PAF Conducts Successful Test Launch of Taimoor ALCM

[RAMPAGE]

This is a comparison in terms of the system. Of course for Pakistan's industry I'd want Taimoor and Rasoob all the way. However, I don't see how Rasoob (the real competitor to SOM) can compete with the SOM considering SOM is a well developed system, already in service with the Azeris, and Rasoob is just a concept at this point.

Are you suggesting that we should order SOM instead of working on Rasoob?

 

[AeronautIR]

I totally agree that India inherited an established industrial base while what we got barring a few factories in Karachi/Lahore area was the backwaters of the British Raj. However, Pakistan has unfortunately regressed in the past 20+ years instead of progressing. Dare I say our industrial base circa 1965 was much better than current. We had a fledgling ship building industry, even local car manufacturing industry. That were first hit hard by Bhutto nationalization and following that successive mismanagement under various doctorships, semi democratic and hybrid regimes. As we stand, we have been converted to a consumer economy that can't / wont manufacture anything and imports everything by taking loans

You also have to agree that for the atleast past 8+ years military has had a stranglehold on every aspect of Pakistan's governance. If you think that a civilian government is running the show and setting up its economic, education, health etc policy instead of Vigo waly sarkar, then we'll have to politely disagree on it.

My 1st month on this forum...

I saw a claim here that if no imagery is shown, it means no targets were hit. I disagreed politely, and was called all those names for not agreeing with it.

I gave a timeline of J-35 as 2026-27. Again, instead of right or wrong debate, same toxic response with snide low blows.

The topic of industrial base is far more complex than just military controlling everything. I have no problem accepting that military has a fair share of blame in all our problems. But if we actually want to find a solution, we have to dig deeper. E.g., policies of 4 governments in 1990s.

To conclude, my point is that PAF has done professionally good and it is a separate topic from political intervention by armed forces. The insults hurled at me were on the premise that I am defending the military which is not true.

 

[JamD]

Are you suggesting that we should order SOM instead of working on Rasoob?

No. Pakistanis need to practice some protectionism of our industries. I'm just saying for the Azeris the SOM makes more sense than the Taimoor or Rasoob.

 

[safriz]

This is a comparison in terms of the system. Of course for Pakistan's industry I'd want Taimoor and Rasoob all the way. However, I don't see how Rasoob (the real competitor to SOM) can compete with the SOM considering SOM is a well developed system, already in service with the Azeris, and Rasoob is just a concept at this point.

So you want more Indians to cancel their holidays to Turkiye ?
They already salty about Tirkiye after Pakistan used Turkish drones against them.
Now you want Pakistan to use SOM missile against them ?
Turkish delights will be permanently banned in India

 

[JamD]

So you want more Indians to cancel their holidays to Turkiye ?
They already salty about Tirkiye after Pakistan used Turkish drones against them.
Now you want Pakistan to use SOM missile against them ?
Turkish delights will be permanently banned in India

DON'T REDEEM!

 

[Yasser76]

So you want more Indians to cancel their holidays to Turkiye ?
They already salty about Tirkiye after Pakistan used Turkish drones against them.
Now you want Pakistan to use SOM missile against them ?
Turkish delights will be permanently banned in India

Turks and Azeris do not give a f**k about India's mood swings. The last thing you do to people like that is threaten them and expect them to bow down.

Straight after Indian threats Azeris announced investments in Pakistan and took deliveries of JF-17s, Turks completing an entire drone factory in Pakistan now.

Hope Indians carry on crying if these are the results.

 

[hasssanali8998]

Azeris do not give a f**k about India's mood swings.

they had turkish azeri and pakistani flags at their victory parade , that should tell you all you need to know

 

[Yasser76]

they had turkish azeri and pakistani flags at their victory parade , that should tell you all you need to know

Was in Istanbul 2 months back, man they dont consider India at all when you chat to them about geopolitics, like literally as if India does not exist.

4% of tourism to Turkiye is from India, even if it went down by 50% that is just a 2% drop. Also in terms of expenditure per head Indians are are the lowest level
In the meantime they have made massive inroads in attracting Arab and SE Asian tourists (partly through great marketing by THY). These types of tourists spend around 4 times what Indians do.

 

[Michael]

My 1st month on this forum...

I saw a claim here that if no imagery is shown, it means no targets were hit. I disagreed politely, and was called all those names for not agreeing with it.

I gave a timeline of J-35 as 2026-27. Again, instead of right or wrong debate, same toxic response with snide low blows.

The topic of industrial base is far more complex than just military controlling everything. I have no problem accepting that military has a fair share of blame in all our problems. But if we actually want to find a solution, we have to dig deeper. E.g., policies of 4 governments in 1990s.

To conclude, my point is that PAF has done professionally good and it is a separate topic from political intervention by armed forces. The insults hurled at me were on the premise that I am defending the military which is not true.

At the end of 2024, China's Ministry of State Security published an article warning Chinese netizens about spies hiding on social media.

One of the points made was:

Some espionage organizations are lurking on social media. They disguise themselves as experts, scholars, and think tank members (with professional teams helping to support their identities), becoming well-known figures in online communities. They are quite active daily, actively helping many unsuspecting netizens, and therefore, have a large number of followers.

They specifically target members with "special identities." Once they identify such targets, they proactively launch attacks, criticisms, and insults to provoke the target. Due to pride and a desire to prove their innocence, the target may lose their composure during the conversation and potentially use "confidential information" to support their arguments. From then on, the target falls into the trap.

 

[Ali_Baba]

What do you think of Pakistan integrating the SOM missiles on JF-17 as Azerbaijan is rumored to be doing? Will it provide capability upgrade over the Taimoor/Raad?

Given that the technical integration has already been done on the JF17C, I would be surprised if PAF didn't buy some, given the cost advantage relative to local solutions. It does need to build an operational doctrine around them as in "war time conditions", PAF could place "emergency orders" of this missile to deploy in the same way that Pakistan was able to purchase and deploy Turkish drones. Missiles are consumables that will run out far quicker than you want them to, and it is obvious manufacturing within Pakistan will not be able to keep up with demand in any war.

So, yes, a technically better local solution exists, but it cannot be produced on mass or in a cost effective way, so the SOM helps solves near term problems just as long as PAF purchases and deploys a small amount of SOM and pilots are familiar with the platform.

The more Turkish consumables(weapons) that Pakistan integrates onto the JF17, the better Pakistan's war time reserves become as it can call on Turkiye ( alongside China of course ).

(imho).

 

[hasssanali8998]

technical integration has already been done on the JF17C

to me one of the best part of the azeri deal , we get to integrate Turkish weapons on Azerbaijan's dime . hopefully this continues in the future

 

[hasssanali8998]

At the end of 2024, China's Ministry of State Security published an article warning Chinese netizens about spies hiding on social media.

One of the points made was:

Some espionage organizations are lurking on social media. They disguise themselves as experts, scholars, and think tank members (with professional teams helping to support their identities), becoming well-known figures in online communities. They are quite active daily, actively helping many unsuspecting netizens, and therefore, have a large number of followers.

They specifically target members with "special identities." Once they identify such targets, they proactively launch attacks, criticisms, and insults to provoke the target. Due to pride and a desire to prove their innocence, the target may lose their composure during the conversation and potentially use "confidential information" to support their arguments. From then on, the target falls into the trap.

maybe you are on of them

 

[mythbuster]

My 1st month on this forum...

I saw a claim here that if no imagery is shown, it means no targets were hit. I disagreed politely, and was called all those names for not agreeing with it.

I gave a timeline of J-35 as 2026-27. Again, instead of right or wrong debate, same toxic response with snide low blows.

The topic of industrial base is far more complex than just military controlling everything. I have no problem accepting that military has a fair share of blame in all our problems. But if we actually want to find a solution, we have to dig deeper. E.g., policies of 4 governments in 1990s.

To conclude, my point is that PAF has done professionally good and it is a separate topic from political intervention by armed forces. The insults hurled at me were on the premise that I am defending the military which is not true.

Why are you apologetic about defending military ?.....I am an army brat and I proudly defend my military.

 

[Princeps]

Are you suggesting that we should order SOM instead of working on Rasoob?

 

[Goenitz]

But if we actually want to find a solution, we have to dig deeper. E.g., policies of 4 governments in 1990s.

Frankly, those were also military extended governments (NS, IJI, Kakar formula, etc) who primarily thought of pleasing or balancing relation with the GHQ. Before that, the industry was already killed in 70s nationalization, and Zia was a non-civilian.
Anyway, do you think a booster can be added to Taimur and PL15 to be launched by, say, C-130 or Embraer or IL-17? If yes, domestically? I asked this as 09th May operation hinted about the kill chain, so why not some 10-20 such missiles for a very long stick.