Pakistan Marines

[Rational Philosopher]

I think we we need to enhance capabilities to land in Oman , Yamen , and Saudi or UAE or Iran or Kuwait or Iraq

Need to develop capability does not mean we had bad intention but we need the capability to defend by being in offensive mode

Waste of resources. You speak like we have so much funds to just throw around, there are like 100 more important things to prioritise before such things.

Look at your economy, then the size of your primary foe.

 

[Reichmarshal]

PAK Marines needs to be trained on the pattern of LCB, to better utalise their services.

 

[S.Y.A]

In 2003 a company of Marine Force Reconnaissance beat the entire ground assault to Baghdad.

did they capture entire baghdad? or were just advance elements for, as the name suggests, recon?

 

[Metal 0-1]

did they capture entire baghdad? or were just advance elements for, as the name suggests, recon?

2 Company of Recon Marines ain't going to capture Baghdad. You at least need couple of Divisions.
Now granted they didn't captured entire Baghdad but they secured key ares.

Recon Marines, particularly from the 1st Reconnaissance Battalion, played a crucial role during the 2003 invasion of Iraq. They were among the first U.S. ground forces to enter Iraq, operating in a manner that deviated from traditional reconnaissance tactics.

Key Responsibilities​

• Initial Assault: Recon Marines were tasked with leading the charge into Iraq, moving in full battalion strength rather than small covert teams. They operated in large convoys of Humvees, emphasizing speed and mobility.
• Securing Objectives: Their missions included securing vital infrastructure, such as bridges and airfields, to facilitate the advance of larger forces. They engaged both regular Iraqi military and irregular forces.
• Intelligence Gathering: Recon Marines conducted reconnaissance missions to gather intelligence on enemy positions and movements. This information was vital for planning subsequent operations.

Notable Operations​

• Engagements: They participated in several key battles, including operations around Nasiriyah and Al Gharaff, where they engaged Iraqi militia and called in artillery support.
• Deception Tactics: Recon Marines were involved in deception operations that misled Iraqi forces about U.S. troop movements, contributing to the overall success of the invasion.
• Urban Warfare: As the invasion progressed, they adapted to urban combat, conducting patrols and securing areas within cities like Baghdad.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Marines are basically a force which lands on another country for purpose of Elimination of known threat, using Sea route in most cases.

It's when ground invasion will yield tactical advantage

Also carrying out operations on Large Sea ships , Fuel Ships or Enemy Ships

The most minimum level of Force is conceptually locked to Sea port cities
on Own soil, this is where our Pakistani Marine force concept is


However in order to be have impact , need special Transport Ships or Helicopter Carrier fleet to transport 5,000-10,000 Troops to mission Location

• Helicopter Carrier
• Armed drone
• Transport capacity of Jeeps , APC
• Smaller Transport boats attachments
• Troop Deployer Ships near shore

Often Marines have to be adaptable to Sea/Beach environment
or Greater degree of comfort around water , or tactics suited
to Survive


It's operation are mostly different then the plain Army role which is focused on Land Operations in own country or Land route progression



I think Pakistan has never really expanded the ideal Ships which can serve the Marine concept in Pakistan


The whole Hover craft tactical ships are nice , but these are just one of the available transport options

 

[S.Y.A]

2 Company of Recon Marines ain't going to capture Baghdad. You at least need couple of Divisions.
Now granted they didn't captured entire Baghdad but they secured key ares.

Recon Marines, particularly from the 1st Reconnaissance Battalion, played a crucial role during the 2003 invasion of Iraq. They were among the first U.S. ground forces to enter Iraq, operating in a manner that deviated from traditional reconnaissance tactics.

Key Responsibilities​

• Initial Assault: Recon Marines were tasked with leading the charge into Iraq, moving in full battalion strength rather than small covert teams. They operated in large convoys of Humvees, emphasizing speed and mobility.
• Securing Objectives: Their missions included securing vital infrastructure, such as bridges and airfields, to facilitate the advance of larger forces. They engaged both regular Iraqi military and irregular forces.
• Intelligence Gathering: Recon Marines conducted reconnaissance missions to gather intelligence on enemy positions and movements. This information was vital for planning subsequent operations.

Notable Operations​

• Engagements: They participated in several key battles, including operations around Nasiriyah and Al Gharaff, where they engaged Iraqi militia and called in artillery support.
• Deception Tactics: Recon Marines were involved in deception operations that misled Iraqi forces about U.S. troop movements, contributing to the overall success of the invasion.
• Urban Warfare: As the invasion progressed, they adapted to urban combat, conducting patrols and securing areas within cities like Baghdad.

...so how did they beat the entire ground assault to baghdad? seems like they were tasked to go ahead. beating the ground assault means they took the initiative to race ahead.

they were assigned typical advance guard duties, and they performed it very well, nothing extraordinary. the paksitan marines, on the other hand, have to hold and defend the entire creek region.

 

[Zarvan]

Pakistan Marine roles needs to be increased. Make them huge equip them with Tanks, IFV, APC and attack helicopters plus others. Make them a strike core type thing with main goal to capture as much state of Gujrat as they can.

 

[Great Mal]

Pakistan Marine roles needs to be increased. Make them huge equip them with Tanks, IFV, APC and attack helicopters plus others. Make them a strike core type thing with main goal to capture as much state of Gujrat as they can.

• Proposed Role of Pakistan Marines: Transition from border security to a multi-dimensional force for sabotage, search, and destroy missions.
• Training and Deployment: Mass training akin to SSGN, with active deployment and rotation in conflict zones. Siachen, LOC, Waziristan, Balochistan etc
• Target Area: Raids along the Indian coastline, particularly Gujarat, India’s economic hub.

We need to broaden our thinking of what we can do & achieve not whether we need to arm them with tanks & IFVs which they do not need.

You can arm them in the long run with wings of marines under a independent army command which has access to army IFVs in case of first push of territory seizure inside India.

 

[Zarvan]

• Proposed Role of Pakistan Marines: Transition from border security to a multi-dimensional force for sabotage, search, and destroy missions.
• Training and Deployment: Mass training akin to SSGN, with active deployment and rotation in conflict zones. Siachen, LOC, Waziristan, Balochistan etc
• Target Area: Raids along the Indian coastline, particularly Gujarat, India’s economic hub.

We need to broaden our thinking of what we can do & achieve not whether we need to arm them with tanks & IFVs which they do not need.

You can arm them in the long run with wings of marines under a independent army command which has access to army IFVs in case of first push of territory seizure inside India.

We need to come out of defensive mindset and start desiging offensive doctrines. For that changing the role of Marines is crucial.

 

[Great Mal]

We need to come out of defensive mindset and start desiging offensive doctrines. For that changing the role of Marines is crucial.

Yeah that won't happen until the marines are not designated as super border guards

 

[ghazi52]

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Pakistan has to realize in order to push out foreign nations near our border we have to have capabilities to push out and be on offensive

We can't accept foreign bases scattered around near our sphere of influence

The bases are used for doing bidding for Israel , they are not even there to protect the land they are based in

Marines should have expanded focus

• 50,000 Unit Strength, 10,000 Reserve
• Ability to Land on foreign Soil at Beach/Shores
• Ability to Establish a Outpost
• Ability to Capture a foreign Airport
• Ability to Capture Foreign Ship
• Capture abandoned air base

Focused Equipment

• Gunships
• Helicopter Carriers
• Fast Attack Boats launched from Carrier / Corvettes
• Paratroop landing from C130 on foreign beach/land
• Equipment to Deploy Jeeps / APC

We need ability to land both in Oman , UAE, Saudia , Yamen or Iraq/Iran
Furthest away to Turkey if we need to to help friendly nation



The Hover Craft should be all Donated to Coast Guard , need to redefine the Marine Force , separate them from plain Navy Base police or Security. Or Coast Guard.


Recommended to add this capability


It takes 5-10 years to develop this additional capability while not urgent , we need to have it

• You need to train troops
• You need special equipment for the special missions

So it is not easy, people may think such a upgrade is easy but it is not takes lot of time and effort

 

[Aamir Hussain]

Marines in its traditional role is an expensive option to maintain. In order to really expand resources on such a force, we first need to figure out what do we intend to do with them in that role, i.e. what would be its immediate physical objective in the event of hostilities in the east.

I for one don't see any worthwhile objective 25KM from the coast inside India that can be held by any Marine Expeditionary Force and amply supported by sea or air till relieved by conventional forces.

So what remains to be done is to defend the Creeks area from incursion or possibly take some Indian side of the Creeks or Salt Marshes and hold it for later bargaining. The terrain is most difficult and movement is restricted to narrow stretches of dirt roads on embankments or by boats that too during high tide or hovercrafts. But the raised embankment supporting roads pose a challenge to movement by hovercrafts.

Indians have built better and more elaborate permanent check posts on their side of the border fully connected with raised roads/tracks and permanent shelter for upto a platoon sized force.

IMHO Marines need to be modernized and equipped as a creek defense force incuding a dedicated helo and a drone surveillance and attack wing with elaborate defense structure in the marshes that is lacking today. They can also play a harassing role by targeting Indian outposts thru hit and run raids and tie down larger Indian force in the area. A secondary role can by of QRF for the security of various naval bases and establishments inclusive of Air Defense.

 

[Bullzz]

As per available information, the Pakistan Marines currently operate with a divisional strength formation, comprising three brigades, each led by a Brigade Commander:

1. Commander Creeks Brigade
2. Commander Force Protection (FP) Brigade
3. Commander West

Based on Pakistan Army structure, each battalion (BN) typically consists of the following companies:

• Alpha Company
• Bravo Company
• Charlie Company
• Delta Company
• HQ Company

Each company usually comprises around 150 personnel, bringing the total battalion strength to approximately 750–800 troops.

Assuming the Pakistan Marines follow a similar structure and given that there are at least six battalions in Pakistan Marines, the estimated total force strength is:

• Minimum: 6 BNs × 750 = ~4,500 personnel
• Maximum: 9 BNs × 750 (assuming each brigade comprising of 3 BNs) = ~7,500 personnel

Thus, it is reasonable to estimate that the Pakistan Marines have a strength ranging between 5,000 to 7,500 personnel.

 

[studsmart]

it is not required to build Pak marines modelled after US marines.

Pakistan should adopt to its own marine force strategy . every country has done that. look at UK royal marines, or royal thai marines