PA MLRS, Self Propelled and towed artillery [BM-11, Fatah-I GMLRS, Fatah-II] - News, Updates & Discussions

If the mrls attack by pak was not efficient then what led to ceasefire ?

Pakistan wanted to slowly show the firepower. We used only guided mrls and not precision munitions, cruise missiles or ballistic missiles.

Everyone asking was fattah effective is stupid question now. Only because there is no credible data and forum members if were that solid source then this forum would have been closed by now. Army bases or mess footages being hit then there were losses on indian part as well apart from jets. There were footages of fattah being intercepted so its mix. But the attack gave enough beat to indians to think about next stage.

Truth is next phase was super deadly region wise. Pakistan did good attack with fattah, if it was not that effective then indians would have attacked again. After the pak limited offensive, it was almost silent from both side, like slap in the face to enemy to wakeup from wet dreams.
 
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White Privilege said:
Can you elaborate why our own missiles, like Raad or Babur, or smaller BMs in our inventory, weren't used?? Was it because of their dual use nature that we did not risk it or we did not possess sufficient stockpiles??
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There is also a factor of pull things out of storage. I remember (and @Panzerkiel can correct me if I am wrong) that one of the “signs” things are about to get very bad is mass degreasing of war stock tank shells. The last time I heard of it was during Op Parakaram but possible it’s happened again.

That doesn’t mean there aren’t ready to fire shells but that certain munitions are kept for certain stages of conflict. They aren’t immediately ready(even if at the same base) but part of a structured release of munitions stocks.

Babur and Raad aren’t available in such numbers that you (to the Indians advantage with Brahmos) decide to use the conventional targets ones on targets they weren’t originally meant for(in terms if being kept for a particular target)
 
aurelianpilled said:
No, Fatah-IIs were indeed used against India on May 10...
Claimed by DGISPR at around 3:40
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Apart from this mention F2 was also shown/claimed to be Used in a later video released by ISPR but it was probably made by another department and isn’t as direct of a source as DG ISPR himself.

That being said there is no video of it firing, no confirmed video of interception (unless the video of a large missile being intercepted over Haryana Is in fact an F2 and not an Indian self interception of S400 as claimed earlier, though this would not align with the Pakistani retaliation timing otherwise), and no debris to match with it. There’s similarly no debris or real proof for the other 3 Rafales either, unlike the other 5 aircraft, There is still a lot about the conflict we don’t know.

For those discussing the effectiveness of Pakistans Artillery, MLRS & Missile strikes; artillery & MLRS were quite effective both along LoC & IB, hit many Indian posts and other military installations, but there were hits on civilians too. Keep in mind often artillery and MLRS fire isn’t meant to do damage with every hit, it’s meant to be suppressive.

There were only between 21-26 F1 launches and ~4 CM400 launches as per the available evidence. Many of the F1s seem to have only missed their targets, some by a little, some by a lot, at least 3 hit their targets and a similar number seem to have been intercepted.

Of the CM400s, 2 were launched at S400 systems, which is a debate in itself, one hit an IAF Command node (successful, probably a CM400) and one hit an unintended military target (bad target data) instead of its intended military target.

There are certainly more hits and less interceptions than were initially assumed due to a lack of evidence and good BDA (and fake Indian Claims), similarly a good few of the claimed Indian successes were also fake/grainy photos being mistaken for confirmed hits even by their official pressers, but it generally seems that the Pakistani (missile based) retaliation was short and marginally accurate (we have not seen any public proof of an S400 being damaged so far concrete, but hints are slowly coming out). Keep in mind this is all based off open source data, there’s going to be internal wins/losses on both sides that aren’t public yet.

Why it was so short could be down to a number of factors, I personally think it could be because it was cut short due to the ceasefire pressure from abroad.

All this being said, there are some interesting things from the conflict that haven’t been unveiled yet, and this will likely stay so for a while to come. Again; There are a lot of things about the conflict we don’t know about yet.
 
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Lion said:
Apart from this mention F2 was also shown/claimed to be Used in a later video released by ISPR but it was probably made by another department and isn’t as direct of a source as DG ISPR himself.

That being said there is no video of it firing, no confirmed video of interception (unless the video of a large missile being intercepted over Haryana Is in fact an F2 and not an Indian self interception of S400 as claimed earlier, though this would not align with the Pakistani retaliation timing otherwise), and no debris to match with it. There’s similarly no debris or real proof for the other 3 Rafales either, unlike the other 5 aircraft, There is still a lot about the conflict we don’t know.

For those discussing the effectiveness of Pakistans Artillery, MLRS & Missile strikes; artillery & MLRS were quite effective both along LoC & IB, hit many Indian posts and other military installations, but there were hits on civilians too. Keep in mind often artillery and MLRS fire isn’t meant to do damage with every hit, it’s meant to be suppressive.

There were only between 21-26 F1 launches and ~4 CM400 launches as per the available evidence. Many of the F1s seem to have only missed their targets, some by a little, some by a lot, at least 3 hit their targets and a similar number seem to have been intercepted.

Of the CM400s, 2 were launched at S400 systems, which is a debate in itself, one hit an IAF Command node (successful, probably a CM400) and one hit an unintended military target (bad target data) instead of its intended military target.

There are certainly more hits and less interceptions than were initially assumed due to a lack of evidence and good BDA (and fake Indian Claims), similarly a good few of the claimed Indian successes were also fake/grainy photos being mistaken for confirmed hits even by their official pressers, but it generally seems that the Pakistani (missile based) retaliation was short and marginally accurate (we have not seen any public proof of an S400 being damaged so far concrete, but hints are slowly coming out). Keep in mind this is all based off open source data, there’s going to be internal wins/losses on both sides that aren’t public yet.

Why it was so short could be down to a number of factors, I personally think it could be because it was cut short due to the ceasefire pressure from abroad.

All this being said, there are some interesting things from the conflict that haven’t been unveiled yet, and this will likely stay so for a while to come. Again; There are a lot of things about the conflict we don’t know about yet.
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Brother the IAF chief himself said 2-4 locations where S400 were stationed were hit precisely by PAF. So we can leave the faulty data stuff behind.
 
falcon34 said:
Brother the IAF chief himself said 2-4 locations where S400 were stationed were hit precisely by PAF. So we can leave the faulty data stuff behind.
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I don’t see how that contradicts with what I said. We know S400 was targeted with CM400 and we know they hit the exact location where the S400 had been, but do we know for sure they Hit the S400s or a part of them?

Plus those weren’t the only S400s launched, there were at least 2 If not more apart from those, the hit on the IAF node was likely a CM400, so was another hit which I don’t think was intended (the one I said might be faulty target data)

I’m not denying that they hit S400, we know the Indians have a history of being dishonest, but when you have to present something to a public forum where there will be third parties, you need to have concrete open source proof, which in time might come out. We can and do believe our internal sources but to third parties and To Indians these don’t count as reliable (just as we don’t consider theirs reliable)

Same for the other Rafale aircraft, we don’t have concrete proof of the other 3 yet, but with the release of serial numbers this might yet come to light.

The bottom line is that the Pakistani retaliation was not a failure - success is defined by whether the action furthered your overall goal in the entire conflict, damage done can be variable, the retaliation served its purpose, if doing damage was the only goal, we wouldn’t have used our cheapest missile only.

And I’m not even talking about the damage we did from artillery, MLRS and ground Ops :)
 
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@Oscar there is a separate section for Army, Air force, Navy and Strategic forces but not one for Rocket force?.
 
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