Pakistan Air Force | News & Discussions

[Yasser76]

JF-17 block 3 deal?

I would have thought unlikley in the past as it may upset the Turks and Saudis, but after Israeli actions in Qatar, now think this is a possibility, part of the reason Israel cpuld strike is that it has almost complete freedom over Iraqi air space. Turks and Saudis may not like that. US will not sell. So Block III, although not capable against F-35s would at least give Israelis headaches and certainly be unable to fly AEW/Refullers over Iraq

 

[Tariq Habib Afridi]

I would have thought unlikley in the past as it may upset the Turks and Saudis, but after Israeli actions in Qatar, now think this is a possibility, part of the reason Israel cpuld strike is that it has almost complete freedom over Iraqi air space. Turks and Saudis may not like that. US will not sell. So Block III, although not capable against F-35s would at least give Israelis headaches and certainly be unable to fly AEW/Refullers over Iraq

They need it fast. Can we deliver them fast?

 

[Yasser76]

They need it fast. Can we deliver them fast?

Capacity already stretched with Azeri order, even PAF short of Block IIIs.

Major issue now, unless China can step up second production like unsure

 

[Michael]

Capacity already stretched with Azeri order, even PAF short of Block IIIs.
Major issue now, unless China can step up second production like unsure

This is too difficult, unless it's a massive order (number > 100).

CAC's existing facilities are capable of small-scale pilot production of the JF-17. However, this is limited to pilot production. This production model is highly inefficient and costly, making it unsuitable for commercial production. Its use is limited to the production of sample fighters of new customized versions (including new major upgrades), which will be delivered to the PAC as reference objects for serial production.

CAC is fully capable of building a pulse production line for the JF-17. However, the construction costs of such a line would need to be spread across a large number of orders. Moreover, once CAC's production line is completed, it would inevitably have a significant impact on PAC's JF-17 production efforts. This would deprive PAC of a significant number of orders, which would not be in Pakistan's best interests. CAC has no interest in such a business.

 

[Fatman17]

 

[Ali_Baba]

Capacity already stretched with Azeri order, even PAF short of Block IIIs.

Major issue now, unless China can step up second production like unsure

PAF originally planned a production capacity of 50 planes per year both for internal purchases and external sales. ie 2 manufacturing lines. The orders did not materialise as expected, so Pakistan never built the second manufacturing line. It would make more sense for Pakistan to create a 2nd line if the orders are there, rather than China try to spin up a line given that they never had that in the first place.

 

[Yasser76]

PAF originally planned a production capacity of 50 planes per year both for internal purchases and external sales. ie 2 manufacturing lines. The orders did not materialise as expected, so Pakistan never built the second manufacturing line. It would make more sense for Pakistan to create a 2nd line if the orders are there, rather than China try to spin up a line given that they never had that in the first place.

Yeah, increasing the complexity of this is the PAF eyes (and budgets) set on J-10/J-35

If PAF goes all in on those, foreign air forces may well lose interest in the Block III and also look to China, to an extent Pak/China product is competing against China products

 

[RajaBaja]

Yeah, increasing the complexity of this is the PAF eyes (and budgets) set on J-10/J-35

If PAF goes all in on those, foreign air forces may well lose interest in the Block III and also look to China, to an extent Pak/China product is competing against China products

We need a practical approach. To join a Chinese project to build a 5th gen, single engine stealth platform. That's the most critical need along with J-35's and more high capability SAM systems.

 

[Ali_Baba]

We need a practical approach. To join a Chinese project to build a 5th gen, single engine stealth platform. That's the most critical need along with J-35's and more high capability SAM systems.

Pakistan is better off buying off the shelf for 5th generation platforms from China. Pakistan cannot make a full 4.5 gen airframe in Pakistan as of now, so what is the point in "another" TOT project?

Both the K8 and JF17 projects failed to deliver a true aviation industry. First exam why, and fix those issues properly before jumping into another project.

Pakistan would do well to fix the fundamental issues in Pakistan first, rather than waste money on TOT projects that don't lead anywhere.

So, yes, buy 5th Gen jets and UCAVs, but dont waste time on TOT, or local manufacturing of them. It will be a waste of money that can be used to buy more units of the plane instead.

 

[Yasser76]

Pakistan is better off buying off the shelf for 5th generation platforms from China. Pakistan cannot make a full 4.5 gen airframe in Pakistan as of now, so what is the point in "another" TOT project?

Pakistan would do well to fix the fundamental issues in Pakistan first, rather than waste money on TOT projects that don't lead anywhere.

So, yes, buy 5th Gen jets and UCAVs, but dont waste time on TOT, or local manufacturing of them. It will be a waste of money that can be used to buy more units of the plane instead.

Agreed, technically UK, Italy, Germany, France and many countries could have gone alone on both 4th and 5th gen aircraft but it made no economic sense. Skills and tech were there already.

Pakistan has neither the skills, tech or money

 

[m52k85]

JF-17 block 3 deal?

The Jf-17 would exceed the F-16 as being the most numerous 4th gen in service around the world if every time an airforce chief/ country dignatry meeting PAF CAS meant a Jf-17 order.

 

[ThoroughPro]

@Panzerkiel @side-winder
Has the CM400akg been acquired with TOT or it's still being bought of the shelf by PAF.
Is the AR warhead Pakistani origin or Chinese.
The ground launched SY400 SRM has a range of 400kms, CM400akg is based on this missile the unrestricted version of CM400akg would have range of at least 500kmView attachment 146013

Missiles range is mentioned in the name itself "400" in the name "CM400" means "Cruise Missile with 400KM range"

 

[Pradotlc]

Note the afgan airforce kill markings

 

[Raider 21]

View attachment 146506
Note the afgan airforce kill markings

With the legendary shooter, Hameed Qadri (RIP) standing to the right of the ladder. He was probably the only Viper driver in the world that has a guns kill against enemy fighter. The Israelis may have a guns kill against helicopters but not sure against the Arab air forces fighters.

 

[Pradotlc]

With the legendary shooter, Hameed Qadri (RIP) standing to the right of the ladder. He was probably the only Viper driver in the world that has a guns kill against enemy fighter. The Israelis may have a guns kill against helicopters but not sure against the Arab air forces fighters.

Yes Israelis did have gun kills against Arab air forces and quite a few of them ie pre 1980s not with 4th generation planes