Pakistan Missiles - Updates, News & Discussion

[Salza]

All this talk of hd-1 no one even mentioned the rws AA guns and missile laundhed mines/ mine clearing viechles / robots

Those weapons are not glamours

 

[Salza]

Hd-1s are great but im personally not that excited for them.

Ye Kuch zayeda hi hogiya since other systems are more of supportive nature ....but big bad boy is HD1 to cause noticeable damage at enemy sites.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I was making a case for PAF couple of days ago that they should now go towards an ALBM. With an air launched HD-1 hopefully in PAF hands soon, having an ALBM will be superb capability and a big headache for India as they will have to deal with subsonic and supersonic ALCM along with an ALBM.

The only issue will be the carrier for that ALBM because due to its weight and size only J-10 and Mirage can carry it if I am not mistaken. That's where JF-17 gets limited in its mission role due to its lightweight.

 

[Aziqbal]

I’ve lost track last few days it’s been non stop

Need to catch up with Pakistan ‘s missile s

 

[Samurai]

View attachment 196366

If this is indeed true then its good and will further make JF-17's useful for such kind of mission roles along with J-10's. PAF just need a potent standoff ALBM with greater range and powerful warhead besides the CM-400AKG.

 

[Toxic]

View attachment 196366

2 missiles is too impractical, A more realistic loadout

Heavy strike/Air superiority

4 PL-15s
2 PL-10s
1 HD 1 (centre pylon)
2 1200L drop tanks
1 self protection jamming pod.

 

[kimjongun]

2 missiles is too impractical, A more realistic loadout

Heavy strike/Air superiority

4 PL-15s
2 PL-10s
1 HD 1 (centre pylon)
2 1200L drop tanks
1 self protection jamming pod.

Yeah , the jeff wont even take off with that much load , Imagine if we had a more powerful engine for it...our own Wild weasel

 

[Toxic]

Yeah , the jeff wont even take off with that much load , Imagine if we had a more powerful engine for it...our own Wild weasel

TBF the Jeff can take off with two HD-1s its well within its MTOW but the drag penalty from carrying two huge missiles would be enormous not mention you would be sacrificing drop tanks

 

[Toxic]

For people wondering why the HD-1 hasn't had any export success up until recently is because the export market for land attack Supersonic missiles is absolutely tiny.

Most countries aren't in conflict with near peer adversaries with complex air defence networks where they would need a multi million dollar SS missile to penetrate them.

It essentially comes down to Algeria and Pakistan, Algeria already has the land based CM-302, so Pakistan is essentially the only one.

I think the OEM understood this and It's why they showcased the missile with the Mirage 3/5 and JF-17 platforms which only Pakistan operated at the Time and why they would have been quite willing to do a licence/TOT agreement.

 

[Ali_Baba]

For people wondering why the HD-1 hasn't had any export success up until recently is because the export market for land attack Supersonic missiles is absolutely tiny.

Most countries aren't in conflict with near peer adversaries with complex air defence networks where they would need a multi million dollar SS missile to penetrate them.

It essentially comes down to Algeria and Pakistan, Algeria already has the land based CM-302, so Pakistan is essentially the only one.

I think the OEM understood this and It's why they showcased the missile with the Mirage 3/5 and JF-17 platforms which only Pakistan operated at the Time and why they would have been quite willing to do a licence/TOT agreement.

If the missile came with full TOT(ie source code as well), then it is a damn good investment as at a minimum, it can be manufactured in Pakistan and new variants can be developed.

 

[hasssanali8998]

Yep

2 missiles is too impractical, A more realistic loadout

Heavy strike/Air superiority

4 PL-15s
2 PL-10s
1 HD 1 (centre pylon)
2 1200L drop tanks
1 self protection jamming pod.

yeah man this should be our cap loadout when Indians do randi Rona

So we can strike back immediately

 

[Princeps]

2 missiles is too impractical, A more realistic loadout

Heavy strike/Air superiority

4 PL-15s
2 PL-10s
1 HD 1 (centre pylon)
2 1200L drop tanks
1 self protection jamming pod.

How is that more practical?

If you want to carry out strikes you arm some Jeffs with 2 HD-1s, they takeoff, get to altitude, release their weapons, return to base, and now you can refuel and rearm them either for more strikes or for air-to-air missions. You have flexibility.

If they carry your loadout, they are useless for air-to-air anyways until they fire or jettison HD-1s. It's just deadweight. And for strikes you are carrying half the HD-1s which means you need twice as many aircraft. Swing-role loadouts can make sense sometimes but not most of the time.

Now an even more compelling argument against your loadout is that PAF generally would want to use Block 2s for air-to-ground missions while reserving Block 3s for air-to-air missions. Squadrons are also often specialized for one mission set even if they are technically multi-role sqds.

 

[kimjongun]

We dont have the TOT for it man , thier is no evidence for it .
Its an HD1 named Fatah3 . TOT doesnt just always allow you to make these , it requires investments too , we probably bought a big batch of them and will be in future too

 

[Toxic]

How is that more practical?

If you want to carry out strikes you arm some Jeffs with 2 HD-1s, they takeoff, get to altitude, release their weapons, return to base, and now you can refuel and rearm them either for more strikes or for air-to-air missions. You have flexibility.

If they carry your loadout, they are useless for air-to-air anyways until they fire or jettison HD-1s. It's just deadweight. And for strikes you are carrying half the HD-1s which means you need twice as many aircraft. Swing-role loadouts can make sense sometimes but not most of the time.

Now an even more compelling argument against your loadout is that PAF generally would want to use Block 2s for air-to-ground missions while reserving Block 3s for air-to-air missions. Squadrons are also often specialized for one mission set even if they are technically multi-role sqds.

The logic is that JF-17s can immediately switch to CAP after releasing their munitions rather then having the down time of RTB and Rearming

The JF-17 lacked multi mission Capability pre b3, if you wanted to carry A-A+A-G you would have to sacrifice the fuel tanks severely limiting its range, meaning the PAF couldn't have multi mission loadouts even if it wanted to

The B3 gives you that option especially now that PAF has set record straight that it wants more B3s or whatever comes after that.

Also there is a significant drag penalty from carrying 2 large missiles on the wings.

 

[Toxic]

We dont have the TOT for it man , thier is no evidence for it .
Its an HD1 named Fatah3 . TOT doesnt just always allow you to make these , it requires investments too , we probably bought a big batch of them and will be in future too

@Panzerkiel mentioned a while back that they were looking to get TOT for the HD-1 we have no reason to believe that they weren't able to get it.