Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

That is not the point of the critique that was originally proffered. That point being - that undue and targeted criticism of the religiosity of one belligerent appears to be inherently biased when the other belligerent is, at least, similarly zealous (and even eschatomaniacal).

I agree that the factors that warrant discussion that might actually determine the outcome of the conflict are virtually all non-religious in nature. At the same time, everyone in a warzone is likely to be appealing to some or the other perception of a higher power - one doesn't find many atheists in trenches.
The fact Iran bombs almost all Muslim countries including Turkey proves that’s not a religious war.
Ok people can argue the US, the Israeli start the war.
 
Massive beasts.
Though the concept of a strategic bomber is outdated. They are a thing of a cold war era when only a strategic bomber could deliver a strike at a long range.

Yeah but now they are carrying long range stealth cruise missiles like JASSMs right up to the border. I'm sure they are glad they still have these B-52s flying.


B-52H arms JASSM-ER Full revolver magazine: The most deadly revolver ever!​


In fact they are in the process of putting updated engines in them and I bet after this they'll make adjustments.
f130b52.webp
 
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So you would want to destroy the fishing industry, which currently produces over 400,000 tons annually, of which Iran is a major producer, to get oil to $140-200/bbl?

Brilliant.
So we should think about fishing while our children and civilians are being killed?

No, we should sacrifice the fishes, oil and our people to bring a change to the world.

We sacrificed already a lot against the Mongolians of our time (USraelis). What is happening now is nothing compared to what happened during past 47 years.
 
Then should we not cheer for peace rather than war?


dont confuse war outcomes with incompetence in our civil beaur.

wars happen, whether we like it or not..

for instance, after so much public outcry, we have proceeded to buy the jet?

how come?

likewise, stocking oil is a respon. of our gov.

so, are you telling me, to profit off shortage, is also a government business?

there are so many thing, I could identify, going beyond the scope of this thread

so, yes:

1. war should be avoided
2. incompetence should also not be rewarded
 
WaPo :

War with Iran spreading economic damage far beyond oil and gas markets​

Iranian missile and drone attacks have disrupted the flow of commerce through one of the global economy’s most critical hubs, paralyzing much of the ocean and air traffic that carries goods between Asia and Europe while punishing investors in faraway financial markets.

As the U.S.-Israeli assault on Iran enters a second week, the war’s economic casualties extend well beyond the oil and natural gas shipments that normally transit the Strait of Hormuz. The closure of several international airports in the conflict zone, including the world’s busiest in Dubai, idled nearly one-fifth of global airfreight capacity, interrupting shipments of consumer electronics, pharmaceuticals and precious metals.


But the pain is not being felt equally. The cost of shipping goods by air from Asia to Europe is up 45 percent since the war began, more than twice the increase for sending items from Asia to the United States, said Ryan Petersen, chief executive of Flexport, a freight forwarder and logistics company in San Francisco.

The shipping impact illustrates a broader economic truth: The war is hitting the economies of Europe and Asia harder and faster than it is striking the United States.

“Europe and Asia are heavily dependent on energy imports, so that alone makes them more vulnerable to negative macroeconomic spillovers from the Iran war,” said Maurice Obstfeld, former chief economist for the International Monetary Fund. “Being closer geographically to the hostilities also makes Europe and Asia more vulnerable to shock waves from the war.”
That does not mean Americans will escape unscathed. Gasoline prices now average $3.41 a gallon, up from $2.98 one week ago, according to AAA. Farmers face higher bills for critical crop nutrients, and additional supply chain headaches are certain if the Iran conflict continues longer than the Trump administration anticipates.

But for now, economies such as Italy, Belgium, China, India and South Korea, which are the most dependent on oil and gas shipments through the Strait of Hormuz, are feeling some of the worst effects. In February, inflation in the euro zone came in hotter than expected, and war-related energy bills are likely to make it worse. With QatarEnergy’s liquefied natural gas production shut down following Iranian attacks, European and Asian customers could be forced into a “bidding war” for available gas supplies, said TS Lombard in London.

Wall Street’s losses last week — the S&P 500 index dropped about 2 percent — were dwarfed by setbacks elsewhere. The South Korean stock market fell 20 percent before staging a mild rebound. India’s currency, the rupee, hit a more-than-half-century low against the dollar. India, which spends more than $32 billion annually subsidizing retail energy prices, is one of several Asian nations that are likely to see government finances come under strain in a lengthy war.


“Do not ignore the economic impact on Asia. If this is a protracted conflict, Asia is going to feel a very difficult sting out of this,” said Eric Robertsen, global head of research for Standard Chartered PLC in Dubai.
Tanker traffic through the strait is down 90 percent from prewar levels, according to MarineTraffic, a tracking service. On Thursday, the captain of an oil tanker anchored off Kuwait reported witnessing “a large explosion” off the vessel’s port side, which caused ballast water and a small amount of oil to spill into the northern Persian Gulf, said the U.K. Maritime Trade Operations Center.
A total of 57 container ships bearing goods for Middle Eastern customers or bound for global markets also are trapped inside the strait, according to Flexport. The immediate impact of that backlog is modest. The thousands of shipping containers they carry represent less than 1 percent of global capacity.

But dozens of other vessels are effectively quarantined in the northern gulf, loitering outside it or diverted to other ports in the region. The maritime traffic jam is starting to ripple through global supply lines. On Thursday, Maersk, one of the world’s largest ocean carriers, said it was suspending new bookings on almost all cargo in or out of the United Arab Emirates, Oman, Iraq, Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain and Saudi Arabia.

“Those containers will then just sit at origin ports around the world and not get loaded,” said Petersen of Flexport.
Fresh disruptions loomed Thursday after reports of an Iranian drone attack on Oman’s largest port, Salalah, on the Arabian Sea, and a civilian airport in Azerbaijan.Ask The Post AIDive deeper

MSC, another major carrier, last week said that containers in transit to the gulf would be diverted to the “next safe port.” The decision means businesses may suddenly find their goods dumped at ports far from their intended destination — with unexpected storage charges mounting by the day.
Certain products generally travel by air, which is faster but more expensive than the weeks-long sea voyages of container ships. Computer chips and other electronics, aerospace components, fast fashion, flowers and medical goods typically ride in the belly of passenger jets or on board dedicated freighters.

Air cargo thus far has been more heavily affected than seaborne shipments. Amid intense missile, drone and aircraft bombardments, several countries such as the UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, Kuwait, Iraq and Iran closed their airspace. A limited number of flights from the region have resumed, meaning a sharp reduction in cargo capacity.

For each week that air shipments are suspended, cargo carriers will need at least a week and a half to catch up, said Oscar de Bok, CEO of DHL Global Forwarding, which moves more than 2 million tons of airfreight annually.

“It all depends on the stability and how many drones are getting in,” he said. “This changes continuously. We need to constantly replan.”
The gap between available airfreight capacity and demand is leading to cargo backlogs in Southeast Asia and China, Stefan Paul, CEO of Kuehne + Nagel Management, a Swiss logistics giant, told investors on Tuesday. The emerging situation is “similar to the covid times,” he added.

Cargo aircraft are still flying between Asia and Europe. But planes that normally would stop in Dubai or Qatar are forced to take roundabout routes that require carrying more fuel, which further erodes freight capacity.

Aircraft originating in China and other parts of north Asia must fly a “meticulous route” over nations such as Turkmenistan, threading the needle between the Iranian battlefield to the south and prohibited Russian airspace to the north, said Brian Bourke, chief commercial officer for SEKO Logistics in Chicago.

“You can’t fly too north; you can’t fly too south,” he said.
The near-blockage of Persian Gulf oil shipments is sending jet fuel prices soaring, which will only add to air cargo bills. One European gauge of jet fuel prices is up 72 percent since the war began, rapidly approaching its 2022 peak following Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
Spiking airfreight costs on the Asia-to-Europe route will act like “surge pricing on Uber,” drawing aircraft from other routes, such as Asia-to-U.S., and causing those prices to rise as well, Bourke said.

Supply chain managers have adjusted to serial crises in recent years, including the pandemic and the war in Ukraine. So they are accustomed to scrapping standard modes of operation. But airlines face constraints in airport runway and warehouse capacity when they reshuffle their airfreight operations, said Chris Rogers, head of supply chain research for S&P Global.
“The good news is planes can fly to different airports. However, it’s not like these airports have infinite capacity to take cargo from other areas,” he said.
The freight market upheaval could be exacerbated by companies responding to changes in U.S. tariffs, which are temporarily lower following the Supreme Court ruling invalidating Trump’s emergency levies. Indian goods, for example, are now subject to a 10 percent tariff, down from as high as 50 percent before the court ruling.

Administration officials have said they intend to re-create the original tariff lineup as much as possible before the 10 percent global tariff expires in late July. In the meantime, U.S. importers have an incentive to rush Indian goods such as telecommunications gear and generic drugs into American ports. Any increase in demand for airfreight from New Delhi could run straight into airlines’ limited capacity, driving shipping costs higher, analysts said.

Farmers, meanwhile, will probably be among the first Americans to feel a financial jolt from the war. Three of the world’s top 10 producers of urea and anhydrous ammonia fertilizer are in the conflict zone: Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Iran.
Urea prices jumped by roughly one-quarter last week and are expected to head higher if the strait remains closed, said Josh Linville, vice president of StoneX, a financial services firm. The price hikes come just as farmers are preparing to place their heaviest fertilizer orders of the year.
With China, another top producer, restricting its exports until at least August, a long war could leave farmers hurting.
“I don’t even know how to place numbers on it,” Linville said. “This is an event we’ve never seen before.”
 
So we should think about fishing while our children and civilians are being killed?

No, we should sacrifice the fishes, oil and our people to bring a change to the world.

We sacrificed already a lot against the Mongolians of our time (USraelis). What is happening now is nothing compared to what happened during past 47 years.
I know all too well the past 47 years from the American point of view. I remember the day the Shah fell. Even told some of my buddies that we would be at war with Iran some day. And now here we are.
 
I invite every military mind to read this

That is brilliant structure.
Every province military commander has a predetermined list and time schedule of attacks. And if he dies the next one immediately takes over.
Iran learned and prepared a lot for this day.
For pakistan there is a lesson to learn in this. Centralized military structure just falls if the top leadership is decapitated.
 
Then should we not cheer for peace rather than war?
Id rather be realistic than delusional. It is for the long term betterment of our region. The entire region needs to see that the US is unreliable, would prefer Israeli interests over others. Also, even if Iran stops today, and so does the other side, they'll come soon again for Iran, and the vicious cycle continues. It wont stop whether it effects us or not, or we like it or not.

Iranian pummelling of GCC is a good start of forcefull injection of reality into them.
 
WaPo:

Oil prices seesaw as Trump sends mixed messages on what’s next in Iran​

Oil climbed to nearly $120 per barrel before falling back after Trump sent mixed signals and the Group of Seven mulled releasing emergency oil supplies.

Oil prices reached heights not seen since the aftermath of Russia’s 2022 invasion of Ukraine on Monday before falling back by the time markets closed, as President Donald Trump sent mixed signals about his Iran plans.

The price for a barrel of Brent crude, the global oil benchmark, had at one point spiked to nearly $120, a level that could translate into gas prices surpassing a national average of $4 per gallon. But prices turned by midday, dropping precipitously to settle at under $90 per barrel, a level still significantly higher than before the United States and Israel began strikes on Iran just over a week ago.


Trump fed the volatility. He wrote on social media over the weekend that soaring oil prices were a “small price to pay” for battlefield gains in Iran but struck a different note at a news conference late Monday.

“This was just an excursion into something that had to be done. We’re getting very close to finishing that, too,” Trump said of the conflict. “It’s going to be ended soon,” he said, but declined to specify when.

Hours later he wrote in a post on social media that Iran would be “hit by the United States of America TWENTY TIMES HARDER than they have been hit thus far” if the country did anything to stop oil being shipped through the Strait of Hormuz.
“We will take out easily destroyable targets that will make it virtually impossible for Iran to ever be built back, as a Nation, again — Death, Fire, and Fury will reign upon them — But I hope, and pray, that it does not happen,” Trump wrote.

The Strait of Hormuz, a conduit for one-fifth of the world’s oil supply, has been effectively closed for a week with vessels carrying oil, natural gas and other cargo backing up because of the threat of Iranian attacks on tankers and other ships.
Leaders of the Group of Seven advanced economies met Monday and decided not to tap their emergency oil reserves but signaled they may soon release that crude into the marketplace, a message that may also have helped calm markets.

“We’re not there yet,” said French Finance Minister Roland Lescure, speaking to reporters in Brussels after the meeting. “We’ve agreed to monitor the situation very closely.”

World leaders remain concerned that oil prices will resume their climb. Further increases could trigger broader inflation at a time when many U.S. consumers are already concerned about affordability. Prices at the pump in the U.S. are already 47 cents higher than a week ago, according to AAA, averaging $3.48 for a gallon of regular.

Monday’s spike in oil prices led to an initial drop in global stock markets. Japan’s Nikkei index plunged about 5 percent. European stock markets shed 1 to 2 percent. But all the main U.S. indexes, which fell considerably early Monday, ended the day with gains.
Considerable economic risks remain while oil supplies from gulf states remain shut down. Trump at his Monday news conference said the U.S. is offering insurance to oil tankers in the Persian Gulf, an initiative first announced last week when he also said American forces could offer military escorts to shipping in the region.

“Exports will not resume until ship owners, operators, and insurers feel sufficiently safe from the threat environment posed by Iranian warships and aircraft, missiles, drones, speedboats, and naval mines,” Clayton Seigle, an energy and geopolitics scholar at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, said in an emailed statement.

While most of the oil through the strait goes to Asia, it is a commodity sold on the global market. That means prices for oil produced in the U.S. are surging alongside the oil shipped from the Persian Gulf, leaving American motorists exposed to price shocks.

After Trump had made affordability and lowering energy prices a cornerstone of his political message, analysts had assumed he would seek a diplomatic compromise with Iran that gets oil flowing again.Ask The Post AIDive deeper
On Sunday night, as oil prices soared toward $120 per barrel, he wrote in a social media post that the spike in prices “is a very small price to pay for U.S.A., and World, Safety and Peace. ONLY FOOLS WOULD THINK DIFFERENTLY!” As markets plunged Monday, his tone changed. He told a CBS reporter, “I think the war is very complete, pretty much,” according to her post on X.

The Trump administration has sought to tamp down oil prices by easing some sanctions on Russia. It provided a waiver that allows India to buy Russian oil for 30 days, and Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent has said further sanctions relief is possible.Ask The Post AIDive deeper

If the Iran conflict becomes protracted, even tapping into oil reserves would provide only temporary relief.
The entire U.S. Strategic Petroleum Reserve holds about 415 million barrels of oil. It is enough to cover less than four days of global oil demand, or just a few weeks of the supply choked at the strait. Federal officials and lawmakers will be reluctant to draw down more than a third of that amount, as replenishing it typically cannot be done quickly.

“There is simply no substitute for restoring access through the Strait of Hormuz,” Angie Gildea, global head of oil and gas at KPMG, said in an emailed statement. “The tools at our disposal, including strategic reserves, rerouting some exports and floating inventories, can provide some relief at the margins, but they are not structural solutions. We are in uncharted waters.”
Diesel prices are surging even faster than gasoline, spelling more trouble for the economy.

Diesel hit $4.66 a gallon Monday, up nearly 90 cents from a week ago. Analysts warned it could spike past $5 within weeks. It is already nearly $6 in California.

Diesel is used in the shipping of almost every consumer product, so the rocketing cost of the fuel is certain to make goods more expensive.
UPS, the largest shipping company in the U.S., has already tacked on a weekly fuel surcharge.
Container shipping companies are starting to do the same. And farmers also may soon be raising their prices, as they rely on diesel to power their industrial equipment.
 

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