The deal for 48 F-35 fighters.. How can it reshape Saudi air power in the Middle East?

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Bingo.
More information about the rapid and highly succesful ongoing military industrialization within KSA.

Thread 'Localising Power: Saudi Defence Industrialisation as Strategic Bargain'

Oct 3, 2025

Just came across this series of publications posted literally today. I have not read all of it but it looks highly informative and extensive.

3 Oct 2025

A Strategic Business: The Politics of Saudi Arabia’s Defence Transformation​

How is Saudi Arabia’s defence transformation reshaping its industrial base, military modernisation, and strategic partnerships while balancing U.S. interoperability with growing ties to European and Asian partners?

Eleonora Ardemagni​

ISPI Senior Associate Research Fellow MIDDLE EAST AND NORTH AFRICA...

• _Arabia_
• Replies: 33
• Forum: Arab Defence Forum

• 

KSA has had a 80 + year old strategic relationship with US that has immensely benefitted KSA. There is ZERO reason for that to change anytime soon. For decades KSA had a trade surplus with the US and for decades (nowadays millions) untold number of Saudi Arabian students have travelled to the US for education (much of it elite) which helped create one of the Muslim world's and developing world's largest industrial revolutions and growth within KSA as well as scientific ones on every field.

As for Israel, that many trolls in this thread mention, Israel has not even attack KSA 1 single time since 1948. There will be no conflict and besides of that Israel is an ethnically Arab country (20-25% of the population are Muslim and Christian Arabs) and 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews originally, including form modern-day KSA.

Israel will have to live with either a 1-state solution or 2-state solution eventually and once either happens, KSA and Israel will and should develop close neighborly ties. Israel has more to offer KSA than 99% of all Muslim countries and we are cousins.

I just recently looked at ancient Israelite/Caanite DNA and to no surprise Saudi Arabians are the ones that cluster the closest to those ancient populations.

Similarly with the Natufian DNA (world's first and oldest Neolithic culture) which is also closest to modern-day Saudi Arabians.

Natufian culture - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

See my post 506 in this thread below where all the DNA results can be seen:

Thread 'Arabic Coffee shop'

Jul 24, 2024

No politics.. just discussion of culture, daily life, , questions and answers, sports updates,, funny shows.. funny Arabic YouTube videos and classic Arabic things....a lot of great ideas ....

• The SC
• Replies: 584
• Forum: Middle East & Africa

• 

Please tell netanyahu and other israelis that saudis are their "cousins" see what the response would be............

 

[_Arabia_]

Please tell netanyahu and other israelis that saudis are their "cousins" see what the response would be............

The same Netanyahu that is 24/7 dreaming about KSA recognizing Israel?

Which part of ancient Israelites and Caanites do you not understand? The same entire Jewish history/Judaism fundament that they claim.

Netanyahu is a Polish Jew. Ashkenazi Jews have around 40-50% of Middle Eastern DNA on average.

Or which part of 20-25% of Israel being Arab Israelis and 2/3 of all Israeli Jews being Arab Jews, did you not understand?

Ashkenazi Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Fact of the matter remains the same, Israel (once a peaceful 1 state solution or a 2-state solution has been reached), will offer KSA more than almost every single Muslim country due to their much more advanced technology, science etc. That is undeniable. By then I hope that KSA and Israel will have mutually beneficial and cordial ties as I consider Israel an ethnically Arab country to begin with.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

The same Netanyahu that is 24/7 dreaming about KSA recognizing Israel?

Which part of ancient Israelites and Caanites do you not understand? The same entire Jewish history/Judaism fundament that they claim.

Netanyahu is a Polish Jew. Ashkenazi Jews have around 40-50% of Middle Eastern DNA on average.

Or which part of 20-25% of Israel being Arab Israelis and 2/3 of all Israeli Jews being Arab Jews, did you not understand?

Ashkenazi Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Fact of the matter remains the same, Israel (once a peaceful 1 state solution or a 2-state solution has been reached), will offer KSA more than almost every single Muslim country due to their much more advanced technology, science etc. That is undeniable. By then I hope that KSA and Israel will have mutually beneficial and cordial ties as I consider Israel an ethnically Arab country to begin with.

Ask the average israeli if they are an ethnically arab country. See what the response would be.

 

[_Arabia_]

Ask the average israeli if they are an ethnically arab country. See what the response would be.

Do you think I care about their response?

20-25% of all Israelis are Arab Israelis (Palestinian Arabs and Bedouins). This is a demographical fact.

Demographics of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews.

Arab Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Mizrahi Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Who are as Arab as everyone else of us. They just happen to follow Judaism - a fellow Abrahamic (Semitic) religion.

Arab Jews basically revived ancient Judaism practices within Israel and helped revive Hebrew itself - the modern language - which heavily borrowed from Arabic.

Modern Hebrew - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Influence of Arabic on other languages - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

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Israelis can claim whatever they want to - demographics and geentics do not lie.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Do you think I care about their response?

20-25% of all Israelis are Arab Israelis (Palestinian Arabs and Bedouins). This is a demographical fact.

Demographics of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews.

Arab Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Mizrahi Jews - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Who are as Arab as everyone else of us. They just happen to follow Judaism - a fellow Abrahamic (Semitic) religion.

Arab Jews basically revived ancient Judaism practices within Israel and helped revive Hebrew itself - the modern language - which heavily borrowed from Arabic.

Modern Hebrew - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Influence of Arabic on other languages - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Israelis can claim whatever they want to - demographics and geentics do not lie.

The israelis are SO arab that they decided to genocide more than 100,000 Arab Palestinians..........

 

[_Arabia_]

The israelis are SO arab that they decided to genocide more than 100,000 Arab Palestinians..........

Has nothing to do with ancient DNA, Israeli demographics or the facts that I wrote to you. Or even KSA to begin with. Let alone the topic of this thread.

In any case certain trolls in this thread started rambling about Israel (which has no reelvance to the topic of this thread or KSA for that matter as we are one of the few countries in the world never to have recognized Israel since 1948) and other low IQ nonsense of kill switches, some imaginary permanent US military bases (there is not a single foreign military base in KSA to begin with) etc. nonsense.

This is most likely due to their butthurt of RSAF being steadily transformed into one of the world's most powerful air forces. Ironically almost all of them living and paying taxes to the same West. Just the same useless noise from hypocrites.

EDIT: I am speed-limited for now, so your continued trolling/pinning for attention will not be replied to from my part.

HOWEVER WHAT IS UNDENIABLY TRUE IS THAT RSAF AND KSA AS A WHOLE IS RAPIDLY DEVELOPING ACROSS THE ENTIRE BOARD AND GROWING STRONGER BY EACH DAY. NOTHING THAT ANYBODY, ESPECIALLY OUR ENEMIES, CAN DO ABOUT THIS FACT OTHER THAN CONTINUE THEIR USUAL OBESSIONS AND CRYING. WHICH IS ALWAYS A GOOD AMUSEMENT AND COMEDY TO WITNESS.

 

[Pakistan First]

besides of that Israel is an ethnically Arab country (20-25% of the population are Muslim and Christian Arabs) and 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews originally, including form modern-day KSA.

Israel will have to live with either a 1-state solution or 2-state solution eventually and once either happens, KSA and Israel will and should develop close neighborly ties. Israel has more to offer KSA than 99% of all Muslim countries and we are cousins.

I just recently looked at ancient Israelite/Caanite DNA and to no surprise Saudi Arabians are the ones that cluster the closest to those ancient populations.

Similarly with the Natufian DNA (world's first and oldest Neolithic culture) which is also closest to modern-day Saudi Arabians.

Same ethnicity do not mean peace. The Israelis absolutely hate arabs. Even their leaders often spill the truth by saying 1 Israeli life is worth 1000 arabs. I shared video other day in which Israeli settler is saying that 1 Israeli life is worth 10 million muslims.

As far as DNA similar / same region / same ethnicity is concerned, that makes things even worse in most cases. Look at North Korea and South Korea. Look at us Pakistan. Punjab and Kashmir is literally split between india and Pakistan and we are often at each other throats. The foods, language, culture, many things look same especially in close by regions but we have political differences (which matters most). Same thing with our KP region which speaks same language, customs, culture as Afghanistan southern region but again political differences. Unfortunately modern world is divided into political boundaries and rest of us (ordinary people) are just a herd / sheep mentality and will become fuel in wars and power games.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Has nothing to do with ancient DNA, Israeli demographics or the facts that I wrote to you. Or even KSA to begin with. Let alone the topic of this thread.

In any case certain trolls in this thread started rambling about Israel (which has no reelvance to the topic of this thread or KSA for that matter as we are one of the few countries in the world never to have recognized Israel since 1948) and other low IQ nonsense of kill switches, some imaginary permanent US military bases (there is not a single foreign military base in KSA to begin with) etc. nonsense.

This is most likely due to their butthurt of RSAF being steadily transformed into one of the world's most powerful air forces. Ironically almost all of them living and paying taxes to the same West. Just the same useless noise from hypocrites.

EDIT: I am speed-limited for now, so your continued trolling/pinning for attention will not be replied to from my part.

HOWEVER WHAT IS UNDENIABLY TRUE IS THAT RSAF AND KSA AS A WHOLE IS RAPIDLY DEVELOPING ACROSS THE ENTIRE BOARD AND GROWING STRONGER BY EACH DAY. NOTHING THAT ANYBODY, ESPECIALLY OUR ENEMIES, CAN DO ABOUT THIS FACT OTHER THAN CONTINUE THEIR USUAL OBESSIONS AND CRYING. WHICH IS ALWAYS A GOOD AMUSEMENT AND COMEDY TO WITNESS.

You SERIOUSLY believe that kill switches don't exist?????????.............................................................ASK the Iraqis what happened to their french mirage fighter jets in the 1st gulf war in January to February 1991. Why they had to fly those jets to Iran and why they still remain there.

PS I would LOVE for Saudi Arabia to have a world class, deadly airforce as this would scupper the plans of a greater israel as it DOES include parts of Saudi Arabia. Also, just to clarify, I am supportive and even pro-Saudi Arabian.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Same ethnicity do not mean peace. The Israelis absolutely hate arabs. Even their leaders often spill the truth by saying 1 Israeli life is worth 1000 arabs. I shared video other day in which Israeli settler is saying that 1 Israeli life is worth 10 million muslims.

As far as DNA similar / same region / same ethnicity is concerned, that makes things even worse in most cases. Look at North Korea and South Korea. Look at us Pakistan. Punjab and Kashmir is literally split between india and Pakistan and we are often at each other throats. The foods, language, culture, many things look same especially in close by regions but we have political differences (which matters most). Same thing with our KP region which speaks same language, customs, culture as Afghanistan southern region but again political differences. Unfortunately modern world is divided into political boundaries and rest of us (ordinary people) are just a herd / sheep mentality and will become fuel in wars and power games.

Just to clarify, Pakistani Punjabi and Kashmiri food is NOT like indian food.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Saudi Arabia is buying the F-35 because it is fully compatible with its air force fleet..They want the KAAN for localizing the 5th generation technologies and they have an eye on the Euro-Japanese 6th generation..

That's fine I understand. That's not the point. KSA certainly has deep pockets to get F35s and KAAN...
...it's about the overall philosophy. To make an analogy...let's look at the overall strategies of two other rich middle eastern nations.

- Qatar...buys Eurofighters, Rafales, F15s...of course it's meant to get favor of major European powers and US. That is the overall defense(having the backing of major powers) but in the process it's not the most efficient/effective way to build their air force. Not to mention a complete lack of building any local capabilities/industry...
...and it comes with a leash. For example if they fall out with France...their Rafale fleet could be in jeopardy in terms of support.

- UAE..a similarly small but rich country in the vicinity...while also does some of these efforts to have the backing/support of major powers..but doesn't fully take such an ineffective approach(in terms of building up its own capabilities). UAE has made major moves(notably standing out amongst its neighbors/peers) to actively develop its defense industries. UAE has been picking up talent from South Africa and supporting its local defense industry.

Of course the above examples aren't to compare air force vs air force or some other simplistic analysis...but the overall approach of what will pay more in the long run ..for a country to become strong(and hopefully self reliant as much as possible...or if not self reliant..then at least on the minimal amount of leash when it comes to defense).

In that sense having a couple of squadrons of F35 doesn't change much for KSA. They can easily wait another decade for KAAN and use the resources there, which would pay dividends for KSA(if they can get some work share or licensed production or the ability to customize a bit with their own avionics, sensors, or weaponry).

F35 is an impressive jet no doubt..but KSA's neighbors like GCC aren't about to pick a fight with KSA. The only adversaries posing any major threats would be Iran and Israel. F35s are an overkill for Iran..they don't have an air force to speak of. KSA can use its Eurofighters and F15s to do the same job(hopefully it doesn't come to that..bcuz war is never good). The other country being Israel...in which case US would very very likely side with Israel...in which case expect no support for those F35s and Israeli F35s would likely probably be superior to those given to KSA ..even if that's not the case..once the support dries up in case of conflict(like parts for maintenance and repair and munitions)..they would increasingly become a museum piece rather than an effective fighting machine.
For any other minor nuisances challenging KSA like the Houthis...F35 is obviously an overkill.

In conclusion..yes F35 is an impressive jet and would certainly add to KSA's air power...but overall it would be far better to just divert that funding towards KAAN and try to jump start domestic capabilities in that regard as much as possible for a much better gain overall.

 

[FarhanSiddiqui]

You are still on that stupid theory of "Kill Switches"?

You are clueless about US controlling its military hardware sold to other countries (except Zionazis)

• Software Control: The F-35 relies on millions of lines of code and network systems managed by the United States, meaning continuous combat capability requires ongoing U.S. updates and data link access.
• Supply Chain and Spares: Without a steady flow of American-controlled spare parts, technical support, and maintenance data, an international fleet would naturally and gradually become grounded over time.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Bingo.
More information about the rapid and highly succesful ongoing military industrialization within KSA.

Thread 'Localising Power: Saudi Defence Industrialisation as Strategic Bargain'

Oct 3, 2025

Just came across this series of publications posted literally today. I have not read all of it but it looks highly informative and extensive.

3 Oct 2025

A Strategic Business: The Politics of Saudi Arabia’s Defence Transformation​

How is Saudi Arabia’s defence transformation reshaping its industrial base, military modernisation, and strategic partnerships while balancing U.S. interoperability with growing ties to European and Asian partners?

Eleonora Ardemagni​

ISPI Senior Associate Research Fellow MIDDLE EAST AND NORTH AFRICA...

• _Arabia_
• Replies: 33
• Forum: Arab Defence Forum

• 

KSA has had a 80 + year old strategic relationship with US that has immensely benefitted KSA. There is ZERO reason for that to change anytime soon. For decades KSA had a trade surplus with the US and for decades (nowadays millions) untold number of Saudi Arabian students have travelled to the US for education (much of it elite) which helped create one of the Muslim world's and developing world's largest industrial revolutions and growth within KSA as well as scientific ones on every field.

As for Israel, that many trolls in this thread mention, Israel has not even attack KSA 1 single time since 1948. There will be no conflict and besides of that Israel is an ethnically Arab country (20-25% of the population are Muslim and Christian Arabs) and 2/3 of all Israeli Jews are Arab Jews originally, including form modern-day KSA.

Israel will have to live with either a 1-state solution or 2-state solution eventually and once either happens, KSA and Israel will and should develop close neighborly ties. Israel has more to offer KSA than 99% of all Muslim countries and we are cousins.

I just recently looked at ancient Israelite/Caanite DNA and to no surprise Saudi Arabians are the ones that cluster the closest to those ancient populations.

Similarly with the Natufian DNA (world's first and oldest Neolithic culture) which is also closest to modern-day Saudi Arabians.

Natufian culture - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

See my post 506 in this thread below where all the DNA results can be seen:

Thread 'Arabic Coffee shop'

Jul 24, 2024

No politics.. just discussion of culture, daily life, , questions and answers, sports updates,, funny shows.. funny Arabic YouTube videos and classic Arabic things....a lot of great ideas ....

• The SC
• Replies: 584
• Forum: Middle East & Africa

• 

My friend
those days are over,
we are way past those days ...
We will walk and run on our own now and we are determined to make it on our own.

My only concern, will be some jealous friends, who might plot mischief and anarchy.
We stay clear for the next few years, we are Gold !

Now or never.

 

[KingQamaR]

You SERIOUSLY believe that kill switches don't exist?????????.............................................................ASK the Iraqis what happened to their french mirage fighter jets in the 1st gulf war in January to February 1991. Why they had to fly those jets to Iran and why they still remain there.

PS I would LOVE for Saudi Arabia to have a world class, deadly airforce as this would scupper the plans of a greater israel as it DOES include parts of Saudi Arabia. Also, just to clarify, I am supportive and even pro-Saudi Arabian.

Even without a kill switch, the USA can use firmware bugs, or stop supplying maintenance parts or all kind other bs.

 

[KingQamaR]

It would be better for KSA to spend tons of money(to make it enticing) with either China or Turkey in their exportable 5th gen program...
...and have the ability for licensed production established in KSA. It would be even better if they can customize it(sort of like how Israel does with its F35s) but even without that...having less strings attached and having local production would be far better than importing F35s with a tight leash.

The RAAF has reported maintenance costs 70% above advertised. Even Switzerland is already paying 40% more than is written in the contract before even receiving the first aircraft. F35 contracts are full of corruption (they call that lobbying in the US )every one is ripped off like everything else to do with US.

 

[KingQamaR]

Dumb Middle Easterners it’s not a good idea to buy your weapons from your enemy US. Buy the Chinese J20 J35 from a reliable supplier and a friend