niubi
Registered Member
I just realised that India only has around 270 Su-30MKI.
With around 32 Rafales currently, that's barely over 300 more modern 4th and 4.5 gen fighters. Yeah there are some Mig-29s, older Su-30 and Mirage 2000s and lots more 3rd gens but most of those older 4th gens are so outdated for frontline fighting.
100 additional Rafales is not a surprising move seeing as India already said no to F-21 aka the upgraded F-16 and Typhoon. It has already committed to Rafale and there is no other 4.5 gen India can buy.
5th gen is a pipedream and AMCA is going to be a Tejas/Arjun program where they realise they have no ability and their airforce refuses to commit high numbers to a platform they know in their heart of hearts to be much worse than foreign 4.5 gens. IAF knows Tejas is only comparable to foreign 3rd gen and refuses. Stop making excuses claiming HAL can't build them. They can, they're just rubbish and Indian decision makers in their heart of hearts know they don't want Tejas.
Same for AMCA. Unlike with Indian consumer products where they can simply order parts from China and assemble, they can't do that with a fighter jet so it'll be purely Indian only and that's why the IAF will not want it. Perhaps future Indian government can force IAF to buy and use the AMCA. This will be such a blessing for Pakistan though as future AMCA will be easier to down than a Mig-29 fighting against 5th gens.
These bhakt clowns want to compare India with China. China has more J-20s (approaching 500 now) than entire Indian 4th gen fleet. J-35 already number in the dozen + and J-36 and J-50 6th gens both have more than 2 EMD prototypes each. IAF can barely compare with PAF, it's around 5% the size of PLAAF when we count China's UCAVs and all aircraft and 1% the capability of PLAAF.
Just comparing fighters since that's IAF relative strong suit seeing as it has barely MALE/HALE/UCAV, AWACs or EW aircraft that can compare with China's.
50 Mig29, 50 Mirage 2000, 32 to 34 Rafales (approx 133 light to medium total)
270 Su-30MKI (approx 270 heavies total)
Total of approx 400 with vast majority of this fleet being 1990s tech or 2000s at the best with MKI. Only 30 something Rafales with modern tech.
vs
550-600 J-10 aircraft (approx 600 total)
170 J-11B/BS/BG, 73 Su-30MKK, 24 Su-30MK2, 24 Su-35, 100 block 1 J-16, 100 block 2 J-16 and 200 block 3 J-16, >50 J-16D (actual numbers are closer to 100)
(approx 650 heavies total)
>450 J-20 including A, B and S variants
12 to 24 J-35
(approaching 500 5th gens)
Average rate of 5th gen production is currently >10/month for J-20 and between 5 and 10/month for J-35. Will be over 500 in no time if it isn't already and to 1000 within 5 years, before India gets another 100 Rafales from France, China would have added another 500 5th gens from its own many 5th gen production facilities.
Total of approx 1750 with majority being 4.5 gen and 5th gen. Over 500 4.5 gens compared to IAF's 30 something and nearly 500 5th gens compared to IAF's 0.
The only modern fighter IAF has are Rafales and they are more or less around J-10C level. I'm not even counting naval and China's UADFs which have been in tactic development level service as initial introduction and unit LRIP since 2024 if not earlier.
With 5th gens being such force multipliers, really the comparison is India's ~33 Rafales vs China's nearly 1000 J-10C, J-16, J-16D, J-35 and J-20.
All while China build well over 100 J-20 per year and gearing up to get past 150 to 200 J-35 per year rate as they have indicated J-35 is faster and cheaper to build than J-20 and there are several more factories for J-35 production. Also introducing two separate 6th gen fighters by early 2030s. GJ-11 land and carrier based already in MUMT with J-20S and land or sea based control and have been since 2019 introduction. Two fighter sized UADFs and more than 5 CCAs. While India can choose between Su-57 twin seater Russia is currently developing while buying more Rafales because it's the only choice in the 4.5 gen field. Oh there's Russia's Su-75 option but they haven't even got a flying prototype yet.
Bro this isn't just lapping you, contrary to the BS Indian fanboys have been saying non-stop about how great they are and how much better India is. This is absolute annihilation to the point India doesn't even bother outside of paying pathetic lip service to bhakt fanboys. India used to be leagues ahead of Pakistan, with ease. Now it's barely a few times PAF and probably less in overall capability.
With around 32 Rafales currently, that's barely over 300 more modern 4th and 4.5 gen fighters. Yeah there are some Mig-29s, older Su-30 and Mirage 2000s and lots more 3rd gens but most of those older 4th gens are so outdated for frontline fighting.
100 additional Rafales is not a surprising move seeing as India already said no to F-21 aka the upgraded F-16 and Typhoon. It has already committed to Rafale and there is no other 4.5 gen India can buy.
5th gen is a pipedream and AMCA is going to be a Tejas/Arjun program where they realise they have no ability and their airforce refuses to commit high numbers to a platform they know in their heart of hearts to be much worse than foreign 4.5 gens. IAF knows Tejas is only comparable to foreign 3rd gen and refuses. Stop making excuses claiming HAL can't build them. They can, they're just rubbish and Indian decision makers in their heart of hearts know they don't want Tejas.
Same for AMCA. Unlike with Indian consumer products where they can simply order parts from China and assemble, they can't do that with a fighter jet so it'll be purely Indian only and that's why the IAF will not want it. Perhaps future Indian government can force IAF to buy and use the AMCA. This will be such a blessing for Pakistan though as future AMCA will be easier to down than a Mig-29 fighting against 5th gens.
These bhakt clowns want to compare India with China. China has more J-20s (approaching 500 now) than entire Indian 4th gen fleet. J-35 already number in the dozen + and J-36 and J-50 6th gens both have more than 2 EMD prototypes each. IAF can barely compare with PAF, it's around 5% the size of PLAAF when we count China's UCAVs and all aircraft and 1% the capability of PLAAF.
Just comparing fighters since that's IAF relative strong suit seeing as it has barely MALE/HALE/UCAV, AWACs or EW aircraft that can compare with China's.
50 Mig29, 50 Mirage 2000, 32 to 34 Rafales (approx 133 light to medium total)
270 Su-30MKI (approx 270 heavies total)
Total of approx 400 with vast majority of this fleet being 1990s tech or 2000s at the best with MKI. Only 30 something Rafales with modern tech.
vs
550-600 J-10 aircraft (approx 600 total)
170 J-11B/BS/BG, 73 Su-30MKK, 24 Su-30MK2, 24 Su-35, 100 block 1 J-16, 100 block 2 J-16 and 200 block 3 J-16, >50 J-16D (actual numbers are closer to 100)
(approx 650 heavies total)
>450 J-20 including A, B and S variants
12 to 24 J-35
(approaching 500 5th gens)
Average rate of 5th gen production is currently >10/month for J-20 and between 5 and 10/month for J-35. Will be over 500 in no time if it isn't already and to 1000 within 5 years, before India gets another 100 Rafales from France, China would have added another 500 5th gens from its own many 5th gen production facilities.
Total of approx 1750 with majority being 4.5 gen and 5th gen. Over 500 4.5 gens compared to IAF's 30 something and nearly 500 5th gens compared to IAF's 0.
The only modern fighter IAF has are Rafales and they are more or less around J-10C level. I'm not even counting naval and China's UADFs which have been in tactic development level service as initial introduction and unit LRIP since 2024 if not earlier.
With 5th gens being such force multipliers, really the comparison is India's ~33 Rafales vs China's nearly 1000 J-10C, J-16, J-16D, J-35 and J-20.
All while China build well over 100 J-20 per year and gearing up to get past 150 to 200 J-35 per year rate as they have indicated J-35 is faster and cheaper to build than J-20 and there are several more factories for J-35 production. Also introducing two separate 6th gen fighters by early 2030s. GJ-11 land and carrier based already in MUMT with J-20S and land or sea based control and have been since 2019 introduction. Two fighter sized UADFs and more than 5 CCAs. While India can choose between Su-57 twin seater Russia is currently developing while buying more Rafales because it's the only choice in the 4.5 gen field. Oh there's Russia's Su-75 option but they haven't even got a flying prototype yet.
Bro this isn't just lapping you, contrary to the BS Indian fanboys have been saying non-stop about how great they are and how much better India is. This is absolute annihilation to the point India doesn't even bother outside of paying pathetic lip service to bhakt fanboys. India used to be leagues ahead of Pakistan, with ease. Now it's barely a few times PAF and probably less in overall capability.
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