Pakistan-India Conflict 2025: News Updates and Discussion

[hydrabadi_arab]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[Falcon26]

Big news! India is planning another false flag attack on its own citizens to blame Pakistan. Top confidential document of RAW has been leaked on dark web revealing that Indian intelligence agencies and security forces are planning a staged attack at Amarnath Yatra.
View attachment 135933

They will lose their entire Rafale inventory. Let them. Pakistan is not some small country they can bully and 2019 & 2025 are perfect examples.

Let’s just hope Mr. Asim Munir is over his “restraint and maturity” nonsense.

 

[Be dazzled]

Trump said it was actually new form of warfare.....

was he referring to BVR air battle or what?

Cognitive EW with netcentric warfare. Add datalink comms and nav jamming.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

View attachment 136039

Watch it again CAREFULLY. The first time he says "5......jets", you can tell he was about to say "5 indian jets".

 

[NA71]

Watch it again CAREFULLY. The first time he says "5......jets", you can tell he was about to say "5 indian jets".

Kash he would have also said it clearly .....because Barkha Dutt is again in TV show ....twisting this statement ....and adding doubts to Indian minds.....

five jets could be of either side or mix of both......lo karlo gal......

 

[Baibers_1260]

@Master Chief @vasanthm @TAC @Mighty_Dragon_Strike

Where do we go from here? Is diplomacy an option?

There is no scope for diplomacy. Unfortunately the issues are no longer territorial, terrorism or water resources. It is purely religious hatred of the worst kind . The India Pakistan enmity is FAR worse than any other conflict in the world, including the Israeli Palestinian conflict. Even THERE amidst the slaughter the Israeli and Hamas representatives have kept talking diplomatically in Doha Qatar and have exchanged prisoners.
This is NOT the case in the Pakistan India conflict.

Pakistan and Pakistanis are facing the same threat of extermination that the Indian Muslim minority in India is facing.

A close parallel with Nazi Germany,
1. Nazi Germany first eliminated the Jews within Germany for 6 years
2. As Nazi Germany attacked and occupied other nations the Jews in those countries were systematically rounded up and eliminated
3. The objective ( partially achieved) was the elimination of Jews from the earth.

The Indian objective regarding elimination of Muslims (currently limited to within India, Pakistan and Bangladesh) are identical,
The Manifesto:
India, through the manifesto of its ruling BJP party, its apex government sponsored religious body The Marg Darshak Samiti and its political wing the RSS has defined its objective of the elimination of 500 million Muslims throughout the subcontinent.
The strategy:
If the figure of a holocaust of 500 million seems fantastic then consider the fact that India has large stocks of chemical and biological weapons and can easily depopulate Bangladesh without retaliation. Pakistan is more difficult because of possible nuclear retaliation. There is a plan for Pakistan. Through a series of small conventional conflicts keeping the conflict just below the level of a nuclear response and with manipulated last minute foreign diplomatic intervention Pakistan's nuclear assets can be slowly degraded into irrelevance. The depopulation through non-contaminating chemical or biological weapons can be done with impunity.
Diplomacy ?
There is little reason for India to talk or consider diplomacy.
A "hot and cold " stance may be adopted to deceive Pakistan into lowering its guard and not protecting itself
India's regime, a crazed population engulfed in hatred and frenzy have their strategy laid out. Pakistan even if it realizes this has few options other than keeping China on its side but even this option has limited value if Pakistan fails to achieve at least a stalemate in future conventional conflicts or fails to protect its nuclear assets

To sum up, trusting in diplomacy is the worst option for Pakistan

 

[Maarkhoor]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[vasanthm]

@Master Chief @vasanthm @TAC @Mighty_Dragon_Strike

Where do we go from here? Is diplomacy an option?

There is no scope for diplomacy. Unfortunately the issues are no longer territorial, terrorism or water resources. It is purely religious hatred of the worst kind . The India Pakistan enmity is FAR worse than any other conflict in the world, including the Israeli Palestinian conflict. Even THERE amidst the slaughter the Israeli and Hamas representatives have kept talking diplomatically in Doha Qatar and have exchanged prisoners.
This is NOT the case in the Pakistan India conflict.

Pakistan and Pakistanis are facing the same threat of extermination that the Indian Muslim minority in India is facing.

A close parallel with Nazi Germany,
1. Nazi Germany first eliminated the Jews within Germany for 6 years
2. As Nazi Germany attacked and occupied other nations the Jews in those countries were systematically rounded up and eliminated
3. The objective ( partially achieved) was the elimination of Jews from the earth.

The Indian objective regarding elimination of Muslims (currently limited to within India, Pakistan and Bangladesh) are identical,
The Manifesto:
India, through the manifesto of its ruling BJP party, its apex government sponsored religious body The Marg Darshak Samiti and its political wing the RSS has defined its objective of the elimination of 500 million Muslims throughout the subcontinent.
The strategy:
If the figure of a holocaust of 500 million seems fantastic then consider the fact that India has large stocks of chemical and biological weapons and can easily depopulate Bangladesh without retaliation. Pakistan is more difficult because of possible nuclear retaliation. There is a plan for Pakistan. Through a series of small conventional conflicts keeping the conflict just below the level of a nuclear response and with manipulated last minute foreign diplomatic intervention Pakistan's nuclear assets can be slowly degraded into irrelevance. The depopulation through non-contaminating chemical or biological weapons can be done with impunity.
Diplomacy ?
There is little reason for India to talk or consider diplomacy.
A "hot and cold " stance may be adopted to deceive Pakistan into lowering its guard and not protecting itself
India's regime, a crazed population engulfed in hatred and frenzy have their strategy laid out. Pakistan even if it realizes this has few options other than keeping China on its side but even this option has limited value if Pakistan fails to achieve at least a stalemate in future conventional conflicts or fails to protect its nuclear assets

To sum up, trusting in diplomacy is the worst option for Pakistan

Diplomacy, in its current form, is pointless, mainly because Delhi sees no benefit in it anymore. For diplomacy to work, both sides need to have something to gain. But Pakistan’s decades long maximalist stance means any diplomatic "success" only comes at India’s cost.

Unless Pakistan is willing to move away from that mindset, there’s little chance diplomacy will be revived or taken seriously by India.

 

[Baibers_1260]

As some have suggested on these very threads, the fact that the Congress mask has slipped over the last 2 decades, revealing the true state polity of hindutva that encompasses the underlying spiritual preference of both political parties in India, is very much a "good" thing for Pakistanis.

Transferring the discussion to this thread:

• The Congress is FAR more dangerous as a foe than a BJP run Hindutva with a fake secular stance.
• The Congress knows that fighting even a weakened Pakistan while India is on the boil internally is fraught with danger. So a cosmetic sop to secularism to keep the poverty stricken illiterate ghetto confined Indian Muslim population comatose is a good option. The last thing Congress wants is the immediate post-Babri Masjid scenario of 1992-1993; when the Indian Prime Minister Narasimha Rao had to go on a whistle -stop tour of 30 Muslim majority countries ( excluding Pakistan of course) using his Hyderabad Nizam era madrasa education Arabic and Persian language skills to directly address the leadership of these countries. His trip to Saudi Arabia in 1994 was significant.
• The Congress is banking on weaponizing the 80% Dalit Other Backward Castes ( OBC) into a pseudo-Hindutva vote-bank, whipped into exactly the same kind of hyper nationalist anti-Muslim frenzy as it is now but no longer distracted by the quest for a larger chunk of the Indian economic pie through Job Reservation quotas. For the Congress the elimination of the Muslims can wait.
• The biggest existential threat Pakistan has faced has been from Congress regimes. In the pre-nuclear age in 1987 the Congress government under Rajeev Gandhi made the most serious effort ever to destroy Pakistan through a massive land air air and naval attack mobilizing 1.2 million troops 2000 tanks, its entire Air Force, Called Operation Brasstacks, the plan was called off because of a sudden withdrawal of support from the then weakened Soviet Union. The Soviet Union was loosing the war in Afghanistan feared Western intervention on behalf of Pakistan complicating matters for an honorable withdrawal The Soviet Union also wanted to pay India back "in the same coin" for refusing to invade Pakistan in 1980 to distract it from supporting the Afghan resistance.

@vasanthm , Your comments.

 

[Baibers_1260]

Diplomacy, in its current form, is pointless, mainly because Delhi sees no benefit in it anymore. For diplomacy to work, both sides need to have something to gain. But Pakistan’s decades long maximalist stance means any diplomatic "success" only comes at India’s cost.

Correct:
Diplomacy, in its current form, is pointless, mainly because Pakistan sees no benefit in it anymore. For diplomacy to work, both sides need to have something to gain. But India's decades long maximalist stance means any diplomatic "success" only comes at Pakistan's cost.
Unless India is willing to move away from that mindset ( Hindutva mindset), there’s little chance diplomacy will be revived or taken seriously by Pakistan
( Nice ChatGPT cut and paste. Works for me as well)

Frankly, Pakistan has more important things to do than engage in diplomacy such as acquiring more DF-17 hypersonic long range strike missiles and improving its missile and drone air defense systems.

Next round please..

 

[Liquidator]

As always suspected, Le Croissant is just a soggy Pakora, so tell me Louis Patil,

Best roast on the forum....

 

[vasanthm]

Correct:
Diplomacy, in its current form, is pointless, mainly because Pakistan sees no benefit in it anymore. For diplomacy to work, both sides need to have something to gain. But India's decades long maximalist stance means any diplomatic "success" only comes at Pakistan's cost.
Unless India is willing to move away from that mindset ( Hindutva mindset), there’s little chance diplomacy will be revived or taken seriously by Pakistan
( Nice ChatGPT cut and paste. Works for me as well)

Frankly, Pakistan has more important things to do than engage in diplomacy such as acquiring more DF-17 hypersonic long range strike missiles and improving its missile and drone air defense systems.

Next round please..

So in essence, both sides see no value in diplomacy right now. That probably means we’re in for a cycle of escalations until the ground reality shifts enough for one or both sides to reassess their position.

 

[vasanthm]

Transferring the discussion to this thread:

• The Congress is FAR more dangerous as a foe than a BJP run Hindutva with a fake secular stance.
• The Congress knows that fighting even a weakened Pakistan while India is on the boil internally is fraught with danger. So a cosmetic sop to secularism to keep the poverty stricken illiterate ghetto confined Indian Muslim population comatose is a good option. The last thing Congress wants is the immediate post-Babri Masjid scenario of 1992-1993; when the Indian Prime Minister Narasimha Rao had to go on a whistle -stop tour of 30 Muslim majority countries ( excluding Pakistan of course) using his Hyderabad Nizam era madrasa education Arabic and Persian language skills to directly address the leadership of these countries. His trip to Saudi Arabia in 1994 was significant.
• The Congress is banking on weaponizing the 80% Dalit Other Backward Castes ( OBC) into a pseudo-Hindutva vote-bank, whipped into exactly the same kind of hyper nationalist anti-Muslim frenzy as it is now but no longer distracted by the quest for a larger chunk of the Indian economic pie through Job Reservation quotas. For the Congress the elimination of the Muslims can wait.
• The biggest existential threat Pakistan has faced has been from Congress regimes. In the pre-nuclear age in 1987 the Congress government under Rajeev Gandhi made the most serious effort ever to destroy Pakistan through a massive land air air and naval attack mobilizing 1.2 million troops 2000 tanks, its entire Air Force, Called Operation Brasstacks, the plan was called off because of a sudden withdrawal of support from the then weakened Soviet Union. The Soviet Union was loosing the war in Afghanistan feared Western intervention on behalf of Pakistan complicating matters for an honorable withdrawal The Soviet Union also wanted to pay India back "in the same coin" for refusing to invade Pakistan in 1980 to distract it from supporting the Afghan resistance.

@vasanthm , Your comments.

The best shot at a negotiated settlement was probably when Congress was in power and India was still kind of struggling economically.

They did try a bit more on the dialogue front like the Vajpayee Musharraf Agra thing and all that backchannel stuff during Manmohan Singh’s time. Part of the reason BJP gained ground is because Congress just couldn’t sort out the Pakistan mess over decades.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

@Master Chief @vasanthm @TAC @Mighty_Dragon_Strike

Where do we go from here? Is diplomacy an option?

There is no scope for diplomacy. Unfortunately the issues are no longer territorial, terrorism or water resources. It is purely religious hatred of the worst kind . The India Pakistan enmity is FAR worse than any other conflict in the world, including the Israeli Palestinian conflict. Even THERE amidst the slaughter the Israeli and Hamas representatives have kept talking diplomatically in Doha Qatar and have exchanged prisoners.
This is NOT the case in the Pakistan India conflict.

Pakistan and Pakistanis are facing the same threat of extermination that the Indian Muslim minority in India is facing.

A close parallel with Nazi Germany,
1. Nazi Germany first eliminated the Jews within Germany for 6 years
2. As Nazi Germany attacked and occupied other nations the Jews in those countries were systematically rounded up and eliminated
3. The objective ( partially achieved) was the elimination of Jews from the earth.

The Indian objective regarding elimination of Muslims (currently limited to within India, Pakistan and Bangladesh) are identical,
The Manifesto:
India, through the manifesto of its ruling BJP party, its apex government sponsored religious body The Marg Darshak Samiti and its political wing the RSS has defined its objective of the elimination of 500 million Muslims throughout the subcontinent.
The strategy:
If the figure of a holocaust of 500 million seems fantastic then consider the fact that India has large stocks of chemical and biological weapons and can easily depopulate Bangladesh without retaliation. Pakistan is more difficult because of possible nuclear retaliation. There is a plan for Pakistan. Through a series of small conventional conflicts keeping the conflict just below the level of a nuclear response and with manipulated last minute foreign diplomatic intervention Pakistan's nuclear assets can be slowly degraded into irrelevance. The depopulation through non-contaminating chemical or biological weapons can be done with impunity.
Diplomacy ?
There is little reason for India to talk or consider diplomacy.
A "hot and cold " stance may be adopted to deceive Pakistan into lowering its guard and not protecting itself
India's regime, a crazed population engulfed in hatred and frenzy have their strategy laid out. Pakistan even if it realizes this has few options other than keeping China on its side but even this option has limited value if Pakistan fails to achieve at least a stalemate in future conventional conflicts or fails to protect its nuclear assets

To sum up, trusting in diplomacy is the worst option for Pakistan

F** K Diplomacy. Just ask the Palestinians how well diplomacy works. Pakistan needs MUCH more powerful nukes, hypersonic missiles, HQ-19 airdefence systems, More J-10Cs and J-35s. Let's have the ENTIRE means to wipe india and ALL indians off the face off the planet. Only then will we be secure. All else means F**K all. Appeasement will NEVER works.

 

[Jango007]

Trump’s statement has really put MODI is a very difficult corner

“Trump’s claim that five front-line combat aircraft of the IAF were downed in just one night, as reported by reputed international media houses, raises serious questions about India’s military tactics and readiness. ”

Why Trump’s Statement that ‘Five Fighter Jets Were Shot Down’ is Significant - The Wire

US President Trump’s statement challenges the Modi government’s official narrative, raises doubts about the Indian military and provides political ammunition to the opposition before the monsoon session of parliament.

m.thewire.in