India Lucky Not To Lose More Than Four Rafales

[Toxic]

11 bases "destroyed" (They didn't even hit 11 bases), these guys are chest thumping about Rahim yar Khan airport being closed, A civilian airport that hasn't had a flight since 2023

 

[Thinking]

You launched missiles. That's literally all you did.

You keep using massively generous wording.

Take out awacs? you launched missiles that might have created some debris that required some body work and a paint job. I'm not even validating that claim, I'm just saying that's the most that would have happened

Both sides launched things. That's literally what happened? What is your point? Now you are arguing for sake of it, without having a shred of evidence to prove or disprove your point!
I didn't make any claims. I am merely asking for Pakistan to line all their AWACS, to prove India wrong. This is what Pakistan is asking from India! All planes there, lies shot down.
Debating for the sake of it is pointless.

 

[Toxic]

Both sides launched things. That's literally what happened? What is your point? Now you are arguing for sake of it, without having a shred of evidence to prove or disprove your point!
I didn't make any claims. I am merely asking for Pakistan to line all their AWACS, to prove India wrong. This is what Pakistan is asking from India! All planes there, lies shot down.
Debating for the sake of it is pointless.

Again, Do you have a photo of single Destroyed AWAC? Did IAF make claims of destroying AWACs? We have photos and 30 minute long videos of downed Indian jets. So it's very much possible that more Indian jets were downed.

 

[Toxic]

Look what kind of treasure I found.

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[baqai]

Right after Pakistan does the same for all it's assets? India lied about destroying AWACS, no? Line them up for photo shoot and prove India wrong! Ah, the onus is one sided. For rest, trust me bro!

unlike you guys, we accept that the airbase was hit, the AWACS was damaged and was later on repaired, three airforce personal achieved shahadaat, unlike IAF we don't hide our martyrs, also we will gladly line them up but once how about you guys get your act straight everyone is giving a different statement so first make up your mind on what bollywood movie you guys wanna make out of this

 

[gamaji]

What else in your inventory would reach at least Sirsa if not an SRBM? As I said, most of your missiles are for nuke delivery which is why you only had rockets to fire. India fired no rockets or SRBMs. Air-to-air missiles weren't fired because there was no air combat, PAF just fired upon our jets in desperation for a war trophy. If they could shoot down our planes that easily they would've done that on 7th on the strike package or on 10th. They couldn't.

You ask this question to Doval. The question is not how we did it. The fact is we did it. And that matters. You will get more information when we hit deeper in India the next time.

I am talking about the jets that went down, if PAF had the capability they would've defended itself from Indian strikes, instead of attacking aircrafts performing CAP over places far away from the attacks. The shear number of PL-15s fired is good example.

Again, it does not really matter how many of PL-15s were fired. All we need to know is if they were able to bring enemy fighter jets. That's what they did. Beyond that, we don't need to reveal anything.

BrahMos was used on first day, and it wasn't the only thing which was used, Rampage, SCALP, Crystal Maze, HAMMER and all were used. As I said, pakistan's missiles are largely meant as nuke carriers, leaving behind fewer conventional options. A rocket is never going to make anyone run for ceasefire, especially since they have large CEPs. India didn't use MBRLs either due to it being an area weapon.

And yet Indians were able to make a runway crater at an airbase and indirectly hit a workshop at another. Good achievement by Indian standards, I believe.

 

[Toxic]

You ask this question to Doval. The question is not how we did it. The fact is we did it. And that matters. You will get more information when we hit deeper in India the next time.

Again, it does not really matter how many of PL-15s were fired. All we need to know is if they were able to bring enemy fighter jets. That's what they did. Beyond that, we don't need to reveal anything.

And yet Indians were able to make a runway crater at an airbase and indirectly hit a workshop at another. Good achievement by Indian standards, I believe.

Maybe he should ask the IAF how many PL-15s were used.

 

[gamaji]

Look what kind of treasure I found.

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And those decoys had Rafale jet's engine, wings, and missiles tied to their rear so that these Rafale parts were sprayed onto the ground when PL-15s hit them.

 

[Toxic]

And that decoys had Rafale jet's engine, wings, and missiles tied to their rear so that these Rafale parts were sprayed onto the ground when PL-15s hit them.

These 30kg drones use ancient Vedic mimicking tech that can turn it's debris into Rafale parts, truly the perfect trick.

 

[gamaji]

I guess you have lost your thinking hat again. Any wonder your humiliated and defeated Netas are hell bent to keep you under a stone. Maybe your Netas live in a parralel universe hence they are oblivious to what your armed forces have suffered.
Before electioneering, he should have listened to the in-house Basanti .

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Let's hope this shameless dude Doval can convince the French too of his shitty lies.

 

[Oscar]

Thank you for the response, Oscar.
I understand the technical terms pretty well. I may not be an expert, but I have enough relevant knowledge. The statement you made above was made by Dar after the 6/7 May strikes by India. "Pakistan only targeted the Indian jets which emptied their loads on Pakistani civilian sites."


Correct, this is precisely what I am asking. When their eyes and ears were degraded, i.e., their system jammed, why were they allowed to attack Pakistan instead of being killed by the PAF before they could attack?



You are confirming exactly what I am arguing. The reason behind the reluctance to destroy the enemy to the extent that it deters him from attacking you again in the foreseeable future was plainly the overthinking of the escalation ladder.
My point is simple: that is wrong thinking and a wrong plan of action. You have just moved today's problem towards tomorrow. That's not dealing with the problem; it is just avoiding it. Without thinking that it is a cotton wool ball, it is getting bigger, not reducing in size and danger.

A fighter who lets his opponent off the canvas too many times faces real danger of being knocked out himself.




True.

Because unless a weapon is fired - there is no aggression yet.

As for your poetic prose at the end. Only those fighters have that luxury who have a united family and bank accounts backing them.

Beggars cannot be choosers of moments

 

[CallSignMaverick]

Ambush, really? So either you are lying or your forces are lying when they said they were targeting places in Pakistan which ended in your planes getting shot down.

The level of lying here.... gosh...

If PAF could, they would've attacked the strike package and not random IAF jets doing sorties over J&K. They didn't.

Ambushing？

Are you suggesting that the J-10C should dogfight with Indian aircraft?

View attachment 134445

Yes, otherwise attacking random aircrafts isn't giving them any advantage, couldn't stop Indian strike packages on 7th, couldn't do that on 10th either. Although yes, it does give a wartrophy for locals who are obsessed with aircraft losses as a sign of victory in general.

And yet Indians were able to make a runway crater at an airbase and indirectly hit a workshop at another. Good achievement by Indian standards, I believe.

And you think it's a small issue? A crater on runway leaves it inoperable for a decently long time, hindering the very usage of the airbase for takeoff and landing of aircrafts. If this major vulnerability sounds small to you, good luck then.

 

[r3alist]

Both sides launched things. That's literally what happened? What is your point? Now you are arguing for sake of it, without having a shred of evidence to prove or disprove your point!
I didn't make any claims. I am merely asking for Pakistan to line all their AWACS, to prove India wrong. This is what Pakistan is asking from India! All planes there, lies shot down.
Debating for the sake of it is pointless.

I will have to confess that I can argue for the sake of it

What I meant to say was the whole reason any missiles are being launched is meant to be counter terrorism..... Everyone has very quickly lost sight of the fact that this was meant to be India's motivation


Because all everyone is talking about is a conventional and limited military exchange, the whole degrading terrorist infrastructure is forgotten and now it's about calling nuclear bluffs



It's this attempt at being too cute and crafty, trying to pass off one thing as in fact something totally the other, is what no one is buying, it's a totally reasonable response from the rest of the world, you can't start attempting attacking nuclear infrastructure without very very good reason

 

[Rational Philosopher]

Pakistan's main claim was shooting down IAF aircrafts, all the kills were scored over on Indian side at BVR distance.
To lend support to Pakistani claims, plenty of footage and images emerged from India. India claims it destroyed 12 PAF aircraft, show one proof regarding this....all India has got to show for itself is the damaged hangar at one PAF Base.
Lately even the serial numbers of Rafales shot down have been released.
What's stopping India from lining up its Rafale fleet , if the count is there, it will only humilate Pakistan.... a win win situation for Indians and Shivangi Singh .

India didn't claim any PAF kills. Remember this is all the coping mechanism of the Jeet subhumans on Twitter, fake documents made on spreadsheet and random claims. Not a single official claim on kills against PAF has been made because they didn't get any.

 

[Alex]

Because unless a weapon is fired - there is no aggression yet.

As for your poetic prose at the end. Only those fighters have that luxury who have a united family and bank accounts backing them.

Beggars cannot be choosers of moments

Well.
What can I say now that you have quoted your PM, "Beggars cannot be choosers"?
As for aggression, I, for one, just don't get it. Let's say there is a man standing in front of you wielding a large knife in a very aggressive manner. What would you do?
As for "Unless a weapon is fired – there is no aggression yet." A complete misunderstanding of the international law was infused in the minds of Pakistanis by their leaders because they were reluctant to take action to save the lives of their innocent citizens.

Article 2(4) of the UN Charter​

All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.

All Pakistanis on the forum should read the article carefully, please. "threat or use of force". Therefore, Indians sending 72 fighter jets loaded with arms was a current and present threat and danger to the security, territorial integrity and sovereignty of Pakistan. Pakistan was within its legal rights to have shot down Indian jets, even all of them.

For further clarification, this concept of self-defence is derived from the famous Caroline case.

The traditional customary rules on preemptive self-defense derive from an early diplomatic incident between the United States and the United Kingdom over the killing of a US citizen (a Black American watchmaker named Amos Durfee) who was on board a ship (the Caroline), which was docked in the U.S. but which had been carrying personnel and stores of war to rebels in Canada, then a British colony. The U.S. government had not approved or supported the Caroline's activities and the ship was peacefully at anchor in the U.S. when British forces attacked, burned the ship and sent it over Niagara Falls. The so-called Caroline case established that in order for one state to use force in the territory of another state which had not used force first there had to exist "a necessity of self-defence, instant, overwhelming, leaving no choice of means, and no moment of deliberation.

Imminent threat

Imminent threat is a standard criterion in international law, developed by Daniel Webster as he litigated the Caroline affair. An imminent threat is "instant, overwhelming, and leaving no choice of means, and no moment for deliberation". This criterion is used in the international law justification of preemptive self-defense: self-defense without being physically attacked first