PTI News, Updates and Discussion

Do you think PTI has a future without Imran Khan?

  • Yes

    Votes: 22 19.6%

  • No

    Votes: 80 71.4%

  • Only if senior leadership is released

    Votes: 10 8.9%
  • Total voters
    112
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hasssanali8998 said:
Yeah, but repeating the same points without adding anything new isn’t a discussion , it’s a rerun. I’m not dodging the topic, I’m just not going to keep debating stuff that’s already been broken down a hundred times unless you’ve got something fresh to add.
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my friend if you’ve got something new to add then I’m all ears. But dismissing valid points as “reruns” isn’t how real dialogue works.
 
Oscar said:
At this point - you’re the only one who is sounding what you accuse everyone else who disagrees with you of(wonder where those traits got developed over the years ).

Because if you cannot acknowledge that you calling Shahid Afridi having no connection to KP because he was born in Karachi isn’t applicable to Imran Khan having no connection to KP because he was born in Lahore - then you are a hypocrite.

Whether IKs onwards history changes the “level” of connection is gauged by their respective contributions - which would have been fine if you said that.

But because you are a ghumand jahil - you have no better intelligent input to provide other than dodgy statements.
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Shahid Afridi is a typical karachi tapoori who just happen to have a surname which ties him to KPK. Now I havent meet him person, I know people from 13/D who have seen him grow from child to the cricketer he become. He is a typical karachi kid who will find in your local bakery asking "uncle eek darjan anday and ek dabal roti day dain" .

Now his abbu jee wants him to be politically active in KPK because he happens to be a "Afridi", thinking he will be a good alternative to IK! Which is fine, as I said he can create his own party and run in the election.

IK on the other hand has been very much involved with his roots way before he created his party.

You clearly a numbnut, with the tarka of hubris.
 
Oscar said:
That first sentence of yours - even total Bhaktora fanboys arent that selective.

Tell me - When was CIA involved in Afghanistan?
How did the original Taliban appear - I really want to see what brilliance you come up with here.
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Why dont you cough up the answer ? what Taliban got to with the jihad of 80s?
 
Respect4Respect said:
i agree with you on most points and selective history cuts both ways. If we’re going to hold IK accountable for stalling reforms, we should also acknowledge the decades of policy failures that created the mess in the first place. Let’s not shift the entire burden onto one civilian government while letting the deeper power structures off the hook.
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You have my statement here to screenshot and throw at me whenever you want.

The military establishment (including the political, religious clergy AND monetary elite allies - either fully or by looking the other way) starting with Afghan 80: war and supercharged by Hamid Gul types - created and enabled extremism and specifically militant extremism for both “at the time” and “future potential” uses for their interpretation and ideas of “for Pakistan’s” benefit.

These ideals were rarely thought from a “what if” concept to mostly a myopic idealism that assumed that once the objectives of getting “depth”(or as Zia called it Koh e Kaaf) were achieved these elements could be tamed or would be passive.

Now, how does IK come into this?
He was “right” in that when you attack the Taliban or rather conduct operations on the very system you enabled - you aren’t just removing cancer but you will hit all the organs along with it and the body will fight back. What he did not however outline is that IT IS A CANCER - the establishment KNOWS IT SCREWED UP but it also has its own entanglement among this cancer it could not remove lest there is a need for these elements as well.

Think of it as a homeless heroin addict.
The establishment made the guy homeless and supplies him heroin but is not pissed off because he is stinking up their neighborhood so they are attacking him - but then the rest of the neighborhood also has herion supply and is rattled when addicts are picked up.
IK is saying, let the addicts be and if you provide them jobs they will reform one day while completely ignoring the problem that addiction of this drug which was made from the verse “whom we had led astray” in the Quran cannot be cured.

Neither are right - and IKs “idiocies” are much less compared to the termite mentality nonsense these 200 or so max people who came from mostly in the army in the past 75 years but also clergy(and their feudal partners) - but we need to weigh them in the now and right now regardless of the massive chargesheet against the establishment - right now in this moment IK’s approach is wrong.
That doesn’t mean five star is right - far from it and he barely has a hold on what is doing but from a pure “where is the bus going” perspective - for the next 100 yards the current setups direction keeps you on a paved road(for now) while IK and PTIs approach will send you off the cliff.
Then, yes - their(current setup) direction will likely plunge the bus into a ravine and blow it up - so it is better to convince this bus driver who loves sycophants that he is in command while you figure out how to take the bus from him.

Then, IK needs to understand his “Afghan hamaray bhai” idea is nonsense. He has been fed that because of his history in Oxford running off outdated ideas of Pashtun nationalism (which ironically are coming back) that cannot be allowed to fester if Pakistan is to continue in its current form.

If that is not the goal - please continue as PTI is going and lets end and break up this country once and for all - the FM or his buddies will do it anyway or economics will.

I keep telling everyone who talks of Jinnah’s Pakistan - Jinnah is gone , Ayub destroyed his vision permanently.

Riyasat e Medina is a fools dream - neither are the people of Pakistan the people of Medina nor are their ways or culture or values similar to them nor is ANY leader even qualified or character wise worth the dirt under Qaswa’s hooves let alone the Prophet’s character.

Pakistan needs a Pakistan today solution - PTI with its educated middle class backing was the best hope but IK whether by his own ego and Mrs control or through Faiz’s own self serving plans burnt it to the ground.
 
Imran Khan the savior, of poor and ignorant middle class of Pak.!

apparently it is the same class, when Pak. was well off in 60s, 70s and 80s, paid no heed and showed no interest in improving moral standards of this country

(shows even a million leaders like Imran Khan, cannot solve the problems of this country!)

few indicators of our declining moral stands:
(trust and confidence breakages!)

Those court cases that should never have existed — because they deprive someone of their rights — have been going on for fifty years.

He/She doesn't know how to drive properly / lacks basic road manners.

When they talk, saying “sorry” is out of the question; they won’t even speak unless someone submits to their right to humiliate them.

Wasting time on useless, pointless things.


such a society, does not deserve leaders!
 
Mighty_Dragon_Strike said:
Imran Khan the savior, of poor and ignorant middle class of Pak.!

apparently it is the same class, when Pak. was well off in 60s, 70s and 80s, paid no heed and showed no interest in improving moral standards of this country

(shows even a million leaders like Imran Khan, cannot solve the problems of this country!)

few indicators of our declining moral stands:
(trust and confidence breakages!)

Those court cases that should never have existed — because they deprive someone of their rights — have been going on for fifty years.

He/She doesn't know how to drive properly / lacks basic road manners.

When they talk, saying “sorry” is out of the question; they won’t even speak unless someone submits to their right to humiliate them.

Wasting time on useless, pointless things.


such a society, does not deserve leaders!
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What was the percentage of this middle class and more so their involvement in politics?
Could you provide metrics to your claim of “apathy” for the educated middle class. We’re not talking about the wealthy but educated people living month to month or best year to year.
 
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