PAF J-10CE News, Updates and Discussion

[PakShaheen_79]

It will take them at least till 2030-31 to have 100 Rafales in service (IAF and IN included)

That's comfortable 4 years for PAF to sell JF-17s and earn export $$$ and plan 8-10 per year J-10 Inductions.

Groundwork, integration of datalinks and tactics development by PAF already has done with J-10s, so absorbing additional numbers would be easy.

But you cant say the same for Rafales for India, since their IN will still be learning and their IAF, well, by the looks of it from May 7th clash their Rafales are still majorly flown by clowns.

Yes, they did make mistakes in intelligence gathering about PAF's true capabilities and now that advantage has gone. Certainly, IAF is not going to repeat those mistakes. Despite such thrashing on 7th, those clowns managed to hit many places in Pakistan with their aircraft and advanced weapons available to them. Indian arsenal is only going to get more lethal and it is PAF who needs to restore the balance of power in the region. We have better training regime no doubt but it can only compensate for lack of number to an extent. This is why, IAF has moved on with that 36 Billion USD deal for 114 aircraft. They will try to eliminate any technical shortcoming. Remember, J-10CE are only one element of our urgent requirement, we need a credible short-to-medium range ADS to ensure that there will be no Bohlari and Nur Khan next time.

 

[KingQamaR]

In that case, it probably belongs to the Egyptian Air Force. Any reports of Egyptian interest in the J-10c?

Pakistani J10C is heavily modified on the recommendations of PakAF. These modifications are specific to PAF only. It’s amazing multirole fighter. I wish Egyptians Airforce all the success in pursuing this Jet.

 

[KingQamaR]

Yes, they did make mistakes in intelligence gathering about PAF's true capabilities and now that advantage has gone. Certainly, IAF is not going to repeat those mistakes. Despite such thrashing on 7th, those clowns managed to hit many places in Pakistan with their aircraft and advanced weapons available to them. Indian arsenal is only going to get more lethal and it is PAF who needs to restore the balance of power in the region. We have better training regime no doubt but it can only compensate for lack of number to an extent. This is why, IAF has moved on with that 36 Billion USD deal for 114 aircraft. They will try to eliminate any technical shortcoming. Remember, J-10CE are only one element of our urgent requirement, we need a credible short-to-medium range ADS to ensure that there will be no Bohlari and Nur Khan next time.

Not That stupid India try it again lol. . So essentially what PAF, the JC-10C has done is we no longer have to do dog fighting. We will shoot the IAF out of the sky with our BVR PL-15 that’s not even the best latest version from China, before Indians IAF even knows the J-10C is in sky. Indians bought 114 jets with no source codes waste of money.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

But the position is different! It is placed much higher, almost in line with the formation lights.

Do they normally put a flag on a primer?

 

[studsmart]

observe, think, do some math
20+16+54=90/18=5

so what you are saying is that PAF will or has or ordering

20 - already delivered
16 - delivery in progress
54 - future orders

 

[Ali_Baba]

Pakistani J10C is heavily modified on the recommendations of PakAF. These modifications are specific to PAF only. It’s amazing multirole fighter. I wish Egyptians Airforce all the success in pursuing this Jet.

The problem with requesting soo many modifications is that, it becomes impossible to get war time attrition replacements quickly.

If PAF loses 20 J10CEs in an egagement(as an example), it cannot go and ask PLAAF to borrow some of its jets because the PAF jets are soo different. Part of this is the custom requirements that PAF insists on doing, and part of it because China has a policy of making exports jets quite different from those operated by the PLAAF.

So, PAF will fight whatever war it gets involved in with the equipment it has at the start of the war, with the only possibility of war time attrition loses coming from borrowing JF17s from other JF17 operators ( and why having it be an export success is quite important to the PAF ).

The version of the JF17C that is being sold, is quite standardised between the PAF and its clients. Even for Azerbaijan, those custom requirements will be fed back into the core JF17C programme and applied to PAF jets as well, giving it more compatibility with some additional Turkish munitions.

 

[rafale]

The problem with requesting soo many modifications is that, it becomes impossible to get war time attrition replacements quickly.

If PAF loses 20 J10CEs in an egagement(as an example), it cannot go and ask PLAAF to borrow some of its jets because the PAF jets are soo different. Part of this is the custom requirements that PAF insists on doing, and part of it because China has a policy of making exports jets quite different from those operated by the PLAAF.

So, PAF will fight whatever war it gets involved in with the equipment it has at the start of the war, with the only possibility of war time attrition loses coming from borrowing JF17s from other JF17 operators ( and why having it be an export success is quite important to the PAF ).

The version of the JF17C that is being sold, is quite standardised between the PAF and its clients. Even for Azerbaijan, those custom requirements will be fed back into the core JF17C programme and applied to PAF jets as well, giving it more compatibility with some additional Turkish munitions.

This is same with pretty much every combat jet.......imagine India loses all of its Mig29UPG/Ks or M2Ks? So where are they going to find the exact Indian specific models from? Used airframes, sure they can, but remember they upgraded these two types substantially over the past many years.....so where will all those components and systems come from?

To avoid attrition losses, you can only plan certain amount and assume certain amounts will be lost, heck you can lose a lot more during training sorties crashes than actual combat, but you plan your squadron numbers accordingly and procure enough fighters that way.

 

[Ali_Baba]

This is same with pretty much every combat jet.......imagine India loses all of its Mig29UPG/Ks or M2Ks? So where are they going to find the exact Indian specific models from? Used airframes, sure they can, but remember they upgraded these two types substantially over the past many years.....so where will all those components and systems come from?

To avoid attrition losses, you can only plan certain amount and assume certain amounts will be lost, heck you can lose a lot more during training sorties crashes than actual combat, but you plan your squadron numbers accordingly and procure enough fighters that way.

India has far more capacity to absorb losses than the PAF does, so part of PAFs strategy for strength in depth should be the ability to borrow ?

 

[rafale]

India has far more capacity to absorb losses than the PAF does, so part of PAFs strategy for strength in depth should be the ability to borrow ?

If it has to those levels of depth and attritions, then it means the conflict is well underway and both countries have lost significant chunks of their equipment........and Pakistan will eventually, be first, to go suicidal.

 

[KingQamaR]

The problem with requesting soo many modifications is that, it becomes impossible to get war time attrition replacements quickly.

If PAF loses 20 J10CEs in an egagement(as an example), it cannot go and ask PLAAF to borrow some of its jets because the PAF jets are soo different. Part of this is the custom requirements that PAF insists on doing, and part of it because China has a policy of making exports jets quite different from those operated by the PLAAF.
So, PAF will fight whatever war it gets involved in with the equipment it has at the start of the war, with the only possibility of war time attrition loses coming from borrowing JF17s from other JF17 operators ( and why having it be an export success is quite important to the PAF ).

The version of the JF17C that is being sold, is quite standardised between the PAF and its clients. Even for Azerbaijan, those custom requirements will be fed back into the core JF17C programme and applied to PAF jets as well, giving it more compatibility with some additional Turkish munitions.

It makes 100% sense to maintain air superiority if you are in PAF position. I’m sure PAF knows the ones China will replace them in a war attrition will be different from what we have . Im sure this fact has been accepted by PAF and plans put in place . what has been Is modernise or upgrade the correct term when what PAF is doing is to make the plane more suited to our needs. Where as PLA own Chinese JC-10C have to be used in more different theatres. Another good example is the Chinese VT TANK we bought from them , has gone thru lots of changes by Pak Army to suit our needs. Again it’s a balancing issue.

 

[AeronautIR]

I guess number must be 90+ considering requirements for CCS/ACE training squadron which obviously will be a smaller one. But we need at least 2X squadron for each air command minimum. Real threat matrix will emerge once IAF get all its Rafale and deploye them at permanent bases. PAF will have to go batch-by-batch I guess due to economic mess our elite has created.

What about J-35? Do we still need 90+ J-10 with a 5th gen?

 

[ThrustVector998]

What about J-35? Do we still need 90+ J-10 with a 5th gen?

Agreed, personally I think 2 Sqns of J-10s should be enough with a couple of Block 3 Sqns, rest of funds should be allocated for 5th gen + PFX (depends on how big of a capability upgrade it is w.r.t J-10s)

 

[AeronautIR]

Agreed, personally I think 2 Sqns of J-10s should be enough with a couple of Block 3 Sqns, rest of funds should be allocated for 5th gen + PFX (depends on how big of a capability upgrade it is w.r.t J-10s)

To my knowledge, 40 J-10C and 36 J-35 are planned.

 

[studsmart]

To my knowledge, 40 J-10C and 36 J-35 are planned.

40 more j10 c or total 40 J10C

 

[AeronautIR]

40 more j10 c or total 40 J10C

Total 40, 2 sqn.