Syrian Civil War and The future of Syria after liberation

[_Arabia_]

People are overrating China's role here. China barely plays any role in the Muslim world. 90% of the Chinese trade with the Muslim world is with Arabs (GCC mostly but not only) and Indonesia.

Arabs and Chinese have always have cordial ties for millennia but nobody is expecting them to do anything or asking them for it.

From the viewpoint of KSA, China is just a counterbalance to the US/West. A strategic trade partner. Cordial people to people relations but it is mostly strictly business. There is no religious, ethnic, deep historical etc. element. here. The same goes for all other Muslim ethnicities out there.

Our problem with the West (British empire is gone, French empire is gone) is solely with certain US policies. Mostly tied to Israel.

Other than that (I can only speak for Arabs here), we have closer ties to Europe/West. For starters we are next door neighbors. We used to rule large areas of Europe, in some case for almost 800 years in places like Al-Andalus (Spain, Portugal) and in the process heavily influenced their language (up to 10-20% of all Spanish words are Arabic in origin - Portuguese a lot too), culture, architecture, cuisine etc. Hell, even their DNA (confirmed) by intermarrying with them.

Roughly 20 million Arabs live in Europe and this number will only grow.

There are other historical ties since Neolithic times that involves deep-rooted DNA/race (Caucasian race - no that is not limited to White/European in a historical anthropological sense - all Middle Easterners belong to this group - Chiense to the Mongoloid race instead)

Ties with China were mostly business/trade ties. They remain that to this day.

Oh, of course the West is Christian mostly, a fellow Abrahamic religion. Chinese are either atheist or Buddhists, alien ideologies to us.

Maybe the likes of Indonesia and Bangladesh feel closer to China (probably do, in particular due to geography) but that is about it.

Ironically most of us are either based in the same West or have lived there for a reason. Not China.

And I have not even mentioned the Uyghur's here and their treatment.

I get a sense from some Muslims here, that they complain about the West (while sitting and living in the same West), complain that Muslim leaders are "puppets" of the same West, yet want to replace China with the same West.

How about have faith in yourself (Muslims) or your own people (ethnic group)? Strange behavior if you ask me.

 

[Foinikas]

Its good that Syrians have reclaimed their country from a tyrant.

You wanna go live there?

 

[Unknowntruth]

It’s good that Syrians have reclaimed their country from a tyrant.

They still have to reclaim Kurdish areas and territory that’s been stolen by Israel.

 

[hyperman]

Again, this is only a rumor at this time.

Not sure about the Druze of Golan Heights, but the Druze of Northern Israel have the highest percentage of participation in the IDF, even more than the Jewish population (because the Hasidim do not take part in the military for the most part).

yeah I know, but the politics are complicated.

The Israelis play divide and conquer.

What they do is they exempt the Sunni Arabs from the mandatory IDF service, but make it compulsory for the Arab Druze to serve in the IDF and make it compulsory for the Sunni Circassians to serve in the IDF.

They play games to divide.

But the Druze in the Golan Refuse Israeli citizenship outright. And the Druze in Lebanon are Pan Arabist in politics, and are allied with Hezbollah politically inside Lebanon. the Syrian Druze are pan Arabists and Loyal to Syria. the Druze in Jordan are loyal to the Monarchy.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

You wanna go live there?

If there is peace and development in Syria, then sure I would not mind living in Syria.

 

[_Arabia_]

Asians are successful because of cultural beliefs that emphasize the strong connection between effort and achievement. Maybe there needs to be a cultural shift in the Muslim world. So that u guys don't get caught up in sectarian trap. I'm not really a fan of India but at least it's going in the right place. They still have alot of smart people. Education is key! Not wars! Latin America has gang problem but they don't fight over religious beliefs they are hard workers too. Mexico will be a top 10 economy in the world soon. At least use it as an inspiration. Look up to Mexico and Brazil and see what they do right. Ok good?

You are clueless.

There are richer areas of the Muslim world (GCC) than China itself. Most of China is developing much like much of the Muslim world. The Muslim world is not 1 monolith. There are many differences between say Somalia, Bangladesh, KSA, Tajikistan, Turkey and Indonesia in terms of development.

In fact, believe it or not, most of the Arab and Muslim world is peaceful, rapidly developing with above world level living standards.

With enormous potential, enormous amounts of resources, extremely rich history and booming demographics (unlike China).

Your views are clouded because you only hear (24/7) about the conflict zones in the Muslim world which represent a small portion of the Muslim world.

Don't worry about us and stop obsessing for no reason. Let Syrians decided for themselves. Our opinions don't matter anyway, they are the ones that will shape their future.

Syria was a rich prosperous region for millennia throughout history. You probably are completely unfamiliar with the history of the region.

This region survived the onslaught of numerous powers and have been in much, much worse situations yet always prevailed. This is peanuts in comparison.

Don't take Syrians for idiots like some ignorant trolls here who have no clues.

 

[EugeneP]

"And I have not even mentioned the Uyghur's here and their treatment."

That may make China even more reluctant to go beyond strictly Business relations with Middle East. They surely don't want any blowback like from Taliban to Pakistan.

 

[hyperman]

My only concern is the lack of foresight when taking out Bashar that it allowed Israel to take Syrian territory. Plans should have been in place to prevent that.

It was impossible, its like expecting the Devil to do the right thing. This guy LITERALLY ORDERED all SAA units manning the Golan Border to leave their posts and come to Damascus immedietly to come and defend him. Then he ran like a coward, while expecting others to die for him to keep him in power.

On top of which as you saw in the leaked documents, he was literally telling the Israelis where everything was, as a "transparency measure" to seperate his military supplies from Iranian supply depots, and he gave the Israelis all the locations of the Iranian Supply depots. All in a bid to try to preserve his own rule, over the interests of Syria.

He was trying to make a deal through the UAE to cut off Iran's link to Hezbollah in exchange for Sanctions relief and GCC investment, and a "normalization" with the West. Of course the unexpected Rebel offensive put an end to all those plans. lol

this is the type of man we were dealing with.

 

[hyperman]

You are clueless.

There are richer areas of the Muslim world (GCC) than China itself. Most of China is developing much like much of the Muslim world. The Muslim world is not 1 monolith. There are many differences between say Somalia, Bangladesh, KSA, Tajikistan, Turkey and Indonesia in terms of development.

In fact, believe it or not, most of the Arab and Muslim world is peaceful, rapidly developing with above world level living standards.

With enormous potential, enormous amounts of resources, extremely rich history and booming demographics (unlike China).

Your views are clouded because you only hear (24/7) about the conflict zones in the Muslim world which represent a small portion of the Muslim world.

Don't worry about us and stop obsessing for no reason. Let Syrians decided for themselves. Our opinions don't matter anyway, they are the ones that will shape their future.

Syria was a rich prosperous region for millennia throughout history. You probably are completely unfamiliar with the history of the region.

This region survived the onslaught of numerous powers and have been in much, much worse situations yet always prevailed. This is peanuts in comparison.

Don't take Syrians for idiots like some ignorant trolls here who have no clues.

Exactly, Most of the Muslim world is actually doing well. Indonesia, Malaysia Bangladesh, etc.

Even in Africa, the Arab/Muslim world is/was doign well compared to the rest of Sub saharan Africa.

 

[PakFactor]

They CANT keep hold of it, even under international law the Golan heights is occupied territory, and it was by agreement with Assad that they remained on it

Because Assad was isolated he was unable to utilize international law, to push Israel out and he was not interested on launching a military campaign

This is why Assad became more of a guard dog for Israel, rather him then the unknown or legitimate

It's why it's vital the process of installing a legitimate regime in Syria go ahead quickly and proxies like the kurds bought under heel immediately

Both the Arab world and Turkey have common goals so suddenly the support system has increased multi fold compared to Russia who was self serving at best and a lone Iran (who admittedly did its best)





Get the Kurds and others under control, get a government installed, then demand the Golan is returned


Lawfare against Israel is just as effective if not more then actual war

Israel has been holding on to Gaza, the West Bank and the Golan Heights for a half century despite International Law. They murder civilians, shoot children, bomb hospitals despite International Law.

There is no International Law, there is only the law of the jungle. I think what has happened in Gaza is proof of that.

Law is the will of the strongest; it will continue to be this way.

 

[_Arabia_]

"And I have not even mentioned the Uyghur's here and their treatment."

That may make China even more reluctant to go beyond strictly relations with Middle East. They surely don't want any blowback like from Taliban to Pakistan.

I don't care about internal Chinese matters, although I will always have sympathy for the Uyghur's who face persecution. Not only due to religious reasons but also because we in KSA have quite a large domesticated (naturalized) Uyghur community. Many go by names such as Al-Turkistani, Al-Kashgari and my impression and interactions with them have always been good.

It is more about this idiotic idea of China or any outside power (who naturally will only look for their own interests) becoming some kind of "guardians" of Muslims, when they clearly have challenges treating their own native Muslims well or at least as they should be treating them.

 

[_Arabia_]

Exactly, Most of the Muslim world is actually doing well. Indonesia, Malaysia Bangladesh, etc.

Even in Africa, the Arab/Muslim world is/was doign well compared to the rest of Sub saharan Africa.

The guy was talking about Latin America. Literally the GCC alone (12th largest economy worldwide) has a larger economy than every single Latin American country.

The combined Arab world has an economy only smaller than 5-6 countries worldwide and within the next 1-2 decades, only China, India and USA will have a larger combined economy.

Given the enormous demographic rise in the Arab world, enormous resources and potential, a huge prosperous economy is inevitable.

We can only destroy this ourselves and have been good at doing it so far for too long but this won't continue forever. There are few unstable hotspots remaining.

 

[Snake]

People are overrating China's role here. China barely plays any role in the Muslim world. 90% of the Chinese trade with the Muslim world is with Arabs (GCC mostly but not only) and Indonesia.

Arabs and Chinese have always have cordial ties for millennia but nobody is expecting them to do anything or asking them for it.

From the viewpoint of KSA, China is just a counterbalance to the US/West. A strategic trade partner. Cordial people to people relations but it is mostly strictly business. There is no religious, ethnic, deep historical etc. element. here. The same goes for all other Muslim ethnicities out there.

The Arab world has a very strong bias toward the west. One big factor is Arab dependence on western military hardware. If there is mutual cooperation in defence then China could play a bigger role as it would have greater interests to secure.

Right now the Arab countries (individually) are currently all heavily in favor of western approach to almost everything but government. There are many US bases in Arab countries but no Chinese bases, I doubt China would want a base but you could see why China would not really want to get involved with someone who favors their biggest threat so heavily.

Law is the will of the strongest

What does that mean? In what ways were people like Mandela, Gandhi stronger than their oppressors?

 

[Unknowntruth]

It was impossible, its like expecting the Devil to do the right thing. This guy LITERALLY ORDERED all SAA units manning the Golan Border to leave their posts and come to Damascus immedietly to come and defend him. Then he ran like a coward, while expecting others to die for him to keep him in power.

On top of which as you saw in the leaked documents, he was literally telling the Israelis where everything was, as a "transparency measure" to seperate his military supplies from Iranian supply depots, and he gave the Israelis all the locations of the Iranian Supply depots. All in a bid to try to preserve his own rule, over the interests of Syria.

He was trying to make a deal through the UAE to cut off Iran's link to Hezbollah in exchange for Sanctions relief and GCC investment, and a "normalization" with the West. Of course the unexpected Rebel offensive put an end to all those plans. lol

this is the type of man we were dealing with.

What steps are being taken to deal with new Israeli occupation of Syrian land?

 

[EugeneP]

You are clueless.

There are richer areas of the Muslim world (GCC) than China itself. Most of China is developing much like much of the Muslim world. The Muslim world is not 1 monolith. There are many differences between say Somalia, Bangladesh, KSA, Tajikistan, Turkey and Indonesia in terms of development.

In fact, believe it or not, most of the Arab and Muslim world is peaceful, rapidly developing with above world level living standards.

With enormous potential, enormous amounts of resources, extremely rich history and booming demographics (unlike China).

Your views are clouded because you only hear (24/7) about the conflict zones in the Muslim world which represent a small portion of the Muslim world.

Don't worry about us and stop obsessing for no reason. Let Syrians decided for themselves. Our opinions don't matter anyway, they are the ones that will shape their future.

Syria was a rich prosperous region for millennia throughout history. You probably are completely unfamiliar with the history of the region.

This region survived the onslaught of numerous powers and have been in much, much worse situations yet always prevailed. This is peanuts in comparison.

Don't take Syrians for idiots like some ignorant trolls here who have no clues.

From what he wrote, at least this: "Education is key!" is true. There is relatively little contribution from Islamic world to 20th Century science and technology for example. When one thinks of Arabs or Muslims, you count petroleum, some cotton textiles .... then you run out. Honestly, the only label of Muslim world I have seen on anything I have bought was on Egyptian bedspreads and some cotton clothing from Pakistan or Bangladesh etc., I have eaten some Turkish apricots and Iranian pistachios too!