Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Master Chief]

Does anyone else feel like maybe Trump wants the strait closed, so the US can renegotiate LNG contracts and also enrich himself and his family by manipulating the market?

It's not the preferred outcome but it is probably second best for Trump personally. We must conclude, on the basis of the events of several years now, that Trump is an ultra-narcissist who only cares for Trump - even his fellow Americans are expendable to him.

So, for such an individual, the best outcome of this mess would be a total victory against Iran and restoration of freedom of transit through the Strait, granting Trump full international honours and tribute from all nations. The SECOND best would be personal enrichment in the absence of those primary objectives. A perpetual stalemate along the lines of what we see presently may therefore be acceptable to Trump - why should he care if petrol at the pump is 50% higher?

 

[BHAN85]

This war brings History changing events for American empire. American world order was run by two pillars, Europe and Arab world. Europe is already taking its direction and Arabs are deciding to get security from Pakistan and getting security guarantees from China now..

Are you aware all these things were started by USA?

Have you seen Europe complaining to USA about Nordstream blast? Didn't happen and it won't never happen

It's USA who is abandoning Europe and GCC, like every declining empire.

You are saying the opposite against every evidence

 

[baqai]

Then don't make pti people your dad. You said your is dead then You definitely need one. Post definitely said so that you required one. If I have son like you, I will hang you in public. Who are cursing fellow pakistanis for your father's misdeeds.
Perhaps come back to the discussion. It is discussing Iran and American hegemony

both of you stop this ... @omegalamba7xl9 and @Cash gk

 

[Cash gk]

Are you aware all these things were started by USA?

Have you seen Europe complaining to USA about Nordstream blast? Didn't happen and it won't never happen

It's USA who is abandoning Europe and GCC, like every declining empire.

You are saying the opposite against every evidence

I disagree and I have a reason to believe The US is not abandoning Europe. Its goal is control to dominate Europe, it first needs to break the EU apart. A united Europe cannot be controlled by America, so the strategy is simple: split the bloc, then rule over smaller, weaker countries individually.

This pattern is clear. We see it in recent political pushes first with Le Pen in France, now with similar movements in Spain, Germany, and the UK. The plan is always the same: install right-wing extremist governments across Europe, funded and backed by US figures like Donald Trump and Elon Musk.

France saw this threat clearly: whoever controls France controls Europe. Last time, France resisted this takeover attempt. Now the same playbook is being used elsewhere. In the UK, the “Reform” movement is part of this push evident in the £5 million donation it received, which was deliberately hidden and lied about. European establishments are finally starting to fight back.

In Spain, the president is widely supported by the public, yet right-wing extremists backed by US money and influence from people like Mus are trying to overthrow him. In Germany, the far-right party is openly supported by both Musk and Trump, just as they backed Le Pen in France years ago.

This is not random. It is a coordinated, calculated effort: break Europe, install loyal right-wing governments, and take full control.

I predict next war war America will fight in Europe to control Europe after losing in Arab world by Iran

 

[Meengla]

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The Trump latest stunt of requiring the Abrahamic Accord as a condition for some 'deal' is already fizzling out. Pakistan officially already deflected that without annoying Trump and an MOU is almost ready to be signed.

Why wouldn't the Americans try to get out of this war? What could be achieved more other than doing some Dresden style bombing which would kill the civilians and destroy Iran? But a destroyed Iran would not be a 'victory' when the global economy tanks--yes, there are significant costs even to the Americans in that case. And speaking of Dresden style bombing of Iran: That carries a lot of risk because Iran has at least some credible air defense system to shoot down fighter jets and expensive drones.

 

[BHAN85]

It's not the preferred outcome but it is probably second best for Trump personally. We must conclude, on the basis of the events of several years now, that Trump is an ultra-narcissist who only cares for Trump - even his fellow Americans are expendable to him.

So, for such an individual, the best outcome of this mess would be a total victory against Iran and restoration of freedom of transit through the Strait, granting Trump full international honours and tribute from all nations. The SECOND best would be personal enrichment in the absence of those primary objectives. A perpetual stalemate along the lines of what we see presently may therefore be acceptable to Trump - why should he care if petrol at the pump is 50% higher?

Adult people can seriously think that biggest superpower is in the hands of a retarded man who besides is publicly blackmailed through Epstein news everyday.

And all the wall st mega bankers with endless money, accept that and they don't influence in USA foreign policy.

Yeah, it has perfectly sense...

 

[BHAN85]

I disagree and I have a reason to believe The US is not abandoning Europe. Its goal is control to dominate Europe, it first needs to break the EU apart. A united Europe cannot be controlled by America, so the strategy is simple: split the bloc, then rule over smaller, weaker countries individually.

This pattern is clear. We see it in recent political pushes first with Le Pen in France, now with similar movements in Spain, Germany, and the UK. The plan is always the same: install right-wing extremist governments across Europe, funded and backed by US figures like Donald Trump and Elon Musk.

France saw this threat clearly: whoever controls France controls Europe. Last time, France resisted this takeover attempt. Now the same playbook is being used elsewhere. In the UK, the “Reform” movement is part of this push evident in the £5 million donation it received, which was deliberately hidden and lied about. European establishments are finally starting to fight back.

In Spain, the president is widely supported by the public, yet right-wing extremists backed by US money and influence from people like Mus are trying to overthrow him. In Germany, the far-right party is openly supported by both Musk and Trump, just as they backed Le Pen in France years ago.

This is not random. It is a coordinated, calculated effort: break Europe, install loyal right-wing governments, and take full control.

I predict next war war America will fight in Europe to control Europe after losing in Arab world by Iran

Europe was conquered by USA in 1945.

European sovereignty is so ridiculous like Warsaw pact sovereignty.

Another tale of nonsense made in USA

Ukraine destabilization in 2014 was done by USA against every single European interests, economically and militarily.

Now it's peak oil time, peak raw materials time, and China ascending time.

So USA is creating troubles in vassals states, war means industry destruction, poverty, less raw materials and energy consumption.

Germany industry is already fcked by China competence, and they want to fck it even more, moving to war industry.

Money is not a problem for USA elite who take decisions.

The problem is to keep money worth, and money is worthless without energy and raw materials.

 

[Meengla]

We must conclude, on the basis of the events of several years now, that Trump is an ultra-narcissist who only cares for Trump - even his fellow Americans are expendable to him.

That is almost certainly a fact! A credible analyst even said something like 'Trump only cares for Ivanka and he may even throw Melania under the bus'.
And yet 77 million people voted for him. Some 'democracies' elect people like Trump, Modi, and Netanyahu--and multiple times. And for decades in case of Netanyahu. Yeah, to quote a famous Pakistani politician: "Democracy is the best revenge".
Democracy is not a 'panacea' and even the most educated societies are capable of electing the Trumps, the Hitlers, and the Netanyahus.

 

[Cash gk]

Are you aware all these things were started by USA?

Have you seen Europe complaining to USA about Nordstream blast? Didn't happen and it won't never happen

It's USA who is abandoning Europe and GCC, like every declining empire.

You are saying the opposite against every evidence

The US is not abandoning Europe. Its goal is control to dominate Europe, it first needs to break the EU apart. A united Europe cannot be controlled by America, so the strategy is simple: split the bloc, then rule over smaller, weaker countries individually.

This pattern is clear. We see it in recent political pushes first with Le Pen in France, now with similar movements in Spain, Germany, and the UK. The plan is always the same: install right-wing extremist governments across Europe, funded and backed by US figures like Donald Trump and Elon Musk.

France saw this threat clearly: whoever controls France controls Europe. Last time, France resisted this takeover attempt. Now the same playbook is being used elsewhere. In the UK, the “Reform” movement is part of this push evident in the £5 million donation it received, which was deliberately hidden and lied about. European establishments are finally starting to fight back.

In Spain, the president is widely supported by the public, yet right-wing extremists backed by US money and influence from people like Mus are trying to overthrow him. In Germany, the far-right party is openly supported by both Musk and Trump, just as they backed Le Pen in France years ago.

This is not random. It is a coordinated, calculated effort: break Europe, install loyal right-wing governments, and take full control.

My father and his father's is Ali ibne abu Talib... I am son of HAIDER and Haider is the role model not some khan who happens to be father to ILLEGITIMATE children...
We are the seekers of Nishan e HAIDER not some second grade seat to some nobody characterless man and his good books.

So when you sending me your DNA report please

 

[Master Chief]

Adult people can seriously think that biggest superpower is in the hands of a retarded man who besides is publicly blackmailed through Epstein news everyday.

And all the wall st mega bankers with endless money, accept that and they don't influence in USA foreign policy.

Yeah, it has perfectly sense...

Of course Trump answers to certain masters. The point I was making was with regards to Trump's personality and what options might work best for him, not taking into account the crucial external modifier called Israel.

 

[Master Chief]

On the matter of a perpetual stalemate/ low intensity conflict, George Orwell stated in 1984:

"The war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous. Hierarchical society is only possible on the basis of poverty and ignorance."

Maintaining the current status quo offers Trump an advantage in perpetual market manipulation. It offers Tel Aviv the cover they need to keep slaughtering and expanding. Even Iran benefits if Iran is able to extract financial rewards at Hormuz. All three parties also experience a number of disadvantages though from this situation persisting. It is certainly Israel's unchecked behaviour and barbarism that is the biggest problem to the region and to the world, whatever our interpretation of the events at Hormuz may be.

 

[Meengla]

Of course Trump answers to certain masters. The point I was making was with regards to Trump's personality and what options might work best for him, not taking into account the crucial external modifier called Israel.

I am sure, the historians are going to pass the verdict that it was Trump's very personality of extreme Narcissism, of his family Jewish connections, along with his racism, along with his very old age and couldn't-care-less-about-the world attitude, along with his knowledge that he couldn't be touched by the consequences of actions, along with the desire to be 'memorable' in history are the major factors leading to this war. I am not mentioning the Epstein Files connection because I have not seen any convincing evidence of that yet.

But, from a personality profile, I believe this is Trump's personal war almost certain to cost America's very empire and waged on behalf of a foreign power. And yet 77 million people elected this guy! 77 million people elected a guy who hires and fires as he pleases and wages wars which kill thousands. 77 million people elected a guy who is putting great strain on American lives.

Democracy is indeed the best revenge!

 

[BananaRepublic]

That is almost certainly a fact! A credible analyst even said something like 'Trump only cares for Ivanka and he may even throw Melania under the bus'.
And yet 77 million people voted for him. Some 'democracies' elect people like Trump, Modi, and Netanyahu--and multiple times. And for decades in case of Netanyahu. Yeah, to quote a famous Pakistani politician: "Democracy is the best revenge".
Democracy is not a 'panacea' and even the most educated societies are capable of electing the Trumps, the Hitlers, and the Netanyahus.

Democracy only works in homogenous, prosperous and educated societies.

In a multi ethnic state - it is a lethal system that accentuates sectarian divides - as voters inevitably vote along sectarian lines.

In an illiterate and poor society - democracy becomes a tool to exploit the gullible. Because the illiterates do not respect plurality of thoughts and ideas.

Iran has the best system given its ethnic makeup.

China has the best system given its Confucian culture that is rooted in meritocracy. One thing democracy is not - is meritocratic.

A Trump like figure would never rise to the top in China.

 

[hasssanali8998]

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nope already rejected it and trump didnt mention us again by name

 

[Ali_Baba]

Donald Trump shares draft Iran peace agreement with Israel and other allies​

Donald Trump shares draft Iran peace agreement with Israel and other allies

US president’s move comes as both sides try to prevent fresh ceasefire breaches scuppering a potential deal

www.theguardian.com

The draft is less specific than Tehran’s version about lifting sanctions on Iran’s oil and petrochemical exports. It also asserts toll-free navigation in the strait of Hormuz.