PTI news, updates and discussions part ll

[Cipher212]

LOL. Trying to make a real difference without having to work hard for it is always a losing game, as we can see already.

Besides, you have admitted that there will be zero effect of any protests that do happen, so it is time to just go home and have the afternoon tea. The tabdeeli can wait, so let's try biscuits and cake from the newest bakery in town.

You seem to be always obsessed with this idea of PTI doing some sort armed violent movement otherwise they're not doing it right. Are you a closet revolutionary.

What they're doing at the moment is enough to make PTI and IK live rent free in the minds of military, their touts and their pets. That's enough

 

[VCheng]

What they're doing at the moment is enough to make PTI and IK live rent free in the minds of military, their touts and their pets. That's enough

If that is enough, then that is great. Everybody can accommodate such a stalemate easily and the country and its people can go about their lives as before. I have no problem with that at all.

There is no need for a revolution. All I point out is that as long as those who kept saying the tabdeeli mantra do not actually make any effort to make any meaningful tabdeeli, everything remains as it always has.

As I have said many times before:

Naya Pakistan = Purana Pakistan. No matter who claims it.

And everybody is content with that.

 

[Blain2]

Do you have those 10 cameras feed? One of which is over his bath or toilet.

And your point is what? He is a prisoner. His quarters will be monitored. Kindly read the report before posting half-informed posts. It says there are no cameras over his toilet/bathroom.

In all likelihood, his spousal visitation is also not monitored via cameras.

 

[Taimoor]

Great discussion, highlighting how Generals have been the watchmen of the corrupt status quo.

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[Cipher212]

If that is enough, then that is great. Everybody can accommodate such a stalemate easily and the country and its people can go about their lives as before. I have no problem with that at all.

There is no need for a revolution. All I point out is that as long as those who kept saying the tabdeeli mantra do not actually make any effort to make any meaningful tabdeeli, everything remains as it always has.

As I have said many times before:

Naya Pakistan = Purana Pakistan. No matter who claims it.

And everybody is content with that.

Any sort of actual tabdeeli would take decades to achieve. We are impatient for PTI to do revolution but happy to wait 70+ years watching the establishment do the same thing over and over expecting different results and giving us Ls each time.

 

[Blain2]

Great discussion, highlighting how Generals have been the watchmen of the corrupt status quo.

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I am sure this only transpired after April 10, 2022 or perhaps the PTI masses have had an epiphany about it as of this date.

If we want to be honest with ourselves, let's ask the tough questions. Go back in history and dig into why Punjabi and Pakhtun elite (including the politicians, generals and bureaucrats) have been at the heart of this deep-state. They make up the core of this "deep state" and for reasons right or wrong, have stuck to looking at Pakistan's evolution from a certain lens.

Pakistan's history has seen its fair share of inter-ethnic conflicts (fortunately most have stayed at the political level) and that is because the deep state has been at odds with each ethnicity for one reason or another. Some that are of its own making, others that were thrust upon it by outside powers.

However, what cannot be ignored is that it is the first time in the history of Pakistan that an "intra-provincial" conflict has erupted bringing the entire country to a state of paralysis. This is the Punjab vs. Punjab (Pakhtuns are a side story) conflict. And since the thrust of this conflict is in the Punjab, only Punjabis can fix this by thinking about Pakistan's long term wellbeing and not their own petty politics.

When you blame the military, or the establishment and the affiliated politicians, do realize that you are essentially pointing fingers at yourselves/ourselves. That does not solve anything, it simply keeps the rest of the county hostage/victim to this internecine conflict unfortunately.

What's needed is a reset of some sort which leads to an understanding with the establishment, a pathway to national elections (if it means sticking to the current time-frame, so be it), and freeing IK and his supporters so they can participate in politics without resorting to destabilization. Perhaps this is a pipe-dream, but I cannot think of another way out of this morass.

 

[VCheng]

We are impatient for PTI to do revolution but happy to wait 70+ years watching the establishment do the same thing over and over

Then it is no problem. The establishment can happily do what it is doing for another 70+ years too.

 

[Taimoor]

I am sure this only transpired after April 10, 2022 or perhaps the PTI masses have had an epiphany about it as of this date.

If we want to be honest with ourselves, let's ask the tough questions. Go back in history and dig into why Punjabi and Pakhtun elite (including the politicians, generals and bureaucrats) have been at the heart of this deep-state. They make up the core of this "deep state" and for reasons right or wrong, have stuck to looking at Pakistan's evolution from a certain lens.

Pakistan's history has seen its fair share of inter-ethnic conflicts (fortunately most have stayed at the political level) and that is because the deep state has been at odds with each ethnicity for one reason or another. Some that are of its own making, others that were thrust upon it by outside powers.

However, what cannot be ignored is that it is the first time in the history of Pakistan that an "intra-provincial" conflict has erupted bringing the entire country to a state of paralysis. This is the Punjab vs. Punjab (Pakhtuns are a side story) conflict. And since the thrust of this conflict is in the Punjab, only Punjabis can fix this by thinking about Pakistan's long term wellbeing and not their own petty politics.

When you blame the military, or the establishment and the affiliated politicians, do realize that you are essentially pointing fingers at yourselves/ourselves. That does not solve anything, it simply keeps the rest of the county hostage/victim to this internecine conflict unfortunately.

What's needed is a reset of some sort which leads to an understanding with the establishment, a pathway to national elections (if it means sticking to the current time-frame, so be it), and freeing IK and his supporters so they can participate in politics without resorting to destabilization. Perhaps this is a pipe-dream, but I cannot think of another way out of this morass.

If you have listened to the whole discussion, you wouldn't have used that particular date of 10/4/22. I would strongly recommend to listen with full attention. . Things were becoming apparent as soon as PTI got to look into things while in power, as per ex PM advisor, the "romantism of Naseem Hijazi Novels" created in the minds of masses (not just PTI) towards the generals, that unfortunately still lingers on. As for PTI, and agree with Fawad on this as he was the first one who highlighted this in public domain, they simply didn't take interest in the internal politics of the Army, naively thinking, it was there own internal "institutional" matter, at their own peril.

While there is some merit into the ethnic make up of the establishment, that is not the reason why we are here today in this mess. In present day Pakistan, the makeup reflect the ground reality of the population which is centred around Punjab and KPK.

The real reason is the "institutional hegemony" and they protect by all means necessary, because that is what server them , their personal interest, their family interests, the privileges, and this mentality start developing from the level of brigadier and above. Musharraf was not Punjabi or Pakhtoon. They think as a hive, while civilians neither have that discipline or even understanding as to what is civilian supremacy. And thats why , i have said this many times, that the promotions from Brigadier level onwards should be done directly from PM house, or at least from defence ministry under strict civilian oversight.

Our problem is lack of civilian supremacy, and under present situation, there is none. Jinnah was absolutely clear on this. You give generals an inch, they will take mile of you, and until and unless there is a realisation within Army that this cannot go on forever, its really for them to yield and go back to their constitutionally defined roles.

 

[Taimoor]

Neither family or his personal doctors have been given access to IK as of yet!

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[Jango]

Neither family or his personal doctors have been given access to IK as of yet!

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Oh to be a Dr Adnan

 

[VCheng]

Oh to be a Dr Adnan

So Dr. Asim Y talked to the physicians for 40 minutes but he cannot confirm or deny what they told him? What was Dr. Khurram A's opinion since he was the retinal specialist requested by Dr. Asim Y to be present for the phone call? (I know both of them to be excellent doctors in their respective fields.)

Is there more to this than the fact that the doctors are not who the family want them to be? How can such a trust deficit be removed or reduced?

 

[gamaji]

The Zionazis hated Imran Khan.




Imran married a British-Jewish and had never supported the Zionazi playbook. Actually it’s the military that has been consistently wants to recognize Zionazi entity. The current regime in Pakistan was installed because popularly elected Prime Minister Imran Khan opposed Zionist master plan. Popularly elected Egyptian Prime Minister Mohammad Morsi who also opposed Zionists was jailed, denied medical care and died in jail. Now we have same in Pakistan where Zionist installed regime is denying medical care to Imran Khan. Zionazi playbook using slave native sellouts to punish patriotic nationalists honorable politicians.

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TikTok - Make Your Day

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Goldsmiths are the major supporters of Zionists. IK

All are cooked up chrages agasint his by Asim Muneer and his henchmen in GHQ. They cant stand scrutiny in court of law , yet becuase now GHQ control judiciary, GHQ keep on getting the appeals against the judgements, what happened to Cipher and iddat case?

Because you are nooni toon, and since you are a loud mouth, why dont you cough up Nawaz test reports from UK about his platelets, just like his money trail for his London properties? While you doing this, have some shame that IK allowed your mai baap Nawaz to go abroad on humanitarian grounds.

You can tell all this BS to IK lawyers so that they can win legal cases.

No one cares if a nobody is telling lies and making tall claims. Asim Munir didn't tell that convicted criminal to launder Malik Riaz's £192m in black money for Rs 10 billion bribe or steal items from toshakhana, forge docs, and sell those items to make money and not even report that money in his tax forms.

 

[gamaji]

That is why I have said all along that the level of public support being claimed for IK and PTI may or may not be true, and can be believed only if there is actual evidence to show it. Thus far, there has been precious little shown.

Murder cases against the PTI goons should be registered for blocking roads. Multiple people/patients lost their life in some of the blocked ambulances on the roads closed by the PTI criminals. People have missed their flights too.

Roads are for all Pakistanis. These roads are not the private property of PTI. These goons have denied that right to many Pakistanis. They must be brought to justice with harsh punishments.

 

[VCheng]

Murder cases against the PTI goons should be registered for blocking roads. Multiple people/patients lost their life in some of the blocked ambulances on the roads closed by the PTI criminals. People have missed their flights too.

Roads are for all Pakistanis. These roads are not the private property of PTI. These goons have denied that right to many Pakistanis. They must be brought to justice with harsh punishments.

Obstructing the right of way for others to create a public nuisance is NOT permissible as part of any political protest.

 

[gamaji]

Neither family or his personal doctors have been given access to IK as of yet!

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This is not a professional doctor talking.

It's a paid employee who is shamelessly behaving like Imran's dog, Sharoo. Professional doctors honestly offer their professional opinion on medical cases after seeing the related medical reports.

This puppy was trying to be faithful to his master by supporting his master's political narrative and serving his political agenda. He is not alone.

The whole top management of SK hospital is acting like faithful puppies for Khotakhails. They get their pay check from there. They lost all respect when it became evident that they'd been acting as a deceptive tool for facilitating fake plaster on a healthy leg just for political milage for many months. Their 'patient' started immediately running from his wheelchair after getting a fist on his back. It's a matter of deep shame these these medical doctors.

These doctors are like a filthy stain for an otherwise respected profession.