Makkah Joint Defense Agreement: Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan, news & updates

[Yasser76]

I think we may well see an official Israeli response very soon

Netanyahu mulls Saudi, Turkiye, Pakistan pact as Israeli elections loom

Saudi Arabia, Turkiye, and Pakistan form a new defence pact, leaving Israel’s response and its implications uncertain

www.aljazeera.com

 

[Watandar]

First thing is, if you come up with made up mind and fixed mindset then there is no need for doing arguements at all. You have to open up a closed mindset and absorb information so you can rectify and improve on various obviously wrong concepts.

Strategic alliances do not mean that everything needs to be perfect at your home before you do any such thing.

Its like people around the world were telling India that first feed your hungry, poor population and then spend money on sending space rockets. I am astonished at such mindset. Countries do not operate like that. You have to deal with everything at the same time and pursue domestic and foreign policies together.

You were proven wrong several times in this thread but you never aknowledged even once that you learned something. That behavior suggests you are not here for learning but only for arguing. For-example you were completely wrong when you said Pakistan do not have capabilities of air launched ballistic and cruise missiles, it do not have capabilities of air refueling etc.. I proven you with images that those were literally decades old capabilities. You did not aknowledged that you were wrong. Seems you are just here for petty narrative building exercise. Its a total waste of your own energies and others.

You may have skimmed my posts and not actually read them.

I was debating with someone who inferred that Pakistan, Turkey and Saudi air force capabilities were equal to or surpassed Israel. I was pointing out the Israelis not only have a qualitative edge , but more capacity as well in the Air Force and many other domains as well as access to Western assets.

But that was earlier in the thread when some were speculating that this pact is about checking Israel. We have now arrived at the correct conclusion that this pact is aimed more squarely at Iran and allies and has ambitions of stabilizing and managing the Middle East itself.

It is therefore a legitimate question to ask that a Pakistani military that cannot provide political stability in its own country or safety to its own citizens, who are being killed by various militias and gangs for the last 30 years, how can it provide safety and stability to the Middle East ??

You have to be strong and stable at home first and then go off for adventures in foreign lands. It's not about "being perfect".

 

[Watandar]

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That's all what we need bro. We have PLENTY of other platforms and methods for NUKE delivery. We knew before recieving F-16s that US will prohibit those for nuke delivery. Its perfectly fine for us ; )

This was not the situation in 1984, which was the context of the original conversation

Who are you trying to impress here bro ?

 

[Pakistan First]

Put him in your ignore list bro, he has birth defect, Can't fix what Allah has refused to fix. 100's of intelligent, Briliant minds of Turkish/KSA national security advisors, think tanks and analysts with decades of expertise, Ph.D's and other economic/geopolitics/defense related education but they all got it wrong but this user on PDF got everything right, lol yeah sit down big fella. People here discussing hypotheticals which didn't happen, they made up scenario's and based on these scenarios they are trolling this agreement which signed not even 48 hrs ago. Like talk about the narcissist behavior at its peak. Some are just upset because of their Sectarianism, if this agreement was done with Iran/Houthis then this would become Halal Agreement, Literally none of the 3 countries who signed named any enemy, Not Iran, Not India, Not Greece... they just signed a defense agreement which formalize a already existing defense coorporation. Pakistani Chutiye mostly certain sect, or followers of forgotton leader sitting in jail, if this Agreement was signed by Messiah Khan, than this agreement would've been better than Agreement of Hudaibiya which Rasool Allah signed, because they offer their namaz facing Adiyala Jail not Mecca.
I am just enjoying the burnouts, crashouts, freakouts, because these seasonal tidday will make their Chu chu and eventually few of them get banned, or retreat to their own country's sections, none of them holds a reasonable argument against this agreement or can provide any evidence that its against any particular country.
Just enjoy the show brother

Brilliant post except the political point scoring. I dislike current regime but I totally appreciate this step. For long I desired this kind of NATO style defense PACT. Finally its arrived in whoever's tenure or whoever happens to be General does not matter. Petty politics should not play role in such events. Also avoid "roting in jail" and like statements. Injustice with anyone should never be encouraged even if you don't like such person. A fact of matter is he has enormous following and voter base in Pakistan. All of us should not follow politics like a religion.

 

[Pakistan First]

This was not the situation in 1984, which was the context of the original conversation

Who are you trying to impress here bro ?

Even in 1980s, Pakistani F-16s shot down atleast 10 Afghan and Soviet airforce jets intruding into our airspace.

I will be the last person who'd ever try to impress anyone. : )

 

[Distant_Observer]

It is therefore a legitimate question to ask that a Pakistani military that cannot provide political stability in its own country or safety to its own citizens, who are being killed by various militias and gangs for the last 30 years, how can it provide safety and stability to the Middle East ??

A bit of trouble at the fringes of the realm in the outback and wildlands is not a big deal in the grand scheme. There are many savages and barbarians in this region.

 

[Meengla]

They asked Pakistan to send army aswell but our parliament opposed it, now we are under hybrid regime so all options are open.

Newsflash: This has been a hybrid regime in Pakistan since ZA Bhutto was ousted in 1977. The military has dominated the foreign policy with input from the Foreign Ministry and I have no complaint about that! But even the military factors in the input of the Pakistani Foreign Ministry who beaurocrats are absolutely brilliant--one of the few bright spots in Pakistan's status as a misgoverned country of 250 million with low quality human resources. The Pak Foreign Ministry evaluates all the risks and rewards and makes the recommendations and they are sound decisions despite Pakistan's failures in many other ways.
In short, it doesn't matter who would be the PM of Pakistan, it is ultimately the Foreign Ministry's recommendations which define Pakistan's Foreign Policy. And there are no rooms for error given what Pakistan faces from its east for 8 decades.

 

[PakAl]

I really don’t see where this “Israel is a major threat to Türkiye” idea comes from. If Israel wanted to attack someone, they wouldn’t shy away... nobody in the region has ever been able to tell them to stop. And despite that, Türkiye has never been on their target list. We have no territorial disputes, no ideological conflict, no competing spheres of influence. Realistically, Türkiye doesn’t face any major external threat at all.

I don’t even count Greece as a serious threat. At most, you could see some tension in Cyprus, but even then Türkiye doesn’t need Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, or anyone else to handle that. We’ve managed our regional issues alone for decades.

And when Pakistan had its last conflict with India, Türkiye didn’t need any “alliance,” “treaty,” or formal pact to support them politically. We did it because of our bilateral relationship.... not because of some new bloc. Keep in mind, this was before KAAN, before our new defence projects even matured.

That’s why I feel this so‑called alliance benefits Pakistan and Saudi Arabia far more than it benefits Türkiye. We don’t gain anything strategically from it, and we certainly don’t need it for our own security.

Saudi Arabia wanted a defence pact with Pakistan, officially so if anything happens to Al Saud then Pakistan will protect them, even though Pakistan will have done this anyway. Pakistan then encouraged Turkey to be part of this pact, a powerful regional player but close strategic and historical ally of Pakistan. The aim is to gurantee the security of Saudi Arabia, the houthis can fire missiles but no invasion of Saudi Arabia will be tolerated. In return Saudia will invest in these nations, invest in to Turkish military industry aswell as their own. This will also bring SA and Turkey closer, reduce the internal fighting, or fight to control nations, Al Saud will also know atleast Turkey will not plot against them just like Saudia plotted against Turkey and others. In another words Al Saud legs started to shake and now trying to gurantee their security but with Turkey on the defence pact they have one less threat to worry about.

 

[Watandar]

Even in 1980s, Pakistani F-16s shot down atleast 10 Afghan and Soviet airforce jets intruding into our airspace.

I will be the last person who'd ever try to impress anyone. : )

Yes, 1986 onwards and included shooting down one of it's own in friendly fire incident in 1989.

Still irrelevant to the context in 1984, bro.

 

[Cipher212]

As I said in my last post, no real indication of what this deal entails.

How does this help solve Pakistans problems exactly? Will Saudi or Turkish forces start deploying in Afghanistan for us and along the LoC? Can we afford to pay their wages?

What about our own military? Do they expect us to transfer our more elite units to Saudi Arabia? Ok sure but then what exactly are they supposed to do when drones and missiles come flying in. We barely have enough AD for Pakistan at the moment.

Or do they want us sending scores of infantry grunts to die for them in Yemen. What's going to be the game here?

 

[PakAl]

I don’t think people understand how long these things actually take. Türkiye needs at least a decade for our major defence projects to fully mature, KAAN, TF‑2000, Gökbey, MIUS, the new missile families, radar systems, and the rest. Only after that kind of ecosystem is stable could anyone even start thinking about nuclear capability. There are no plans for it now, and honestly, we’ve all seen what happened to Iran. That’s not a mistake Türkiye wants to repeat.

But a decade from now? When our aerospace, missile, and deterrence programs are fully developed? At that point, Türkiye might be in a very different strategic position and far more interested in exploring nuclear options. Right now, though, it’s simply not on the agenda.

You see this is exactly why Israel doesnt like the Muslim nations to develop, Israel with their petrodollars keep Muslim nations weak and divided, cause internal wars, rebellions, terrorism etc. They hate any independent Muslim state, be it religious or secular. Anyways I dont think Turkey with their advance military will need nukes, and it will be a mistake with the west breathing down their neck.

 

[Desert]

Or do they want us sending scores of infantry grunts to die for them in Yemen.

that . .

 

[Yasser76]

As I said in my last post, no real indication of what this deal entails.

How does this help solve Pakistans problems exactly? Will Saudi or Turkish forces start deploying in Afghanistan for us and along the LoC? Can we afford to pay their wages?

What about our own military? Do they expect us to transfer our more elite units to Saudi Arabia? Ok sure but then what exactly are they supposed to do when drones and missiles come flying in. We barely have enough AD for Pakistan at the moment.

Or do they want us sending scores of infantry grunts to die for them in Yemen. What's going to be the game here?

What is wrong with you, seems like you use the sam playbook as your chums @Watandar and @Owaiz

This is a defence pact. Countries will decide how to help each other and for sure we do not know all the details.

What is certain is that the same posters will jump into a thread with positive news on Pakistan, make facicious arguments they cannot support, get called out, then derail and go on about domestic problems.

DO YOU NOT THINK WE ALL SEE THIS!!!!????

 

[mythbuster]

As I said in my last post, no real indication of what this deal entails.

How does this help solve Pakistans problems exactly? Will Saudi or Turkish forces start deploying in Afghanistan for us and along the LoC? Can we afford to pay their wages?

What about our own military? Do they expect us to transfer our more elite units to Saudi Arabia? Ok sure but then what exactly are they supposed to do when drones and missiles come flying in. We barely have enough AD for Pakistan at the moment.

Or do they want us sending scores of infantry grunts to die for them in Yemen. What's going to be the game here?

With such a strategic insight you should be commandant staff college dhok khootian

 

[FarhanSiddiqui]

Will Saudi Arabia modify it's domestic and foreign policies after this defense agreement ? Saudi Wahhabi regime is persecuting Shias in their own country and targeting the Shias overseas through proxies including in Pakistan. Are they going to accept plurality among Muslims rather than impose Wahhabi doctrine ? Pakistan and Turkey has large Shia minorities and share border with Iran.