Pakistan-India Conflict 2025: News Updates and Discussion

[AeronautIR]

Just a correction, from my memory that feed was shown the next day in the briefings.

I was serving in AHQ at that time and part of the team Swift Retort. So let's keep this discussion for another time when we wrap up this one.

 

[Bilal]

I was serving in AHQ at that time and part of the team Swift Retort. So let's keep this discussion for another time when we wrap up this one.

In the time and age of information overload and data fusion. We have to discuss everything at the same time.

 

[Ibbi32]

I was serving in AHQ at that time and part of the team Swift Retort. So let's keep this discussion for another time when we wrap up this one.

Would love to hear about it one day

 

[AeronautIR]

Let's talk about what is ahead of us. Indians yesterday claim to test fire AKASH-NG ADS. The significant feature of this ADS is multi-skeer approach. It has dual-pulse propulsion and AESA+IR seeker which made it considerably advanced. So, what esteemed members think of this new system and its implications.

O yes please
I haven't seen the news yet but I agree with you about taking the discussion to the future.

 

[AeronautIR]

Would love to hear about it one day

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[AeronautIR]

In the time and age of information overload and data fusion. We have to discuss everything at the same time.

So be it

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[PAKISTANFOREVER]

I can only speculate but I think Modi and co. were ready to accept a couple of losses to humiliate Pakistan. That is why their main focus was on optics and a must have requirement of photos/videos to show the public.
I don't think it is a good strategy to only try to win perception war while losing assets like Rafale and S-400, but many will disagree with me.
Militarily, this conflict was a blunder for India and they are just cashing the target photos by using them in PsyOps.
Personally, I am quite satisfied with overall result of this conflict against a much bigger adversary.

A 7× bigger adversary. Apart from Pakistan, can you name ANY OTHER nation on earth that has independently managed to take on an enemy nation that is more than 7× bigger than it and at the time had the FULL BACKING of the west, eu, america, israel and russia?

 

[rafale]

Getting back to the point of brahmos threat and can it disable the PAF bases.

Yes, they have it in large numbers but can they launch in large numbers at a certain time? No -- so it's a threat if the conflict sustains for a longer period.

PAF bases can absorb 10-15 direct hits and can still keep generating the response. The ORI at bases makes sure of it. I guess no one here has really experienced the rigorous audit and inspection that is done for all bases -- except you, i and perhaps only a couple others

On the events of 10th may part, it's totally fair for the people who only have OSINT as their source of information to have doubts and be skeptical. It's totally fine. In fact, i would appreciate the fact that we have people with ability to think rationally with available evidence -- so it's best to move on from this point.

10-15 direct hits where? On tarmac? On empty lands? On empty hangers? By that version, air bases can clearly absorb a lot more missiles......but if even one or two make it to critical infrastructure or disable your ongoing scrambles then that's a different issue.

Clearly, as day and night, PAF airbases need a three tier air defense shield. Sure, spoofing worked this time, may not work at all next time. Indians are vile and they will upgrade their seekers and guidance with help from pissraelis.

Last, do not disregard the massive threat emanating from drones. Massive. Its bigger than any brahmos or scalp threat. Small drones can cause multiple small scale damages which together can amount to massive destruction and disabling of your operations.

But i have full faith in PAF that they will learn and plug loop holes because bhindians now only have one option to fight with and that is by doing swarm drone and ALCM/SLCM attacks. And they will do it from deeper inside india....300-400km from IB.

 

[rafale]

all discussion are welcome in this thread since it is about the May conflict.

But why is no one highlighting or discussing the lack of the much overhyped METEORs on Rafales?

I mean, this was the probably the most long range BVR shoot out in history and IAF jets were duds? Hard to believe that a strike package of 70+ aircraft would not be carrying Meteors.

From noise and clutter and usual bravado on other social media forums, i.e. Reddit Indian defense ones, Indians seem to be questioning if Meteors are even integrated on their Rafales......which to me is funny because Meteor is literally the only thing that made Rafale purchase worthy for them......

India ordered F3 Rafales........just about time when the Meteor integrated F3R version came out....the idea was Indians will get the Meteors...but clearly 5 years on we didnt see any action.

This shows in their blind arrogance, the stupidity they still posses.....and ignorance of the PL15 threat which PAF literally teased them in the Indian faces just before May 7th.

 

[r3alist]

Beyond this, some friends speak of informational victory, which is important to a degree, but I put it to those friends - a nation with an online presence of at least 10x our own that is furthermore prepared to obfuscate and distort reality to degrees seen in the Bollywood movie industry may cause far more informational harm to itself than we ever could.

Just a slight correction here, the Indians praise Pakistan for the information victory, which is just a snide way of saying they gave the perception of victory, not actual victory

This suits their narrative.

How about the other way around, the information flows downstream from actual events

 

[r3alist]

I can only speculate but I think Modi and co. were ready to accept a couple of losses to humiliate Pakistan. That is why their main focus was on optics and a must have requirement of photos/videos to show the public.

Remember that they were the aggressor at a time and place of their choice, remember that phrase?

They had to go significantly up the escalation ladder having taken losses, to me that is already a failing operation, and remember that Pakistan did not respond to the brahmos but probably would have if this continued.

At that stage it was probably prudent to take this action, accept mediation, and have a ceasefire.

If anything India is still fighting the information war, by insisting Pakistan asked for a ceasefire, but they do not ask why they accepted this ceasefire if they are not open to outside influence.

 

[side-winder]

10-15 direct hits where? On tarmac? On empty lands? On empty hangers? By that version, air bases can clearly absorb a lot more missiles......but if even one or two make it to critical infrastructure or disable your ongoing scrambles then that's a different issue.

Clearly, as day and night, PAF airbases need a three tier air defense shield. Sure, spoofing worked this time, may not work at all next time. Indians are vile and they will upgrade their seekers and guidance with help from pissraelis.

Last, do not disregard the massive threat emanating from drones. Massive. Its bigger than any brahmos or scalp threat. Small drones can cause multiple small scale damages which together can amount to massive destruction and disabling of your operations.

But i have full faith in PAF that they will learn and plug loop holes because bhindians now only have one option to fight with and that is by doing swarm drone and ALCM/SLCM attacks. And they will do it from deeper inside india....300-400km from IB.

There is backup for everything deemed important to support the operations. Regular exercises are conducted to activate such backups in the event of destruction of the primary setup. So im referring to direct hits on critical setups.

 

[rafale]

There is backup for everything deemed important to support the operations. Regular exercises are conducted to activate such backups in the event of destruction of the primary setup. So im referring to direct hits on critical setups.

Yes but i really hope all PAF bases will have multi tier dependable Anti Air attack defense.

For those near the border such as Sargodha, anti drone swarm tactics also needed.

Further, PAF must establish at least two independent large air bases in depths of balochistan........because targeting them with ALCMs would be next to impossible for IAF...and it will provide a nice sanctuary for PAF to continue their operations. Both bases will need to be equipped for multi platform operations. Your jets would need to carry drop tanks to make westward towards hot theater.....but for Air to Air combat they can jettison these before enter the combat zone over Punjab/Sindh.

I don't know why they chose Bholari where it is.......you already have Masroor and Jacobabad in Sindh......should have established the infrastructure 200-300 km west in balochistan. This needs serious thought.

In this regard, Navy is absolutely doing brilliantly by moving its infrastructure westwards for both submarines and surface assets.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

It has become clear to me that diplomacy has failed in the Kashmir dispute. Because India does not want to hold a plebiscite.

These barbarians do not want to do it the democratic way.

War is the only way to win Kashmir back.

The only way to get back Kashmir is to have a stronger economy and stronger military than India.

We need to annex Afghanistan to become stronger.

 

[hnn]

Not to mention the restraint in escalation which will go towards nuclear if we start using cruise missiles against multiple targets.

is very important to understand. All of our CMs are declared dual-capable, and the cherry on top is the First-Use Policy (tied to our nuclear doctrine) which makes it a very risky gamble to use a CM (even with conventional warhead) because of the perceived ambiguity at adversary's end (which is also a nuclear power).

The F4 system is designed to fill that gap, but it's sub-sonic (a separate discussion).

The second capability gap is the longer ranged SOWs. The ARFC was raised post-May to fill that gap, and I'm sure this gap will also be filled for PAF (although I'm not aware of any details on it). Loitering Munitions is also being adopted as a filler for this gap.

And lastly, the restraint comes down to a simple existential question i.e. Do we want a full-scale war and risk nuclear showdown?

So, while it is easy to call for "no-restraint" response but the consequences of such actions are pretty obvious, and not in the interest of either country.