Tang dynasty battles with the caliphate

[Indos]

Completely wrong. Turkic Sultans were allying with Hindus, alot of Hindus being top generals and administrators. Point being, it wasn't Muslim vs Hindu.

Also, mass conversions to Islam happened via Sufi orders, not swords.

It is so logic that many Hindus in South Asia and also South East Asia become Muslim, since there is equality in Islam. And also during that period, it is basically Muslim and China rule the world, so it is very much easier for people to prefer Islam.

Only those South East Asians that dont become part of trading route between Middle East and China, and also Muslim Mugal of South Asian with China that stick with Hindus/Buddist - Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, Myanmar etc

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

So did the Han, Jin and Tang dynasties dug their groves by importing large number of Hu(胡人) into China that led to devastating rebellions later that destroyed the dynasties.

Many Xiongnu/Khitans/Jurgens seem to be completely assimilated into the Han Chinese culture and gene pool.

About 30% of the Northern Chinese mtDNA derived from these steppe groups.

Meanwhile, only the Manchus seem to persist and refuse to truly integrate.

 

[_Arabia_]

If it weren't for the Turks, the Crusaders and Mongols would have come crush your Arabs, what kind of fairy tales are you telling ?

When the Turks entered Anatolia en masse in the 11th century (after the Battle of Malazgirt in 1071), there was almost no Muslim population in the Anatolia

Before the arrival of the Turks, Anatolia was entirely under the rule of the Christian Byzantine Empire

The Turks also Islamized the Balkans

The Crusaders never managed that (despite all of Europe uniting in this endeavor) and their presence covered less than 2% of the total Arab landmass.

Mongols barely destroyed/killed any Arabs outside of Baghdad.

Most of the people they killed were Central Asian Turks, Persians and East Asians.

Destruction under the Mongol Empire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I already wrote that the only region of the Muslim world that was not made Muslim by Arabs was West Balkans but that is a tiny region of the Muslim world and today only encompasses half of Bosnia (1.5 million people) and some 2-3 million Albanians.

Islam in Greece was spread by Arabs first (Emirate of Crete) and other regions of Greece.

Emirate of Crete - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And it is completely nonsense to claim that there were no Muslims in Anatolia before Seljuks? Did you forget 400 years of mostly Arab Muslim rule of South and East Anatolia?

Even many Turkish cities in South and East Anatolia are of Arab origin.

Diyarbakir (Turkish Kurdish capital of Anatolia) derives from an ancient Arab tribe (Banu Bakr) that settled the region.

Diyarbakır - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Why do you think that were many Muslim scholars and scientists (most Arab in origin) born in Anatolia before the Seljuks?

Don't confuse West Anatolia (Byzantine heartland) with South and East Anatolia. Very different histories. Even to this day the regions are quite distinct.

One is literally next door to the Arab world (Syria and Iraq) (South and East Anatolia) home to ancient Arab communities and the other region (West Anatolia) is next to Greece and Bulgaria.

All of Anatolia first became majority Muslim 1-2 centuries after Ottoman consolidation (some 500 years ago or so).

Similar to Pakistan itself, Sindh was Muslim long before the North became Muslim. To this day you still have some Pagans in North Pakistan due to geographic isolation.

 

[MMM-E]

If the Turks had not stopped the Chinese at the Battle of Talas, the Chinese armies would have had a completely open path, and one of the first strategic regions they would have targeted would certainly have been the Indian subcontinent (India/Pakistan region)

In this vast geographical area, Chinese culture and beliefs (Buddhism, Confucianism) would definitely dominate central Asia and the Indian subcontinent


Islam would not have spread so much.

 

[SteppeWolff]

If the Turks had not stopped the Chinese at the Battle of Talas, the Chinese armies would have had a completely open path, and one of the first strategic regions they would have targeted would certainly have been the Indian subcontinent (India/Pakistan region)

In this vast geographical area, Chinese culture and beliefs (Buddhism, Confucianism) would definitely dominate central Asia and the Indian subcontinent


Islam would not have spread so much.

Turks were honoured to be the sword of Islam by Allah, that doesn't mean if there weren't any turks, there wouldn't have been spread of Islam. Your reading on history is quite shallow. I say that as an Uzbek myself ( Uzbeks are Karluks of old )

 

[_Arabia_]

If the Turks had not stopped the Chinese at the Battle of Talas, the Chinese armies would have had a completely open path, and one of the first strategic regions they would have targeted would certainly have been the Indian subcontinent (India/Pakistan region)

In this vast geographical area, Chinese culture and beliefs (Buddhism, Confucianism) would definitely dominate central Asia and the Indian subcontinent


Islam would not have spread so much.

Most of the soldiers of the Abbasid Caliphate (almost 100.000 soldiers by most accounts) were Arab in origin with a small minority of Persians and allied Tibetans (Battle of Talas).

Karluks (very little connection to modern-day Turks and Anatolians) in the battle were estimated to be around 10.000-20.000 in size.

So quite absurd to claim it as some Turkic victory.

 

[Indos]

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[MMM-E]

After the 8th century , the unified Arab Caliphate began to lose political control and military dominance over its vast Empire

Rise of Non-Arab Powers: The TURKS by the 9th and 10th centuries until WW1

From the 9th century onward, Arabs lost their military dominance and the leadership of the Islamic world shifted entirely to the Turks for nearly a millennium

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The Crusaders and Mongols were stopped by the Turks ( Oghuz and Kypcak )


The Crusaders from the West and the Mongols from the East created a deadly pincer movement that threatened to wipe out the Muslim world. It was various Turkish Dynasties that stepped up as the ultimate shield to stop both invasions

 

[ety]

Many Xiongnu/Khitans/Jurgens seem to be completely assimilated into the Han Chinese culture and gene pool.

About 30% of the Northern Chinese mtDNA derived from these steppe groups.

Meanwhile, only the Manchus seem to persist and refuse to truly integrate.

They still have arrogance to hold on to their pride as their ancestors founded and ruled one of the big dynasties in China only little more than 100 years ago. They are not happy they lost the privileges in China not long ago. The rest Hu people never had such glories in their history.

 

[_Arabia_]

Because both society hold the harmonious conservative values which not being aligned with the western liberal values.

Don't get me wrong, the western conservatives are also a sect of the western liberals but with different manifesto.

As someone who does not speak fluent Mandarin (my Mandarin is very elementary) and who is no expert on Chinese history (I would claim that I have a rather good grasp but far from an expert - just the fact that I cannot read or speak Mandarin fluently is enough) so it is quite interesting to hear/learn from an actual Chinese (Han) person who speaks fluent Arabic and Mandarin and who was born in China and grew up there and lived in KSA for many years (speaks fluent Arabic too) tell about the many similarities.

In other words - she is talking from a position of knowledge and direct personal experience.

I don't think that many Arabs or Chinese are even aware of the many commonalities that she mentions and talks about.

I have also noticed that Arabs in general have a good grasp of Mandarin and similarly Chinese a good grasp of Arabic.

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[MMM-E]

Most of the soldiers of the Abbasid Caliphate (almost 100.000 soldiers by most accounts) were Arab in origin with a small minority of Persians and allied Tibetans (Battle of Talas).

Karluks (very little connection to modern-day Turks and Anatolians) in the battle were estimated to be around 10.000-20.000 in size.

So quite absurd to claim it as some Turkic victory.

20.000 great warrior Turks = 200.000 Arabs

Chinese lost the battle of Talas , because the Turks entered the battle on the side of the Caliphate

Turkish war techniques were dominant in Asia
Even 80% of Genghis Khan's Army consisted of Turkic warriors, and the same tradition was observed in the Mongol-Turkic war effort

only one example
Turkic origin BAIBARS KHAN led the vanguard of the Turkic MAMLUK Forces ( Egypt ) at the Battle of Ain Jalut in 1260 which marked the first substantial defeat of the Mongol army and is considered a turning point in history

Not Arabs but Turks defeated the Mongols

BAIBARS KHAN was also Commander of the Turkic MAMLUK forces that inflicted a defeat on the 7th Crusade of King Louis IX of France

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

They still have arrogance to hold on to their pride as their ancestors founded and ruled one of the big dynasties in China only little more than 100 years ago. They are not happy they lost the privileges in China not long ago. The rest Hu people never had such glories in their history.

Because of their incompetence and treated the Han people worse than their slaves, China was impoverished more than 200 years ago.

They also let white men in charge of China's technology department which ended having the ancient Chinese technologies being stolen by those white missionaries with its origin being distorted into western invention.

Qintianjian - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Qing Dynasty was utterly a disgrace in the Chinese history, and Mao's cultural revolution should apply to these ungrateful abominable people.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

As someone who does not speak fluent Mandarin (my Mandarin is very elementary) and who is no expert on Chinese history (I would claim that I have a rather good grasp but far from an expert - just the fact that I cannot read or speak Mandarin fluently is enough) so it is quite interesting to hear/learn from an actual Chinese (Han) person who speaks fluent Arabic and Mandarin and who was born in China and grew up there and lived in KSA for many years (speaks fluent Arabic too) tell about the many similarities.

In other words - she is talking from a position of knowledge and direct personal experience.

I don't think that many Arabs or Chinese are even aware of the many commonalities that she mentions and talks about.

I have also noticed that Arabs in general have a good grasp of Mandarin and similarly Chinese a good grasp of Arabic.

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It seems that Arabic is also a grammatically conservative language like Latin, whereas the Mandarin is more grammatically simplified in comparison.

 

[ety]

Because of their incompetence and treated the Han people worse than their slaves, China was impoverished more than 200 years ago.

They also let white men in charge of China's technology department which ended having the ancient Chinese technologies being stolen by those white missionaries with its origin being distorted into western invention.

Qintianjian - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Qing Dynasty was utterly a disgrace in the Chinese history, and Mao's cultural revolution should apply to these ungrateful abominable people.

Yeah, the Manchus especially the ruling class feared Han Chinese more than the white Europeans as evidenced in the historical documents of what were spoken on the subject by the Qing Empress Dowager Cixi that was chiefly responsible for all the humiliating decisions of the late Qing court. The Manchus ruling class could care less if the white Europeans establish a strong hold in China. The Manchu emperor actually told Han Chinese to eat 2 meals a day instead of 3, saying they didn't need to , it was a waste of foods.

 

[MMM-E]

it was the Seljuk Turks who acted as the primary shield, bearing the initial brunt of the Crusading waves and bleeding their armies dry in Anatolia when the First Crusade began in 1096 against the Turks and muslim World


btw , The Mamluk Sultanate was founded, structured, and institutionalized entirely by Turks. Circassians did not found the state. rather, they seized control of the ruling apparatus much later, more than 130 years after the empire had already been established and its greatest victories won

And Turkic origin BAIBARS KHAN inflicted the first defeat on the Mongols and halted the 7th Crusade