JF-17 - Updates, News & Discussion

Ak01 said:
not a clue.

i wonder whether JF-17B's only get a part of the B3 upgrade, like the radar/HMDS.

or perhaps theyre being offered exclusively in LIFT/Training roles with a secondary combat role... no clue!
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I have a hunch proper B replacement is coming in new dual seater based of C3 possibly a D3/4?
 
hasssanali8998 said:
View attachment 185680
it might be my roza brain , but WHAT??
what does that mean
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Jf-17 block 3 is sometimes reffered to as C model as compared to single seat block 1/2 which are A it is the first major upgrade. Dual seater based on block 2 is called B model. If we are to see a new dual seater based on all the upgrades of block 3 or a possible block 4 it would probably be called a D model. I was simply thinking that such an aircraft might have the full suite of Blk 3 instead of what appears to be current B model we sent to Azerbaijan
 
airhead said:
Besides 3 Myanmar and 3 Nigerian JF17s, have any other deals been signed yet? Is the Azerbaijan contract signed and real or still in discussion? how many did they buy or are they doing the same BS as what others did..ie will buy 2-3 and test it first. lot of hype from Khwaja Asif and fanboys here on Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Argentina and how this is transform Pakistan economy etc but has anything real been signed?

My fear is that JF17 is not up to the mark in global market. This whole positioning of "we are cheap" is back firing. No one likes to buy cheap things no matter how poor you are particularly when national pride is at stake. Nations want quality and performance. Also, while JF17 has proven to be strong in A-G roles (both in Swift Retort and BUM), it has not proven to be up to the mark in AA roles. I still dont get why PAF did not have JF17 equipped with PL15s, engage Indian fighters in on May 3 2025? Why the JF17 was in a support role rather than be in a lead role along with J10s? Is it that they couldnt carry PF15s or their radar is weak? or they couldnt climb to the required altitude fast enough ? Even is Swift Retort, the AA role was primarily led by F16 even though JF17 were carrying SD-10s back then...so why did they not engage Indian fighters in Feb '19? Does the PAF not trust JF17 in AA roles? No matter how much we try to hide it, we cannot deny that JF17 did not have a single AA kill (except for a drone). This would have greatly helped its sales if it had shot down just 1 Indian plane. We need to do something about its engine thrust or lack thereof.
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You do realize the F-16 was export success because it was marketed as a cheap fighter? Same goes for Mig-21, Grippen and even the F-5. Same can be said for Mirage series to a extent, so idk what you're on about. SD-10 is a worse missile compared to C AMRAAM, hence why the F-16 was used as the PAF prefers guarantee quality/effectiveness instead of national prestige. Also no fighter conducted the kill, it was the AWAC's that did it. We ain't in 1900's, modern fighter combat record is primarily supported by AWAC's. Even countless F-15 kill numbers are just it shooting missiles and the AWAC guaranteeing the kill. So having kill number doesn't really matter, the A2G thing matters as no force multiplier can perform that. That's the Rafale was popular, it genuinely out did anything in A2G ground role while maintaining a omni-role capabilities unmatched. The only reason why we aren't getting sales is because of politics. No nation is ready to move on to Chinese systems. Only three countries dictate the fighter market, US, Russia and EU. Right now Russia is unable to supply and hence EU is stepping up, we must quickly get into the empty Russian which are primarily users who have no money(basically what the JF-17 is designed for).
 
Ak01 said:
not a clue.

i wonder whether JF-17B's only get a part of the B3 upgrade, like the radar/HMDS.

or perhaps theyre being offered exclusively in LIFT/Training roles with a secondary combat role... no clue!
Click to expand...
Maybe structural issue? Elongating the fuselage might not allow the design changes that went from Block 2 and Block 3. I mean there is a proper body change, not just avionics, from Block 2 to Block 3. Or the PAF might consider the body as the classification for Blocks and could change the avionics inside? I mean that is potentially the case as Block II won't magically be called Block III after the upgrades, despite having nearly similar material/avionics composition of Block III after upgrades.
 
meh_analysis said:
You do realize the F-16 was export success because it was marketed as a cheap fighter? Same goes for Mig-21, Grippen and even the F-5. Same can be said for Mirage series to an extent, so idk what you're on about. SD-10 is a worse missile compared to C AMRAAM, hence why the F-16 was used as the PAF prefers guarantee quality/effectiveness instead of national prestige. Also no fighter conducted the kill, it was the AWAC's that did it. We ain't in 1900's, modern fighter combat record is primarily supported by AWAC's. Even countless F-15 kill numbers are just it shooting missiles and the AWAC guaranteeing the kill. So having kill number doesn't really matter, the A2G thing matters as no force multiplier can perform that. That's the Rafale was popular, it genuinely out did anything in A2G ground role while maintaining a omni-role capabilities unmatched. The only reason why we aren't getting sales is because of politics. No nation is ready to move on to Chinese systems. Only three countries dictate the fighter market, US, Russia and EU. Right now Russia is unable to supply and hence EU is stepping up, we must quickly get into the empty Russian which are primarily users who have no money(basically what the JF-17 is designed for).
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Yea but in BUM why didn’t the Jf17 get a single fire out ? They had the same AWACS support but j10s got six kills and jeffs got 0. Can someone answer this please ? There is a lot of talk here is that Jeff’s radar is weak but that is a non issue as j10 and Jeff radars were off anyway on May 3. The only thing I can think of is that once the roe changed that night that the Pakistani fighters had to gain rapid altitude that get max range out of pl15s so j10s put on full after burner and went up to 35k ft but Jeff could not keep up with j10s due to their underpowered engine so could not get a single launch. Again this is my hypothesis and if true then this shows that Jeff has a serious limitation in AA roles . Happy to be proven wrong if someone knows what really happened that night
 
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Yasser76 said:
Probably the most ignorant post this week., well done, you had some tough competition.
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It is closed minded people like you who are a problem for Pakistan ..too much fanboyism and can’t take any criticism. My raising legit questions on the Jeff does not make this ignorant but these are imports t questions to be asking to understand what it will take the Jeff to become a world class fighter..right now indont think it is there yet at least in AA roles but then call it for what it is ..a good bomber ..don’t parade it around with pl15s.
 
Jinn Baba said:
How many air to air kills has F22 had? Or F35? Or Rafael?

How many air to air kills did J10 have before it outnumbered kills by F22, F35, and Rafael combined in one hour?
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No wrong comparison. No one has dared put any fighter against the f22 ..so it hasn’t seen any AA combat and if it did we all know what the outcome is gong to be . Jeff has seen real AA scenarios and it failed us on both accounts
 
airhead said:
It is closed minded people like you who are a problem for Pakistan ..too much fanboyism and can’t take any criticism. My raising legit questions on the Jeff does not make this ignorant but these are imports t questions to be asking to understand what it will take the Jeff to become a world class fighter..right now indont think it is there yet at least in AA roles but then call it for what it is ..a good bomber ..don’t parade it around with pl15s.
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maybe shut up for a while?


1773498148186.png
 
airhead said:
No wrong comparison. No one has dared put any fighter against the f22 ..so it hasn’t seen any AA combat and if it did we all know what the outcome is gong to be . Jeff has seen real AA scenarios and it failed us on both accounts
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By your measurement then our F-16Cs failed too right? I am impressed about the level of ignorance you have.

@Mods? Jeet or dumb? Not sure
 
meh_analysis said:
You do realize the F-16 was export success because it was marketed as a cheap fighter? Same goes for Mig-21, Grippen and even the F-5. Same can be said for Mirage series to a extent, so idk what you're on about. SD-10 is a worse missile compared to C AMRAAM, hence why the F-16 was used as the PAF prefers guarantee quality/effectiveness instead of national prestige. Also no fighter conducted the kill, it was the AWAC's that did it. We ain't in 1900's, modern fighter combat record is primarily supported by AWAC's. Even countless F-15 kill numbers are just it shooting missiles and the AWAC guaranteeing the kill. So having kill number doesn't really matter, the A2G thing matters as no force multiplier can perform that. That's the Rafale was popular, it genuinely out did anything in A2G ground role while maintaining a omni-role capabilities unmatched. The only reason why we aren't getting sales is because of politics. No nation is ready to move on to Chinese systems. Only three countries dictate the fighter market, US, Russia and EU. Right now Russia is unable to supply and hence EU is stepping up, we must quickly get into the empty Russian which are primarily users who have no money(basically what the JF-17 is designed for).
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No cheaper wasn’t the reason that f16 was a success . Paf had the option to go for an even cheaper f20 tigershark but decided still to go with the f16 because of performance , AA and AG proven record from israel
 
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