Pakistan's New Provinces Plan ?

[Michael]

...... Karachi MUST become a new province, separate from Sindh.

This is Pakistan's internal affair; the Chinese have no say.

Let me share a wise strategy for regional division in China:

Any highly developed region that wants to elevate its administrative status must be assigned a very large and impoverished area to manage, forcibly lowering its economic capacity. ------ Otherwise, unrest will inevitably occur in that region, ultimately leading to secession.

Shanghai. Its original jurisdiction was actually quite small.
Shenzhen. Its original special economic zone area was less than half its current size.
Chongqing. Previously a prefecture-level city under Sichuan Province. In 1997, it separated from Sichuan and became a municipality directly under the central government. Sichuan Province assigned its three poorest areas—Fuling, Qianjiang, and Wanxian—to Chongqing.

I don't know if you understand this philosophy.

 

[SaltFlats]

I don't know if you understand this philosophy.

I don't know if it's your translation software or what, but you often come off as condescending on the rare occasion when you aren't posting AI slop.

 

[Watandar]

This is Pakistan's internal affair; the Chinese have no say.

Let me share a wise strategy for regional division in China:

Any highly developed region that wants to elevate its administrative status must be assigned a very large and impoverished area to manage, forcibly lowering its economic capacity. ------ Otherwise, unrest will inevitably occur in that region, ultimately leading to secession.

Shanghai. Its original jurisdiction was actually quite small.
Shenzhen. Its original special economic zone area was less than half its current size.
Chongqing. Previously a prefecture-level city under Sichuan Province. In 1997, it separated from Sichuan and became a municipality directly under the central government. Sichuan Province assigned its three poorest areas—Fuling, Qianjiang, and Wanxian—to Chongqing.

I don't know if you understand this philosophy.

I do but this is the difference between current Pakistani system/culture and the Chinese one. Pakistani system does not care AT ALL about the poor and destitute.

 

[Michael]

I do but this is the difference between current Pakistani system/culture and the Chinese one. Pakistani system does not care AT ALL about the poor and destitute.

It is precisely for the reasons you mentioned that Karachi cannot be an independent provincial administrative unit. If Pakistan were to forcibly secede from Karachi, it would further exacerbate the wealth gap between Karachi and its surrounding regions, leading to an escalation of conflict. These escalated frictions and conflicts would severely hinder Karachi's further development.

 

[ACE OF HEARTS]

Karachi is happy to support the poorer areas / divisions / districts around it but the current problem is that the rulers of karachi don't belong from the the city itself but rather come from rural agricultural communities upto 700 km from Karachi city.

Karachi by design is not being ruled buy its highly educated citizens but by feudals agriculturalists who see this city as golden goose extracting or rather lynching / corruption as much money from it as possible slowing turning it into rural village from where it's current rulers actually come from.....thanks to democracy ofcourse.

Imagine the education minister and the minister who manages higher education in the whole province of sindh including Karachi city is only qualified as graduate of arts as his highest degree.

Now what can you expect such a highly educated minister for education to guide and create opportunities for students in Science / STEM subjects ?

Imagine Karachi 's true population being undercounted so that it's doesn't get more representation at the national level. Such is the hatred towards karachi city ..... that is why there is more and more desire to break from the shakles of feudals.

There are fundamental flaws that by design is hindering the growth of the highly industrialised and the only true coastal city of Pakistan.....thanks to democracy.

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[Watandar]

It is precisely for the reasons you mentioned that Karachi cannot be an independent provincial administrative unit. If Pakistan were to forcibly secede from Karachi, it would further exacerbate the wealth gap between Karachi and its surrounding regions, leading to an escalation of conflict. These escalated frictions and conflicts would severely hinder Karachi's further development.

Uhhh no sir. Karachi as it's own province will allow the city to breathe and focus on business and exports, similar to Chinese coastal cities. Karachi has been ruined by army political engineering in connivance with feudal politicians from upper Sindh since the 1970s.

 

[Asif]

Like which one ?

I am in favor of splitting all "big" provinces. Unfortunately KPK is not big. It's just 13% of Pakistan's landmass that too after inclusion of FATA.

A Baluchistan split into 3 , each will still be equal to current KPK in landmass.

Sindh split into 2, each will still be equal to KPK in landmass.

Punjab split into 2, again. Same situation.

You are not splitting provinces for the sake of it, you are splitting them to make them more manageable.


So if I say split all these provinces except KPK, there is a logical reason behind it. Not my anti-punjabi sentiments.

Both PPP and ANP are pro punjab division, in one form or the other but against division of their provinces of dominance.
Secondly,
You cant divide provinves based upon area only. Balochistan is almost 50% of pakistan's mass but have less than 10% of the population. You cant divide into more than 3 provinces. If you have travelled Balochistan you will see that you can travel for an hr without seeing a small city or even a proper town. Same is the story with sindh districts in south and bordering Balochistan which are sparsely populated. in short, area only is not the answer, u need to consider population and other parameters as well.

 

[RealNapster]

Both PPP and ANP are pro punjab division, in one form or the other but against division of their provinces of dominance.

By giving the example of ANP, I got the idea that your source of information lives in 2010. But still, I would like to ask for some source, reference, some statement from ANP asking for punjab division.

By the way I am not even ANP supporter, but your statmeent seems ridiculous. So just want to confirm.

And regarding PPP, no it's not pro-punjab-split becaise it knows that this will open door for sindh split as well. They are just in favor of south punjab if punjab people and provincial assembly approves it. PPP (even though it would like to) cant resist south punjab formation because PPP have a bit of hold in that area. So it's not like PPP want punjab to be splitter, it's just that it dont mind it.

 

[RealNapster]

You cant divide provinves based upon area only. Balochistan is almost 50% of pakistan's mass but have less than 10% of the population. You cant divide into more than 3 provinces. If you have travelled Balochistan you will see that you can travel for an hr without seeing a small city or even a proper town. Same is the story with sindh districts in south and bordering Balochistan which are sparsely populated. in short, area only is not the answer, u need to consider population and other parameters as well.

So ? Its not about population at all. Its about land. Because governments need to secure land ... a secured land bring control. Can a provincial government setting 800 km away in quetta control these towns that are 2-3 hours away from each other's? No. That's why you need close-by control centres I.e provincial machineries.

 

[Asif]

So ? Its not about population at all. Its about land. Because governments need to secure land ... a secured land bring control. Can a provincial government setting 800 km away in quetta control these towns that are 2-3 hours away from each other's? No. That's why you need close-by control centres I.e provincial machineries.

Who are you going to control in Balochistan. a few hundred thousand people in a new provinve? How will it generate revenue, and survive. who will it uplift?
it needs to be reasonable and workable solution and in case of balochistan, area is not the solution.

 

[Asif]

By giving the example of ANP, I got the idea that your source of information lives in 2010. But still, I would like to ask for some source, reference, some statement from ANP asking for punjab division.

By the way I am not even ANP supporter, but your statmeent seems ridiculous. So just want to confirm.

And regarding PPP, no it's not pro-punjab-split becaise it knows that this will open door for sindh split as well. They are just in favor of south punjab if punjab people and provincial assembly approves it. PPP (even though it would like to) cant resist south punjab formation because PPP have a bit of hold in that area. So it's not like PPP want punjab to be splitter, it's just that it dont mind it.

Here are a few sources for PPP leaders. I will just give sources for zardari or bilawal and not any other leader. All sources are from different years, meaning not a one time statement.

Just don't assume something because it looks probable to you. It's always better to do some search in advance.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1807235

https://tribune.com.pk/story/2581423/bilawal-supports-new-provinces-but-with-a-caveat

https://www.brecorder.com/news/amp/4653339

https://dunyanews.tv/en/Pakistan/162667-zardari-vows-to-create-south-punjab-province

Now do some search yourself and see how Bilawal and Asif Zardari, on various pretexts, have always deflected questions on the division of sindh provinve.

 

[I*R*A]

KPK needs to be divided into two. First and foremost. The ones who oppose this, were happy naming it Pukhtoon ka khawa and keep electing Cms who call themselves Cms of Pushtoons and threaten civil servants with division of Pakistan. They fear loss of Tarbela and strategic locations.

Punjab should be divided into three, Punjab has long played key role in forming government in center. It has even failed to produce quality competent political leaders, this division will help with better control on corruption, disrupt dynastic politics and better fair funds / wealth distribution.

Sindh needs to be divided into three for same reasons as above plus to get rid of Kachay kay and zardari daku.

Balochistan, I am not sure. Needs development on steroids.

 

[RealNapster]

Who are you going to control in Balochistan. a few hundred thousand people in a new provinve? How will it generate revenue, and survive. who will it uplift?
it needs to be reasonable and workable solution and in case of balochistan, area is not the solution.

Oh. Okay. So just leave it then. In our areas some land that isn't owned by someone or is is usually non-cultivated is called shamilaat.

Just call the reminder of baluchistan as shamilat and leave it for people like BLA, RAW etc to pick.

 

[RealNapster]

Here are a few sources for PPP leaders. I will just give sources for zardari or bilawal and not any other leader. All sources are from different years, meaning not a one time statement.

Just don't assume something because it looks probable to you. It's always better to do some search in advance.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1807235

https://tribune.com.pk/story/2581423/bilawal-supports-new-provinces-but-with-a-caveat

https://www.brecorder.com/news/amp/4653339

https://dunyanews.tv/en/Pakistan/162667-zardari-vows-to-create-south-punjab-province

Now do some search yourself and see how Bilawal and Asif Zardari, on various pretexts, have always deflected questions on the division of sindh provinve.

These are all as Nawaz sharif said "siyaasi bayaan". Because no one created it. One of the source you gave is from 2013 when zardari had actual powers. Its 2026 now. Is south ounjab reality ?

Even PTI won from south punjab based on the "naara" but didn't delivered south punjab. Zardari, Bilawal, PTI, etc... all of them give these statements because everyone knows south punjan vote is the way to win punjab and if you win punjab you have Pakistan.


The dilemma of PPP, i already explained to you in my previous post that they want it but they also dont want it.

BTW i see none of the sources are from ANP. Khair...

 

[mythbuster]

No matter how many provinces are carved out from Pakistan, as long as local bodies stay dead and ineffective, all those provinces will become personal fiefdoms of elites. And the circle will continue. Power needs to be devolved a bit to the grassroots for better services delivery along with constitutional guarantees and fiscal guarantees.

Exactly ...GB and AJK are , for all practical purposes, small provinces... they ain't showing any glimmer of hope.