Pakistan-India Conflict 2025: News Updates and Discussion

Falcon26 said:
Simple: Pakistan did not respond after the air war even as India was launching loitering munitions into Pakistan. Your ISPR guy was holding press conference talking about irrelevant stuff while everyone was asking when Pakistan will retaliate.
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Wasn't India reporting how Pakistan continued Artillery Shelling and Drones during those 2 days? 🤔
 
hnn said:
True, the only public evidence I can put forward is local and not a third party verified source. However, you don't even have that "local" evidence for your claim that PA did nothing 🥲
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See my posts ..I think PA did their job in preventing a land invasion but sorry did not give a good punch to Indians and did not defend our land from Indian missiles contained there . Overall mixed performance for sure but yes they kept defences high on the land so that sense they did their job. However to say that they did an outstanding job for the leader to get 5 stars is laughable and we are becoming a laughing stock .

Beyond Sindoor though I think asim munir has been a failure on the BLA front as we have lost the max amt of officers and soldiers in Baluchistan than ever before. Our soldiers are still going into battlefield in hiluxes which is a crime in itself. I have been talking about this since the bajwa days but nothing g has been done on that front..it is criminal . History will not be kind to him and the people who promoted him and facilitated him.
 
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hnn said:
Excellent summary, however, I'd add here that India now has also found a separatist fault line based on Political divide in our country. It's unfortunate to read comments on this forum, and other SMs, where "armed rebellion" against the "state usurpers" is increasingly becoming a common sight.

The irony is that, a number of the supporters of this armed rebellion are also supporters of peace talk with TTP - which makes me question why can't similar peace talks be held with political parties and military?
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I replied to your post here:

Post in thread 'Pakistan-Af: Operation Khyber Storm - Part ll'
https://defencepk.com/forums/threads/pakistan-af-operation-khyber-storm-part-ll.28227/post-1048153
 
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airhead said:
See my posts ..I think PA did their job in preventing a land invasion but sorry did not give a good punch to Indians and did not defend our land from Indian missiles contained there . Overall mixed performance for sure but yes they kept defences high on the land so that sense they did their job. However to say that they did an outstanding job for the leader to get 5 stars is laughable and we are becoming a laughing stock .

Beyond Sindoor though I think asim munir has been a failure on the BLA front as we have lost the max amt of officers and soldiers in Baluchistan than ever before. Our soldiers are still going into battlefield in hiluxes which is a crime in itself. I have been talking about this since the bajwa days but nothing g has been done on that front..it is criminal . History will not be kind to him and the people who promoted him and facilitated him.
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Well firstly I'm glad that you have acknowledged that PA did their job, could have begun with that, but nonetheless... Let's address the Elephant in the room first so we don't get stuck up on that - FM title was a power grab move - the reason behind which are political and not military related.

As for the Air Defense, both PA and PAF did a commendable job considering the limitations of our ADS. BrahMos is an extremely low flying supersonic vector, which is a headache even for best ADS - considering the extent of damage they did in Pakistan, it is not equitable to the amount of vectors launched. Only a few made impact from the total, the rest were defended against. This was neither a failure of our armed forces, nor a success - it's a vulnerability that India exploited and hopefully it'll be addressed with yet more batteries of ADS for all three services branches.

As for BLA and Balochistan, PA/FC has been suffering less casualties from before. A few years back, a number of personnel would embrace martyrdom in ambushes and IEDs laid by BLA/BRAS - they would get sniped plenty in Avaran, Turbat, and Pasni. Not only that but a number of Navy and Coast guard personnel were also martyred around Gwadar a few years back. However, most of the present day casualties result from IEDs/VBIEDs and less from ambushes. Also, if you compare the present day number of attacks purported by BLA and subsequent casualties with the number of attacks and subsequent casualties from a few years back - there's a reduction in the percentage of casualties per BLA attack.

We can argue about our armed forces under equipped but that comes down to economics. We can also blame the top leadership here, and rightly so, because they are accountable for these things.

All I'm saying is if you want to criticize FM, do so, but do so in a way that doesn't undermine PA because they have been doing a really good job e.g. the number of terrorists and their commanders taken out recently? And they did a really good job back in May whether it was independently reported or not.

Keep political moves such as "FM Title" and "Constitutional Immunity" separate from the operational success of PA.
 
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hnn said:
Well firstly I'm glad that you have acknowledged that PA did their job, could have begun with that, but nonetheless... Let's address the Elephant in the room first so we don't get stuck up on that - FM title was a power grab move - the reason behind which are political and not military related.

As for the Air Defense, both PA and PAF did a commendable job considering the limitations of our ADS. BrahMos is an extremely low flying supersonic vector, which is a headache even for best ADS - considering the extent of damage they did in Pakistan, it is not equitable to the amount of vectors launched. Only a few made impact from the total, the rest were defended against. This was neither a failure of our armed forces, nor a success - it's a vulnerability that India exploited and hopefully it'll be addressed with yet more batteries of ADS for all three services branches.

As for BLA and Balochistan, PA/FC has been suffering less casualties from before. A few years back, a number of personnel would embrace martyrdom in ambushes and IEDs laid by BLA/BRAS - they would get sniped plenty in Avaran, Turbat, and Pasni. Not only that but a number of Navy and Coast guard personnel were also martyred around Gwadar a few years back. However, most of the present day casualties result from IEDs/VBIEDs and less from ambushes. Also, if you compare the present day number of attacks purported by BLA and subsequent casualties with the number of attacks and subsequent casualties from a few years back - there's a reduction in the percentage of casualties per BLA attack.

We can argue about our armed forces under equipped but that comes down to economics. We can also blame the top leadership here, and rightly so, because they are accountable for these things.

All I'm saying is if you want to criticize FM, do so, but do so in a way that doesn't undermine PA because they have been doing a really good job e.g. the number of terrorists and their commanders taken out recently? And they did a really good job back in May whether it was independently reported or not.

Keep political moves such as "FM Title" and "Constitutional Immunity" separate from the operational success of PA.
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Please dont make excuses for incompetence and call it for what it is. I dont have the stats but I feel we have lost a lot of officers during munir in Baluchistan. Why are they going into battlefield in Hiluxes? You claim “economics”. I say it is lack or focus and attention as the brainpower of the coas has been sucked into undermining politicians to a point where thjngs are slipping through the cracks . We need 100 % of Coas brain power and time into figuring out how to win on the battlefield nothing more nothing less…100%. Anything less means risking losing . Paf has innovated tremendously because the leadership is thinking about that all the time ..how to win in the air battle. I am not sure how much coas thinks about this but it is probably less than 5 % of this brain that goes into that. All we want munir is to devote his time to is winning over India on the battlefield ..not just securing Baluchistan but also beating India to secure all of kashmir, junagarh and Hyderabad..these are all lands that historically should have gone to Pakistan. Yea these are not easy tasks but how does our army outthink the enemy ? That is what we need the coas to be doing not to do haram Khori with politics. Paf has shown how it is done and now army needs to show it. My fear is that the same horrible culture is going to pollute Paf with this new appt. May Allah save Pakistan from these horrible people
 
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airhead said:
Please dont make excuses for incompetence and call it for what it is. I dont have the stats but I feel we have lost a lot of officers during munir in Baluchistan. Why are they going into battlefield in Hiluxes? You claim “economics”. I say it is lack or focus and attention as the brainpower of the coas has been sucked into undermining politicians to a point where thjngs are slipping through the cracks . We need 100 % of Coas brain power and time into figuring out how to win on the battlefield nothing more nothing less…100%. Anything less means risking losing . Paf has innovated tremendously because the leadership is thinking about that all the time ..how to win in the air battle. I am not sure how much coas thinks about this but it is probably less than 5 % of this brain that goes into that. All we want munir is to devote his time to is winning over India on the battlefield ..not just securing Baluchistan but also beating India to secure all of kashmir, junagarh and Hyderabad..these are all lands that historically should have gone to Pakistan. Yea these are not easy tasks but how does our army outthink the enemy ? That is what we need the coas to be doing not to do haram Khori with politics. Paf has shown how it is done and now army needs to show it. My fear is that the same horrible culture is going to pollute Paf with this new appt. May Allah save Pakistan from these horrible people
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You do realize that the Hiluxes are used by FC and that's a CAF under MOD, and the PA stationed in Balochistan is mostly MIB and doesn't even ride into battlefields as you are mentioning?

How about we carry on this conversation when you start providing "stats" and "evidence" for your claims, since you wanted "evidence from others" to begin with?

Also, not going to take your bait against PAF and try to compare them with PA 🫰🏼
 
And your evidence for this?
As publicly reported, India kept screaming about PA artillery shelling and drone incursion, whereas Pakistan kept denying it.

@Falcon26
 
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