sides. So Iran clearly didn’t mind occupation of Azerbaijani territories, as even closing the Armenian border like Turkey would have made it alot harder for Armenian occupiers. Instead, Iran assisted Armenia with fuel etc.

But also it gets more tricky:

Armenia not only occupied the Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Oblast of Soviet Azerbaijan (75% Armenian and 25% Azerbaijani), but also 7 adjacent districts outside of NKAO, which were more than twice the size of NKAO itself and had zero Armenian population, but home to 500 thousand Azerbaijanis (entire Armenian population of NKAO was 150 thousand, while Azerbaijanis numbered 45 thousands).

The boundaries of NKAO did not reach Iranian border, so this sign was placed on a Azerbaijani district from which Azerbaijanis were ethnically cleansed from. Iran saw no problem with this.

Pink is former NKAO, red is Azerbaijani districts outside of it that were occupied (yellow is part of districts that remained under Azerbaijani control after the first war in 90s).

View attachment 211657

This is for example how Chaitumas village of Qubadli was occupied:

View attachment 211656

Check where it is located in relation to Iran border.


Irani regime has nothing but a destabilizing force to everyone around.
No matter which fire you check, you will find Iranian influence in it.
 
Did you just read what he had to say about us Turks?
No Turks would even say this about Pakistanis. And here you are targeting me.
Again , this guy is a moron and a Shia ... deadly combination ....he is cursing all the Sunnis , are you going to make a judgement taking his posts as a yardstick to measure Pakistan's friendship with Turkey?
 
Again , this guy is a moron and a Shia ... deadly combination ....he is cursing all the Sunnis , are you going to make a judgement taking his posts as a yardstick to measure Pakistan's friendship with Turkey?
How the hell would I know he is an Shia though?
 
it is quite evident for any sane person that the Armenians (there are significant Armenian communities in the Arab world - many fled and were welcomed by Arabs during the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire - as far as KSA - they are mainly based in Lebanon though and overall have not been a problem - similarly we have many more Turkmen (actually mostly Azerbaijanis not Turkmen from Turkmenistan in Arab countries like Iraq and Syria and even also in KSA and elsewhere) were the aggressors in the early 1990's and that they committed horrible massacres against Azeri people.

Religion here is irrelevant when it comes to determining who is in the wrong albeit every conflict tends to be complex and multilayered.

I also don't understand how sane persons (apparently) can equal entire peoples and countries with ruling regimes.

Also it is not about Sunni or Shia - there are many Sunni Azerbaijanis (most sources claim 35-40% of the population) and there are even Muslim Armenians in the Arab world.

Iran like usual (since 1979 - most of the time) have had a double-faced regional policy and duplicitous and mostly negative one. Wherever they have meddled mostly only misery has followed.

Which is absurd considering the fact that Azeris are the second largest ethnic group in Iran, majority Shia Muslim etc.

But anyone familiar with Iranian history since the Safavids and their forceful conversions and familiar with internal Iranian dynamics and the Iranian regime since 1979 will now that contradictions is the key word and description for that regime and their policies.

And truth be told many Armenians unfortunately have anti-Muslim sentiments (mostly aimed at Turks for historical reasons that most people know about), even the Armenians that were welcomed by Arab Muslims and now live in Arab countries.

A good example is this Armenian Syrian pro-Al-Assad regime troll


who had the audacity some time ago (1.5-2 years ago - I even countered him directly) and claimed that Armenians have more of an ownership of Syria than Arabs despite Arabs being indigenous to the Levant and having an over 3000 + year old recorded presence in Syria itself.

To no surprise that troll is an Iranian regime fanboy, Russia fanboy and anti-current Syrian government. For some strange reason he is not anti-Arab overall (anti-KSA for example) but that does not make him any less of a hypocrite.

Unfortunately such Armenians (loud mouths) damage the reputations of Armenians who overall share a lot with us Middle Easterners/West Asians.

Again , this guy is a moron and a Shia ... deadly combination ....he is cursing all the Sunnis , are you going to make a judgement taking his posts as a yardstick to measure Pakistan's friendship with Turkey?
Can we stop equating online idiots with Shia Islam and Shias? There are millions of normal Shia Muslims, Shia Arabs, Saudi Arabian Shias who are nothing like this. Suffice to say that Shia Islam and all its sects originate in modern-day KSA and that the doctrinal differences are overall small despite some obvious disagreements with mainstream Islam and Muslims (90% - Sunni Islam).

It is just that a sizable portion of Shias nowadays have some kind of sickness (cult) where they equate the Iranian regime with some holy regime and take them as literal Gods. So whatever Iran does, they have to support whether it is carpet bombing innocent civilians in Syria or even Iranian support against Shia Muslims (Azeris) themselves.

They do not have an ownership of Shia Islam anymore than anyone else has an ownership of Sunni Islam, Islam as a whole or other sects. At the end of the day we are only responsible for our own actions, deeds and actions. There is no guilt by association based on nationality, ethnicity or even sect.

Plenty of retarded Sunni Muslims as well like in every community in the world.

I have dealt with such Shia Arabs (luckily a tiny minority) in person and online and I have concluded that they are out of any pedagogical reach like other cultists. Reason does not work with them and they also shamelessly and falsely equate Iran (the state) with Shia Islam itself which is also as cultish and nonsensical.
 
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You are constantly maligning Sunnis , Knock it off dude... it's a rabbit hole where you have slim chances of survival.
Well the “Sunnis” should stopcmaking these dog whistle threads against Shias. Do you think we’re stupid at how some members specifically Pakistanis on the defense pact thread explicitly targeting Shias.
Survival? I think I’ll manage but thanks for the heads up, fkn n*gga
 
Again , this guy is a moron and a Shia ... deadly combination ....he is cursing all the Sunnis , are you going to make a judgement taking his posts as a yardstick to measure Pakistan's friendship with Turkey?

Being a Shia should not mean being a slave of a two-faced regime that doesn’t even adhere to its own stated ideology, and resorts to Persian ethno-nationalism at times (one can say they have strayed quite a bit from Khomeini’s line). And Persian ethno-nationalism is not even the only problem with it, but that would be Iran’s internal affairs so un-related.

These people curse Yazid, yet resemble Yazid much more than they resemble Shia Imams in their deeds.

This Karabakh thing btw is nothing compared to what Iran did in Syria and how it is directly responsible for deaths of hundreds of thousands of Syrians and displacement of millions, as you also know. @_Arabia_

I doubt Imam Hussain would have accepted those who have stained their hands in blood of hundreds of thousands of innocent Syrian as his own people.
 
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it is quite evident for any sane person that the Armenians (there are significant Armenian communities in the Arab world - many fled and were welcomed by Arabs during the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire - as far as KSA - they are mainly based in Lebanon though and overall have not been a problem - similarly we have many more Turkmen (actually mostly Azerbaijanis not Turkmen from Turkmenistan in Arab countries like Iraq and Syria and even also in KSA and elsewhere) were the aggressors in the early 1990's and that they committed horrible massacres against Azeri people.

Religion here is irrelevant when it comes to determining who is in the wrong albeit every conflict tends to be complex and multilayered.

I also don't understand how sane persons (apparently) can equal entire peoples and countries with ruling regimes.

Also it is not about Sunni or Shia - there are many Sunni Azerbaijanis (most sources claim 35-40% of the population) and there are even Muslim Armenians in the Arab world.

Iran like usual (since 1979 - most of the time) have had a double-faced regional policy and duplicitous and mostly negative one. Wherever they have meddled mostly only misery has followed.

Which is absurd considering the fact that Azeris are the second largest ethnic group in Iran, majority Shia Muslim etc.

But anyone familiar with Iranian history since the Safavids and their forceful conversions and familiar with internal Iranian dynamics and the Iranian regime since 1979 will now that contradictions is the key word and description for that regime and their policies.

And truth be told many Armenians unfortunately have anti-Muslim sentiments (mostly aimed at Turks for historical reasons that most people know about), even the Armenians that were welcomed by Arab Muslims and now live in Arab countries.

A good example is this Armenian Syrian pro-Al-Assad regime troll


who had the audacity some time ago (1.5-2 years ago - I even countered him directly) and claimed that Armenians have more of an ownership of Syria than Arabs despite Arabs being indigenous to the Levant and having an over 3000 + year old recorded presence in Syria itself.

To no surprise that troll is an Iranian regime fanboy, Russia fanboy and anti-current Syrian government. For some strange reason he is not anti-Arab overall (anti-KSA for example) but that does not make him any less of a hypocrite.

Unfortunately such Armenians (loud mouths) damage the reputations of Armenians who overall share a lot with us Middle Easterners/West Asians.


Can we stop equating online idiots with Shia Islam and Shias? There are millions of normal Shia Muslims, Shia Arabs, Saudi Arabian Shias who are nothing like this. Suffice to say that Shia Islam and all its sects originate in modern-day KSA and that the doctrinal differences are overall small despite some obvious disagreements with mainstream Islam and Muslims (90% - Sunni Islam).

It is just that a sizable portion of Shias nowadays have some kind of sickness (cult) where they equate the Iranian regime with some holy regime and take them as literal Gods. So whatever Iran does, they have to support whether it is carpet bombing innocent civilians in Syria or even Iranian support against Shia Muslims (Azeris) themselves.

I have dealt with such Shia Arabs (luckily a tiny minority) in person and online and I have concluded that they are out of any pedagogical reach like other cultists. Reason does not work with them and they also shamelessly and falsely equate Iran (the state) with Shia Islam itself which is also as cultish and nonsensical.

Oh the Arab Hasbara troll is here too.

 
Not a Shia though. I’m a Sufi belonging to the Suhrawardiyya order. I just hate that some members target other Muslims.
You are a pathetic lair , I remember clearly you confessed to be a Shia here on PDF..... you are not worth interacting with.
 
Not a Shia though. I’m a Sufi belonging to the Suhrawardiyya order. I just hate that some members target other Muslims.
No one targeted you. You just attacked all Turks for no reason .
 
Oh the Arab Hasbara troll is here too.

Fake news and Middle East Eye is not a serious source when it comes to KSA. Besides of what, whatever you and anyone can say, KSA is one of the few countries in the world never to have recognized Israel since the first day. We have zero economic, people to people ties with them despite many Israeli Jews (Yemeni/South Saudi Arabian) being form modern-day KSA (Najran, Asir, Jizan). We went to 2 wars against Israel (1948 and 1973) and KSA was behind the main economic Western boycott (Arab oil embargo) that crippled the Western economies.


And there is no hiding that Israel itself, 20-25% of its population is composed of Israeli Arabs (Palestinian Arabs - Bedouins included) and that 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews.


In many ways, if you remove the Eastern European (Ashkenazi component who on average are 45-50% Middle Eastern in terms of ancestry) it is an internal Arab conflict between two adherents of 3 Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam).

Truth be told, modern-day Israel has not hurt KSA either. It is also a reality that Israel is here to stay and that we as Arabs need to find a solution to live in peace for mutual benefit once the Palestinian rights have been given and a one-state solution (with equal rights) or a just two-state solution emerges.

Unlike idiots like you (which is also contrary to Islamic teachings but I seriously doubt that you are even a Shia Muslim), we cannot hate entire peoples and Jews (people of the book - Prophet Muhammad (saws) married a Jewish lady himself as did many other well-known Islamic personalities, because of the actions of Zionists or an regime. There are plenty of Arab Israeli Jews who are vocal and against current and past Israeli policies and Jews in the West.

In any case, I struggle to see what Israel and KSA has to do with the topic of this thread and Armenian massacres on mostly Shia Azerbaijanis?

Or was it just because what I wrote about your likes is the truth and nothing but the truth and that is why you took it personally and started the trolling?

In any case there are some users who know me and have known me here for many years and they will all confirm that the last thing I am is some imaginary Hasbara or pro-Israel (LOL) and that has never changed. But that is very different from not admitting the facts that I wrote above or wanting perpetual conflict forever in the region. Nor am I going to deny that Arabs and Jews (real ones) are cousins and closely related peoples. In fact some of the most famous Jewish historical personalities such as Herod the Great and much further back, were fully ethnic Arabs who just happened to follow Judaism (followers of another closely related Semitic native religion). So no, I don't hate other people just because they happen to be Jews or want them killed. Goes for all other people. Unless they are attacking/trying to kill me and hurt me. Just like I have no problem at all with Shias or even non-Muslims unless they are hostile. Maybe such concepts are strange to you but this is your problem.
 
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You are a pathetic lair , I remember clearly you confessed to be a Shia here on PDF..... you are not worth interacting with.
I agree with you. And I am sorry for what I said. I will watch out for these people next time. Their whole game is to try divide our friendship.
 
You are a pathetic lair , I remember clearly you confessed to be a Shia here on PDF..... you are not worth interacting with.
Yes I have said that in the past but I became disillusioned with the organized part of it. It didn’t answer all of my spiritual questions so I started exploring other sects. I found Sufism the most obvious choice for me after going through a personal tragedy. It bridge the gap in terms of esoteric Islamic beliefs that aren’t as mainstream in 90% of the Muslim world.
I maybe an a**hole but I’m not a liar.
 
Like you, our neighbours hate Turks.. and they suffer by non-Turks while blaming the Turks.
Not our problem man. lol
Nobody hates Turks. You confuse criticism of policies with condemnation of entire nation.
 
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