Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Immortals]

. That is why Pakistan asked for a 2 week ceasefire so both sides can negotiate.

If the word of Pakistan PM means nothing, what is there to negotiate?

Pakistan did not mediate accurately or they did and the Pakistan PM is purposely lying to the public saying Lebanon was included in the agreement.

 

[Oscar]

Thank God we still have few members who understand the ultimate ambition of Israel. Majority looks at the whole conflict in isolation.

Always one of my favorite (albeit) fictional depictions of the issue from my perspective

 

[Blain2]

If the word of Pakistan PM means nothing, what is there to negotiate?

Pakistan did not mediate accurately or they did and the Pakistan PM is purposely lying to the public saying Lebanon was included in the agreement.

All part of the negotiations....as long as they are not shooting and claiming/counter-claiming on Social Media, that is progress.

The Pakistani PM's tweet was clear and included all. US could have had a change of heart...anything is possible.

 

[Immortals]

Pakistan negotiated with the US to stop the war and it clearly stated "all allies of the United States".

Why would U.S. listen to Pakistan? U.S. ultimately does what U.S. wants to do. Do you not remember the drone strikes inside Pakistan under Bush & Obama that killed many innocent civilians in Pakistan?

US doesn’t even listen to Russia when they have legal binding treaties.

The only country (besides Israel) that U.S. will even entertain the idea of listening to is China, because China has options to make it painful on the U.S. if they don’t listen.

Pakistan doesn’t have any leverage on US. Iran’s only leverage is the strait of Hormuz ruining the Republican Party’s polling and global economy, it has no real military leverage other than bombing bases that can be quickly repaired or bombing energy sites to create more leverage on economy.

 

[Goenitz]

For Pakistanis viewers. Great discussion.

 

[maverick]

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sad how nasty Israeli society has become

 

[Immortals]

 

[RescueRanger]

Why would U.S. listen to Pakistan? U.S. ultimately does what U.S. wants to do. Do you not remember the drone strikes inside Pakistan under Bush & Obama that killed many innocent civilians in Pakistan?

US doesn’t even listen to Russia when they have legal binding treaties.

The only country (besides Israel) that U.S. will even entertain the idea of listening to is China, because China has options to make it painful on the U.S. if they don’t listen.

Pakistan doesn’t have any leverage on US. Iran’s only leverage is the strait of Hormuz ruining the Republican Party’s polling and global economy, it has no real military leverage other than bombing bases that can be quickly repaired or bombing energy sites to create more leverage on economy.

All Pakistan has tried to do is help Iran as a brotherly Muslim country. Its a shame that instead of directing your anger and venom at Israel WHO is bombing Lebanon, you are obsessed with Pakistan.

 

[Immortals]

Iranians just talking like usual, for hours these useless government officials been yapping about revenge for Lebanon



Meanwhile:

 

[omegalamba7xl9]

That's what Pakistan knows that many don't think about... French are super possessive about Lebanon....

 

[Goenitz]

Why would U.S. listen to Pakistan? U.S. ultimately does what U.S. wants to do. Do you not remember the drone strikes inside Pakistan under Bush & Obama that killed many innocent civilians in Pakistan?

US doesn’t even listen to Russia when they have legal binding treaties.

The only country (besides Israel) that U.S. will even entertain the idea of listening to is China, because China has options to make it painful on the U.S. if they don’t listen.

Pakistan doesn’t have any leverage on US. Iran’s only leverage is the strait of Hormuz ruining the Republican Party’s polling and global economy, it has no real military leverage other than bombing bases that can be quickly repaired or bombing energy sites to create more leverage on economy.

We already know that. No one actually can mediate on behalf of the US. Pak cannot even 'oblige' Iran. Therefore, we are just a facilitator and have a neutral venue.

but we cannot negotiate/mediate as we have no equal footing, certainly we are not a 3rd party but a mere facilitator?
That is why I am advocating PM should thank, appreciate and incorporate everybody's effort, like Turkey, Egypt, Oman, etc and China if they did something.
Pak cannot do anything if israel breaks this ceasefire, heck, the US cannot do anything.

 

[Musings]

If the word of Pakistan PM means nothing, what is there to negotiate?

Pakistan did not mediate accurately or they did and the Pakistan PM is purposely lying to the public saying Lebanon was included in the agreement.

I saw the statement when it was released. No the PM didnt lie. Now just because that SOB Netanyahu wont abide and USA are finding it hard to control its mad dag - dont go on one and attempt the 1 team thats
Reaching out endlessly to end this.

 

[Master Chief]

No this is what real poltik by a colonial power looks like. They use the legality of the English language to trap their opponent. Obama did the same to Iran 10 years ago.

What is he is saying is accurate: they are not making iran give up its “right” to enrichment. They have that right….but they also have an agreement that says they won’t exercise that right.

That’s how they trick you and get you trapped in your own wants and words

You've mentioned "realpolitik" in your first sentence.

Push and pull on the terms of an initial ceasefire/truce is PRECISELY what realpolitik is.

US will try to crawl back at the behest of its silent handler in Tel Aviv. Tehran should push its levers in response, which have been demonstrated to be very powerful levers indeed.

This was all expected and factored into the calculus of your leaders, despite the apparent lack of cognisance among some folks here.

The starting point here is that US needed an off-ramp to avoid a number of risky alternatives. Iran leveraged that need in Iran's favour over the last 24 hours.

Nobody expected this to end here - it is a long battle ahead still.

 

[Immortals]

All Pakistan has tried to do is help Iran as a brotherly Muslim country. Its a shame that instead of directing your anger and venom at Israel WHO is bombing Lebanon, you are obsessed with Pakistan.

My “anger” is at users here who are washing their hands of their own PM’s explicit comments. Everyone was quick to celebrate being the mediator then now want to take no responsibility for the problems. They want only recognition of the good.

If Pakistan is going to mediate, it must be done accurately. That is all. That’s not obsession, that’s logical. Making statements that weren’t true means that next time the enemy won’t take Pakistan’s role seriously.

This is why Oman wasn’t chosen this time to mediate because they went on American news channels in February and said a good deal is there and good progress is happening and in the next 48 hours 3000 bombs were dropped on Iran. That was the second time they claimed everything was going well before US attacked.

The point here is if Pakistan cannot get the two warring sides to even accept the basic terms of ceasefire then why are Iran and U.S. even using a mediator (wether Pakistan or anyone else)?

This whole thing looks like a way for Trump to exit the conflict and walk away while the Middle East continues to burn.

 

[Master Chief]

If the word of Pakistan PM means nothing, what is there to negotiate?

Pakistan did not mediate accurately or they did and the Pakistan PM is purposely lying to the public saying Lebanon was included in the agreement.

You are ignoring the other possibilities here, most crucially, the single most likely occurrence, that Tel Aviv pulled a lever and influenced USA to back down from what was agreed before. It really is that simple.