Is Pakistan rising as a middle power?

[MH.Yang]

A reminder to Indians:

humiliating Pakistan is humiliating India. If you think Pakistan is not a middle power, what about India, which cannot defeat Pakistan?

 

[MH.Yang]

How’s North Korea keeping a low profile? It’s the most unhinged and dangerous country. It literally randomly sends missiles over Japan and South Korea and even close to Hawaii.

North Korea only does so when it needs to exert political pressure externally.

The North Korean government is actually very smart. You can compare the North Korean government and the Iranian government, both countries are providing aid to Russia, but the results are completely different.

North Korea and Iran both gave Russia military aid, so what did they each get from Russia?

North Korea:
1, received technical assistance, satellite technology, missile technology, shipbuilding technology, drone technology have significantly improved;
2, thousands of containers of last century's nearly obsolete artillery shells, exchanged for foreign currency (Western media estimates that at least 20 billion euros sold).
3, the United Nations military sanctions against North Korea in name only. The sanctions have not affected North Korea's military trade with the permanent members, and then will not do so again in the future.
4, North Korea and Russia have formalized their military alliance. Add to that the defense treaty that North Korea and China signed in 1962. It now has the covenant of two military powers.

And what about Iran?
Sold some drones, which led to additional EU and US sanctions. And then what? No more then, nothing. Iran got scared and backed down from selling. So Iran got nothing but more sanctions.

 

[Starlord]

To become any kind of power house we first need to kill and end internal insurgencies.

 

[Fatman17]

Pakistan is working hard to balance its relationships with competing global powers

For the better part of the last twenty years, whenever the world thought of Pakistan, the focus was usually on terrorism, political chaos and a struggling economy. Naturally, this bad press made investors nervous and left the country's diplomats with very little room to manoeuvre. Lately, however, the narrative has started to shift. Pakistan is quietly adopting a much more flexible foreign policy, working hard to balance its relationships with competing global powers.

A perfect example of this was Pakistan's role during the recent flare-ups between the United States and Iran. Even though Washington and Tehran couldn't be further apart, Pakistan actually managed to keep a working relationship with both and helped keep the lines of communication open. We shouldn't exaggerate Pakistan as a master peacemaker, but the fact that it stayed relevant - and trusted - in such a tense, polarised standoff says a lot about its diplomatic agility.

If you look at how global politics works today, a country's power isn't just measured by the size of its economy or its military. It's also about "soft power" - the ability to build trust, maintain credibility and influence outcomes. By stepping up to mediate between bitter rivals, Pakistan is showing that it can use strategic diplomacy to completely reshape how the world sees it.

On paper, Pakistan has always had the right ingredients to be a major player, or what experts call a "middle power". Just look at a map: it serves as a bridge between South and Central Asia, the Middle East and the Arabian Sea. Add in a massive military, nuclear capabilities and deep historical ties with both Western and regional powers, and the potential is obvious. For years, though, that potential was squandered. Endless political drama, poor governance and a lack of clear direction kept Pakistan from cashing in on its natural advantages.

What's working for Pakistan right now is a smart strategy of playing the middle ground. Instead of tying itself strictly to one team, it's maintaining working relationships with everyone - even countries that oppose each other. Islamabad is holding onto its deep ties with China while simultaneously keeping up its security cooperation with the US. It stays friendly with Iran, yet remains closely allied with Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states. In today's deeply divided world, that kind of flexibility gives Pakistan a rare and valuable diplomatic edge.


That balancing act is exactly why both Washington and Tehran were willing to let Islamabad play the middleman. Iran sees Pakistan as a neighbour with shared cultural and religious roots, including a large Shia population. Meanwhile, the US trusts Pakistan because of decades of shared military and intelligence history.

But here's the reality check: you can't survive on good diplomacy alone. Pakistan's biggest hurdle is still its economy. Years ago, Goldman Sachs predicted Pakistan could eventually become one of the world's largest economies, but the country has been unable to turn its strategic location into actual wealth. Political uncertainty and constantly changing policies have simply turned away long-term investors.

The toll of terrorism and instability over the last two decades has been devastating. While neighbouring India successfully rebranded itself as a global tech and business powerhouse, Pakistan fell behind. Realistically, Pakistan won't be able to compete economically until it gets its own house in order and creates a stable, predictable environment for business.

To keep its current diplomatic winning streak alive, Pakistan desperately needs to focus toward economic reform and its own people. That means pouring resources into education, technology and innovation. The future of global competition is going to be decided by artificial intelligence, robotics, green energy and quantum computing; Pakistan can't afford to stay stuck in traditional, older industries.

Just as importantly, the endless political infighting has to stop. Constant clashes between politicians tear down institutions and discourage investors. If the domestic chaos continues, any foreign policy wins will just slip away. National priorities - like fixing the economy and securing the country - need to be treated as long-term goals, not kegpowder for partisan bickering.

Looking ahead, the rapidly changing Middle East offers a great opportunity for Pakistan. With shifting alliances and a lot of uncertainty about America's long-term plans in the region, new diplomatic doors are opening. Pakistan can absolutely benefit from this, but only if it stays out of regional rivalries.

Right now, Pakistan is genuinely performing above its economic weight class. Through smart diplomacy and strategic positioning, it has fought its way back into the conversation as a highly relevant middle power. But this success is incredibly fragile. Unless the country can figure out how to stabilise its politics and build a strong, modern economy, these diplomatic wins might just be a flash in the pan. The challenge now is proving it has the discipline to stay at the table.

Pure optics at this point. Without a strong economy it is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

 

[royalharris]

Don’t compare these so-called Middle Eastern “powers” like Iran with North Korea. They’re not even in the same league. One is a resource-rich country, yet its people and leaders are assassinated and slaughtered at will; the other is a resource-poor country, yet it stands tall on the international stage.
Is there any real basis for comparison?
More importantly, the countries led by these idiots still look down on everyone else.
On the international stage, which of them—Xi, Putin, or Trump—doesn’t take Kim Jong Un seriously? And which of them truly values the leaders of these so-called Middle Eastern powers?

 

[clutch]

Messenger boy doesn't mean a rising middle power. You need a rising economy to support any middle power aspirations.

 

[That_Guy]

They are keeping a low profile out of choice and circumstance.

Nope.

The DPRK does not have any qualifications to even remotely consider itself a middle power.

It has nukes, and nothing else.

 

[That_Guy]

Don’t compare these so-called Middle Eastern “powers” like Iran with North Korea. They’re not even in the same league. One is a resource-rich country, yet its people and leaders are assassinated and slaughtered at will; the other is a resource-poor country, yet it stands tall on the international stage.
Is there any real basis for comparison?
More importantly, the countries led by these idiots still look down on everyone else.
On the international stage, which of them—Xi, Putin, or Trump—doesn’t take Kim Jong Un seriously? And which of them truly values the leaders of these so-called Middle Eastern powers?

One doesn't have nukes.

The other does.

If you had nukes, you'd be able to stand tall as well, because nukes can end the world.

Your argument is bad.

 

[royalharris]

One doesn't have nukes.

The other does.

If you had nukes, you'd be able to stand tall as well, because nukes can end the world.

Your argument is bad.

Pakistan has nuclear weapons, but before last year’s aerial combat, who would have cared about Pakistan?
Even after that air battle, at China’s military parade, the people standing around Xi Jinping were Putin and Kim Jong-un.
Xi Jinping, Putin, and Trump say they are good friends with kim. When they meet Kim Jong-un, they give him a warm embrace. But would they do the same when meeting the president of Pakistan?
North Korea’s respect is real and hard-earned, won through heroic fighting on the battlefield. If Israel and North Korea fought on neutral ground, North Korea could beat the shit out of Israel.

 

[That_Guy]

Pakistan has nuclear weapons, but before last year’s aerial combat, who would have cared about Pakistan?

Literally everyone.

there is a dofference between being cureently geopolitically relevant, and nuclear destruction.

the US, and China were already competing in Pakistan during that time, the competition just heated up.

Even after that air battle, at China’s military parade, the people standing around Xi Jinping were Putin and Kim Jong-un.

That's because China has scant few nations that it can call close allies. The DPRK is one of them.

North Korea’s neighboring countries are China, Russia, South Korea, and Japan. If North Korea were located in the Middle East, it could beat the crap out of Israel.

Your point of having big neighbours is a weird point to make, and makes no sense.

And your assertion that theDPRK can beat Israel is laughable at best.

 

[Sainthood 2.0]

Pakistan has nuclear weapons, but before last year’s aerial combat, who would have cared about Pakistan?
Even after that air battle, at China’s military parade, the people standing around Xi Jinping were Putin and Kim Jong-un.
Xi Jinping, Putin, and Trump say they are good friends with kim. When they meet Kim Jong-un, they give him a warm embrace. But would they do the same when meeting the president of Pakistan?
North Korea’s respect is real and hard-earned, won through heroic fighting on the battlefield. If Israel and North Korea fought on neutral ground, North Korea could beat the shit out of Israel.

Take your pills

Pakistan has nuclear weapons, but before last year’s aerial combat, who would have cared about Pakistan?
Even after that air battle, at China’s military parade, the people standing around Xi Jinping were Putin and Kim Jong-un.
Xi Jinping, Putin, and Trump say they are good friends with kim. When they meet Kim Jong-un, they give him a warm embrace. But would they do the same when meeting the president of Pakistan?
North Korea’s respect is real and hard-earned, won through heroic fighting on the battlefield. If Israel and North Korea fought on neutral ground, North Korea could beat the shit out of Israel.

Who cares if XI plays touch butt with pk pm or not? how that relevant to anything?
China's been a dear friend of Pakistan for a long time, even before XI and will be a friend after Xi, and that's that
Everything else is just semantics.

 

[royalharris]

Literally everyone.

there is a dofference between being cureently geopolitically relevant, and nuclear destruction.

the US, and China were already competing in Pakistan during that time, the competition just heated up.


That's because China has scant few nations that it can call close allies. The DPRK is one of them.

Your point of having big neighbours is a weird point to make, and makes no sense.

And your assertion that theDPRK can beat Israel is laughable at best.

The combat effectiveness of a military force is determined by only two factors: first, military quality and fighting spirit; second, military equipment. The quality and fighting spirit of the North Korean military are world-class.

If North Korea and Israel went to war, Israel would have the support of American military equipment, but North Korea could likewise receive support from Chinese and Russian military equipment.

North Korea would turn Israel’s life into a nightmare.It could drive Israel into the sea and feed it to the fish.

 

[Hassan_716]

We can rise beyond being just a middle power if we:

1. Let talent and merit lead the way
2. Uphold the rule of law
3. Practice and promote strong moral values, both individually and as a society

 

[MH.Yang]

Don’t compare these so-called Middle Eastern “powers” like Iran with North Korea. They’re not even in the same league. One is a resource-rich country, yet its people and leaders are assassinated and slaughtered at will; the other is a resource-poor country, yet it stands tall on the international stage.
Is there any real basis for comparison?
More importantly, the countries led by these idiots still look down on everyone else.
On the international stage, which of them—Xi, Putin, or Trump—doesn’t take Kim Jong Un seriously? And which of them truly values the leaders of these so-called Middle Eastern powers?

After the Ukraine war, North Korea's international status is bound to rise. It is a simple truth: who wouldn't want an ally that would immediately dispatch hundreds of thousands of troops to help you when you are at war? North Korea alone can dispatch more troops than the entire NATO alliance, and its combat capability and courage are above average.

 

[MH.Yang]

Let me give an example about the combat effectiveness of the North Korean army.

On November 23, 2010, due to military exercises held by South Korea, there was a sudden shelling war between South Korea and North Korea. The North Korean army used four outdated towed artillery pieces, but it dealt a heavy blow and defeated the South Korean army using six self-propelled howitzers (K9) with excellent tactics and tenacious combat style.

It is obvious that the tactics, training, and courage of the North Korean army are excellent, and the number is large. Senior officials are not afraid of war.

The only drawback is outdated military equipment, but this is an easy problem for China to solve.