US Supplied F-16 Fighters in Pakistan Were Too Obsolete to Fight India in 2025

[Ali_Baba]

Yes, and considering the blistering pace of Chinese development who knows what toys will equip our J-10Cs/J-35s in the future!?

The PL-15s we used to shoot down brand new Rafales were 15 years old. One can only imagine what is in the very latest models....

I don't think there will be any upgrades for the J10CE by China, there is no reason for them, ie they won't be a J10D ( or J10CE Block II etc ). The J10CE now is the best it will ever be, its not like Lockheed Martin where they are now selling the F-35 platform but also in parallel developing and offering Block V/70 upgrade options for existing F16 users. The Chinese military-industrial complex is not setup that way, which is why I think PAF should not purchase any new J10CE's and jump to the J-35AE now as that is where the innovation curve and development focus will be for the Chinese military-industrial complex.

 

[Yasser76]

No need to sell them! Just relegate to the 3rd tier and use up their airframes lifespan. There is NO aircraft in the PAF that can carry a heavy load that the F16 can, the J10CE does not come close in that regard.

Yeah, also issue is how we continue with NATO/Turkish exercises without F-16s right?
Sure we can send JF-17s but we will not get anywhere near the experiance.

At least Indians still have 28 Rafales that are compatible with NATO.

PAF has benefited from US/NATO interaction since the 50s (obviously with ups and downs during sanctions), whilst Chinese tech develops at a fast pace, we cannot forget that US/NATO tactics,, strategy and training is world class. F-16s enabled a lot in this regard

 

[RealNapster]

@Oscar is it correct? per cost modernisation of f 16 15-20 million?

I am not quoting someone's figures, I just assumed the modernisation will cost around this much per plane.

 

[maxpane]

I am not quoting someone's figures, I just assumed the modernisation will cost around this much per plane.

i think its expensive and all 75 cant be upgraded . our blk 15 cant get block 72 upgradation . its better to buy new ones which cost less than upgradation of old ones .

 

[RealNapster]

i think its expensive and all 75 cant be upgraded . our blk 15 cant get block 72 upgradation . its better to buy new ones which cost less than upgradation of old ones .

I think we have less than 15 block 52. Even if the lower blocks can be modernised to level of Block 52 that would still be many fold improvement.

But then again, we would still need to find replacement for them around 2040. So new fighter jets makes more sense. But if the goal is increasing numbers of 4.5G while spending less for temporary purposes. Then upgrading F16s to block 52 make sense.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Yeah, also issue is how we continue with NATO/Turkish exercises without F-16s right?
Sure we can send JF-17s but we will not get anywhere near the experiance.

At least Indians still have 28 Rafales that are compatible with NATO.

PAF has benefited from US/NATO interaction since the 50s (obviously with ups and downs during sanctions), whilst Chinese tech develops at a fast pace, we cannot forget that US/NATO tactics,, strategy and training is world class. F-16s enabled a lot in this regard

I am hoping(and thinking) that the PAF see the KAAN as a way to maintain that training relationship with NATO countries with Türkiye being a NATO country etc . There may be restrictions from Türkiye on that though with it being a stealth platform ? But your point about needing to maintain a training relationship with NATO/Western countries is critical to the PAF and some solution may need to be found for that as time comes along and if KAAN can't be that option.

 

[maxpane]

I think we have less than 15 block 52. Even if the lower blocks can be modernised to level of Block 52 that would still be many fold improvement.

But then again, we would still need to find replacement for them around 2040. So new fighter jets makes more sense. But if the goal is increasing numbers of 4.5G while spending less for temporary purposes. Then upgrading F16s to block 52 make sense.

our older blocks are mlu's mean they are as modernise as block 52s but cant get modern upgradation . Only block 30 plus can be upgraded. now senior members can give us a better view here

 

[KingQamaR]

F16 viper can out turn any fighter in US inventory was tested in mock combat the exception of the F22 . A dinosaur, yes, but certainly nothing to sneeze at. A up to date or a newer version of f16 would roast an over rated Rafale fighter. PAF f16s are not outclassed it’s American not helping them be better upgraded.

Pakistan bought JC10 was heavily modified on PAFS recommendations. It’s an excellent fighter. It comes with whole fighter package for the price f-16 bs upgrade. That’s a pretty good deal, AESA radar, PL-15 BVR Missile, And PAF can use the F-16 viper as point of defence.

 

[Beijingwalker]

F16 viper can out turn any fighter in US inventory was tested in mock combat the exception of the F22 . A dinosaur, yes, but certainly nothing to sneeze at. A up to date or a newer version of f16 would roast an over rated Rafale fighter. PAF f16s are not outclassed it’s American not helping them be better upgraded.

Pakistan bought JC10 was heavily modified on PAFS recommendations. It’s an excellent fighter. It comes with whole fighter package for the price f-16 bs upgrade. That’s a pretty good deal, AESA radar, PL-15 BVR Missile, And PAF can use the F-16 viper as point of defence.

A half a century old platform can only be upgraded to some extent, and modern technology just develops in leaps and bounds on monthly basis.

 

[Raider 21]

Much to your disappointment @Beijingwalker, the F-16s were in the air during those days. The J-10 took many headlines, but the F-16 was still utilised and will be used.

Do not open another meaningless thread again.

 

[Yasser76]

A half a century old platform can only be upgraded to some extent, and modern technology just develops in leaps and bounds on monthly basis.

This is true, and F-16 is no longer front line for PAF, but just like Mirage IIIs played aan important secondary strike and air defence role, we may well see this happen with the F-16.

Bar Rafales, no Indian fighter would be happy going up against the APG-89/AIM-120 combo, and that may well hold true for the next 10 years, mainly due to the fact we have an IAF deprived of new high end fighter deliveries, that will change eventually, until it does, F-16 all the way.

Now for Pakistan's cutting edge and deterrence not just against India but also Israel, J-35 is very much the future

 

[Oscar]

Let's take a fresh perspective on F-16 (Block 15 to 52) we've had in our inventory for over 45 years.

What have we gained from them?

Carrot Stick with US and their permissions

Long-term sanctions
Economic compromises
Expensive parts
Resource shortages
Limited access to supplies
Data sharing with their enemies

70+K Pakistan killed
Salala attacks
Predator Drones everyday (.....started next day after received F-16 Block 52 latest version many years ago)

Begging, Begging and Begging for more F-16s.

SELL all of F-16 (rusty, unreliable and bad qualities) - don't worship it anymore!

lol - yes - these were all due to F-16s.