Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Oldenwisdom...قول بزرگ]

"But Pickering is more focused on China than Iran. That's because China emerged as the so-called swing importer, cutting its world-leading oil imports by roughly 5 million barrels a day and leaning on its oil and fuel strategic reserves that also lead the world..."

Trump’s time is running out to avoid a nightmare Strait of Hormuz scenario | Fortune

Global oil flows remain stunted as stockpiles are depleted, and demand is set to rise again.

fortune.com

This should be a wake up call to Pakistani users who think China would ever challenge the U.S. under Xi. When Trump visited China this year in the midst of the war with Iran, “magically” Chinese oil imports dropped due to “economic reasons” to help the Western AND INDIA AND JAPAN cope with the energy crisis.

What did Trump offer Xi to get him to do that?

China helping it own enemies that will one day choke off China energy needs without a second thought if it means helping collapsing China.

Now China is starting to increase imports again. But it should not be lost on people how easily and quickly Xi helped America/Europe/India/Japan. This level of appeasement is embarrassing and was a hallmark of Putin relations with Europe/America from 2000-2020. And in the end what did Russia get out of it? Xi is making the same critical errors that Putin did.

Western appeasement never ends well.

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Your analysis doesn't help though...

China backed the ceasefire... pushed Pakistan and alleviated the global pressure by using their own reserves...

For China to resume buying now means that cushion is lost at the worst possible time for orange... he has not only no alternative... he burnt through the US reserves simultaneously. That when Russians themselves are feeling the pinch because their refining capacity has taken a devastating hit. They're importing fuel...

Putin played it badly... he allowed Ukraine to stabilize and establish their niche... his task is harder as EU goes on offensive. However, Russian front has greatly helped Iran in other ways... such as the depletion of critical munitions and interceptors that keep getting chewed up in that war. The US itself needs the sour crude as the winter approaches for heating oil consumers. It means a whole lot of oil is going off market while the reserves are heading to the bottom.
Orange overplayed his ego...

 

[OldTwilight]

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We should finish Kuwait first

 

[Meengla]

This is an old habit. I remember people watching the Iran Iraq war from Saudi and Kuwaiti ports, enjoying the sight of heavy night fire and missile exchanges. These GCC nations financed Iraq for eight years, thinking they would remain safe while the US attacked Iran. However, Iran completely rewrote its war strategy, making its defensive posture bluntly clear. These GCC countries should know how it feels when war knock on your door.

The GCC Arab behavior was Ostrich's behavior. And a part of me can understand their geopolitics: They were part of the Pax Americana which yielded great generational wealth. Which rich man would ever want to disrupt the apple cart? Those countries thought to continue the gravy train of great wealth as being part of Pax Americana but they forgot they are in the Middle East: A region charged with religious zealotry spanning multiple continents and with historic grudges--and with immense easily accessible wealth to boot! But I am sure they had known that Israeli presence was a danger to them but they couldn't do anything about it in face of a Superpower's financial and military muscle.
And so the Petro Dollar continued, which also lifted hundreds of millions across the globe out of poverty. Until the 1979 Iranian Revolution came, which must be seen by History as a significant event like the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia.
In short, the Middle East is a unique combination--a toxic one-- of human irrationality and human greed. I wished Pakistan was geographically far from it but, alas, Pakistan is not.

 

[Shags101]

Iran is using Kuwait as ‘an example’ of what it can do in retaliation​

Within Iran, there is “a gradual lack of feeling that any kind of restraint is going to be beneficial to negotiations”, Roxane Farmanfarmian, a professor of Middle East politics at the University of Cambridge, tells Al Jazeera.

“I think we’re seeing from the op-eds that we’re reading in Iran’s newspapers and media, that there is a hardening generally in feeling that Iran needs to hit hard, to sustain and show endurance, but also to affect American ability to maintain too much of a time on this war.

“I think what we’re seeing is that they’re using Kuwait, in particular, as an example of what they can do in retaliation.

“The US is clearly hitting the south in Iran and hitting airports, desalination plants and bridges, and so the same kinds of things are being hit now in Kuwait to show what kind of effect Iran really can have on those countries that are hosting American bases.”

 

[HAIDER]

The GCC Arab behavior was Ostrich's behavior. And a part of me can understand their geopolitics: They were part of the Pax Americana which yielded great generational wealth. Which rich man would ever want to disrupt the apple cart? Those countries thought to continue the gravy train of great wealth as being part of Pax Americana but they forgot they are in the Middle East: A region charged with religious zealotry spanning multiple continents and with historic grudges--and with immense easily accessible wealth to boot! But I am sure they had known that Israeli presence was a danger to them but they couldn't do anything about it in face of a Superpower's financial and military muscle.
And so the Petro Dollar continued, which also lifted hundreds of millions across the globe out of poverty. Until the 1979 Iranian Revolution came, which must be seen by History as a significant event like the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia.
In short, the Middle East is a unique combination--a toxic one-- of human irrationality and human greed. I wished Pakistan was geographically far from it but, alas, Pakistan is not.

This region will be more hot in coming years, due to scarcity of natural resources and modern technology demands. Check the history when British tried to took over Iran oil refineries and forced them to write a dirty one sided agreement in totally British favor....that's when the Iran revolution started ....

 

[Ali_Baba]

Iran is using Kuwait as ‘an example’ of what it can do in retaliation​

Within Iran, there is “a gradual lack of feeling that any kind of restraint is going to be beneficial to negotiations”, Roxane Farmanfarmian, a professor of Middle East politics at the University of Cambridge, tells Al Jazeera.

“I think we’re seeing from the op-eds that we’re reading in Iran’s newspapers and media, that there is a hardening generally in feeling that Iran needs to hit hard, to sustain and show endurance, but also to affect American ability to maintain too much of a time on this war.

“I think what we’re seeing is that they’re using Kuwait, in particular, as an example of what they can do in retaliation.

“The US is clearly hitting the south in Iran and hitting airports, desalination plants and bridges, and so the same kinds of things are being hit now in Kuwait to show what kind of effect Iran really can have on those countries that are hosting American bases.”

Kuwait is a hall pass - a freebie to tell the rest of the Arab states of what is in store for them. I do think Iran should go all out and take out 50% of their electrical and water infrastructure. Not enough to cause life sustainment issues, but enough to cause long term bother to the people of the country on their luxury lifestyles and a lesson on the consequences of the actions of their leaders. Something that will niggle for months, while repairs are done.

 

[lightning f57]

I think i understand the GCC mindset, they always saw the revolution in Iran problematic and as a threat to their leaders. So for that reason they have mostly supported against Iran and allowed so many western bases on the soil.

The SOH issue has now amplified the problem for them, they dont want Iran to control the straits or to enforce tolls. So for this they continue to support the US thinking the US will eventually win tje struggle.

They are hedging their bets on country which is many thousands of miles away and wants to pivot east to China. Their weaknesses and ability to defend their selves has been exposed.

Now they seek other local alliances (UAE with India, Qatar, Kuwait looking at Pak) to hedge against a US withdrawal from the region yet the best policy would be sign a 50 year non agression pact with Iran and don't let your airspace or land be used by foreign nations to attack Iran or spy on Iran.

 

[Kyussis]

Once the war is over the following countries will be sued in ICC for assisting with illegal military action against Iran

• Saudi Arabia
• Kuwait
• Bahrain
• Qatar
• UAE
• Oman
• Turkey (if proven U.S. bases contributed to war effort)
• Israel

Given this war had zero UN authorization for military action and was illegal by nature, it’s a fairly open and shut case by the court to award Iran substantial damages.

The number could exceed $1 Trillion dollars if this war continues. Trump knows that the Arabs will ultimately have to foot a large bill.

The beauty about this is that this court case can be brought year and decades later. History never forgets and the Arabs won’t be able to absolve themselves of their role in this war.

The U.S and its vassels will abolish the International Criminal Court if that was ever to happen. The ICC is a weapon used against the global south countries resisting Western imperialism.

 

[tsunset]

The Hillbilly Cowboy confederation will probably escalate tonight

 

[Flotilla]

"But Pickering is more focused on China than Iran. That's because China emerged as the so-called swing importer, cutting its world-leading oil imports by roughly 5 million barrels a day and leaning on its oil and fuel strategic reserves that also lead the world..."

Trump’s time is running out to avoid a nightmare Strait of Hormuz scenario | Fortune

Global oil flows remain stunted as stockpiles are depleted, and demand is set to rise again.

fortune.com

This should be a wake up call to Pakistani users who think China would ever challenge the U.S. under Xi. When Trump visited China this year in the midst of the war with Iran, “magically” Chinese oil imports dropped due to “economic reasons” to help the Western AND INDIA AND JAPAN cope with the energy crisis.

What did Trump offer Xi to get him to do that?

China helping it own enemies that will one day choke off China energy needs without a second thought if it means helping collapsing China.

Now China is starting to increase imports again. But it should not be lost on people how easily and quickly Xi helped America/Europe/India/Japan. This level of appeasement is embarrassing and was a hallmark of Putin relations with Europe/America from 2000-2020. And in the end what did Russia get out of it? Xi is making the same critical errors that Putin did.

Western appeasement never ends well.

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That argument doesn't hold water. China might temporarily stop buying oil due to economic exigencies—likely to avert a global crash—but what is certain is that if it abandons its allies (such as Russia, Iran, North Korea, or even Pakistan), Western militaries would all set their sights on Beijing. Pakistan represents a perfect second front against India, while Iran is a target for the United States in the Middle East. Anything else is mere speculation, calculated to breed apathy and undermine Iran's morale.

 

[lightning f57]

The Hillbilly Cowboy confederation will probably escalate tonight

You mean the epstein coalition

 

[Immortals]

Your analysis doesn't help though...

China backed the ceasefire... pushed Pakistan and alleviated the global pressure but using their own reserves...

Why did China use their reserves only do this AFTER Trump visited? Because they run a two face foreign policy just like Putin did for decades where they throw “weaker” countries under the bus to make the West like them.

Let me ask you a simple question, if the role was reversed and China was facing an energy crisis, do you think Europe/India/Japan/Australia/US would tap their oil reserves and STOP importing oil to help China?

Of course not. They would be giddy with relief at a chance to DESTROY the Chinese economy. Xi has and always will be a Western appeaser.

For China to resume buying now means that cushion is lost at the worst possible time for orange...

This could have happened much earlier if China kept buying oil like normal. Instead China directly emboldened Trump by giving him the breathing room and delusions needed to think he didn’t need the MOU or to abide it.

No Xi has realized he is directly harming China by running down its reserves for no good reason in the face of a possible energy crisis.

Putin played it badly... he allowed Ukraine to stabilize and establish their niche... his task is harder and EU is going on offensive.

Back at the old forum (Pakistan defense forum) around 2013-2015 I told people there Putin’s appeasement policy and backstabbing Arab and Iran (Iraq, Libya, Syria) would come back to haunt him.

He laughed with Bush and called Iranians crazy. He didn’t do anything when Obama placed interceptors in Poland under the absurd pretext of “Iranian missile threat to Europe” and then he fell for that dyke Merkel’s tricks when he signed the Minsk accords instead of finishing off Ukraine when he had the chance over a decade ago.

APPEASEMENT WITH THE WEST NEVER WORKS!

 

[FUB]

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[PaklovesTurkiye]

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MBS turned out to be a coward. He is literally seeing Americans deliberately targeting water/civilian infra in Iran and also knows what Iranians will do in retaliation yet he is hiding in his hole and not threatning to dump USD/PetroDollar.

Trump has done serious bullying on him. He is nowhere to be seen while whole region is on fire. What a coward...

Millions of people are at stake without water....

Pakistan needs to bring nuclear threat/heat on Israel - right on Egyptian border.

This whole war is imposed on Gulf region just because it didn't sign Abraham Accords. On top of it - Saudis signed defence pact with Pakistan

Americans/Jews are punishing MBS/Saudis.

Bastards always wanted 'normalization' with Saudis.

 

[Shags101]

Kuwait is a hall pass - a freebie to tell the rest of the Arab states of what is in store for them. I do think Iran should go all out and take out 50% of their electrical and water infrastructure. Not enough to cause life sustainment issues, but enough to cause long term bother to the people of the country on their luxury lifestyles and a lesson on the consequences of the actions of their leaders. Something that will niggle for months, while repairs are done.

Honestly takeout a few of those skyscrapers in the UAE or how about Saudi Arabia’s LINE project probably doing them a favor if the project is highly insured