HAL LCA Tejas: Updates, News & Discussions

[Nilgiri]

In my view, the issue isn't HAL, but GE. The Tejas production rate bottleneck is the GE engine supply. India can produce as many Tejas aircraft as it receives engines, but definitely no more than that. Even if India had a production line capacity of 100 jets per year, they couldn't produce more than the number of jet engines they receive. The only options are to engage GE and force them to go out of their way to supply more engines, or to develop the Tejas with an alternate engine like the RD-33, M88, or EJ200, and have the Tejas with two different engines. This can be achieved by leveraging GE's interest, perhaps by offering to purchase more engines for the next order of 97 Tejas Mk1A aircraft if they can give reliable guarantee to supply all engine as per indian timelines, or by simply developing those 97 jets with a different engine.

Yes that's what I meant by chokepoint.

The hypotheticals are 20/20 regd other powerplants (and I have long thought things go lot better if India aligned the Tejas ecosystem with the mirage one incl the powerplant "inside out" from the 80s itself), but we can now only work with the reality we have.

Anyway if GE does deliver 12 F404 this year, there is a higher likelihood of 24 deliveries the next year. So it will be interesting to see if 12 are indeed delivered this year.

 

[harpy1]

I remember that too. Became big news.

Last two decades?
That's nonsense.

It's fact buddy
Our Air chiefs are falling behind on how fast air war concepts change and how time consuming a induction and phase out of modern fighters can be ..
This idiot bafoons should have planned option one two and 3 for obselence of migs and jags in 2020
They should have known about unmanned systems ..

Why are they so slow to make decisive decisions

 

[Joe Shearer]

It's fact buddy
Our Air chiefs are falling behind on how fast air war concepts change and how time consuming a induction and phase out of modern fighters can be ..
This idiot bafoons should have planned option one two and 3 for obselence of migs and jags in 2020
They should have known about unmanned systems ..

Why are they so slow to make decisive decisions

All this is totally asynchronous. None of these fancy concepts existed twenty years ago, and most are less than a decade old. Specifically, the recent Sanghi government has chosen and got subservient air chiefs; the older ones can hardly be faulted.

Our Air chiefs are falling behind on how fast air war concepts change and how time consuming a induction and phase out of modern fighters can be ..

They knew. They told the government. The retirement rate of various types, and the resulting gaps in numbers, were conveyed promptly. The government, both UPA I and UPA II, and NDA, did nothing about it. In what way were the Air Chiefs responsible?

As far as changing concepts are concerned, twenty years ago, everybody was in the same boat.

This idiot bafoons should have planned option one two and 3 for obselence of migs and jags in 2020

The plans existed. So did the governments, especially A. K. Anthony, the single biggest disaster as Defence Minister since Krishna Menon, and the bureaucracy that reported to them.

They should have known about unmanned systems ..

Why not add flying saucers?

Why are they so slow to make decisive decisions

Maybe they made the decisions, and did not have the money or the permissions to implement them.

 

[kmc_chacko]

Over-reach, IMHO. None of those aircraft is a direct substitute for the Jaguar, that was a very specialised attack aircraft, and none of them is a suitable light-weight, low-cost fighter replacing the MiG21.

We need to keep in mind the role for which these glamorous pieces of equipment were designed and built. It wasn't for point interception at all.

Mig-21 will be eventually replaced by Tejas but In my view Rafael is only jet fits to replace Jaguar. but MoD hesitation in procuring more Rafales and after IAF went forward with fresh MRFA tender F-35, Su-57/75 are the only other jets which can replace Jaguars (Considering F-18s & Su-35s will be phased out by 2040).

but in your view which jets can replace Jaguar considering its roll?

 

[harpy1]

All this is totally asynchronous. None of these fancy concepts existed twenty years ago, and most are less than a decade old. Specifically, the recent Sanghi government has chosen and got subservient air chiefs; the older ones can hardly be faulted.

They knew. They told the government. The retirement rate of various types, and the resulting gaps in numbers, were conveyed promptly. The government, both UPA I and UPA II, and NDA, did nothing about it. In what way were the Air Chiefs responsible?

As far as changing concepts are concerned, twenty years ago, everybody was in the same boat.


The plans existed. So did the governments, especially A. K. Anthony, the single biggest disaster as Defence Minister since Krishna Menon, and the bureaucracy that reported to them.


Why not add flying saucers?

Maybe they made the decisions, and did not have the money or the permissions to implement them.

So how is that our navy can Induct carriers and nuke subs destroyers frigates all built in India yet our air force can't .

You mentioned money....we have the fifth largest gdp and whopping 80 billion dollar defense budget I heard some capex is returned unspent each year ...that's criminal

How did Pakistan on 10% of our resource get to ten AWACS and we have five
Why did they outgun us in swift resort and have better Comms jamming then us
For me it's incompetent management at highest level or blame those bafoons backward air marshalls . consistently

 

[Joe Shearer]

So how is that our navy can Induct carriers and nuke subs destroyers frigates all built in India yet our air force can't .

Because the Navy compromised on the carriers;
because the Navy took more than twenty years to get a grip on nuclear submarine construction - it wasn't a flash decision, and a nuclear submarine is rather different in complexity from even the most advanced aircraft;
because destroyer and frigate construction is difficult to mess up.

 

[harpy1]

Because the Navy compromised on the carriers;
because the Navy took more than twenty years to get a grip on nuclear submarine construction - it wasn't a flash decision, and a nuclear submarine is rather different in complexity from even the most advanced aircraft;
because destroyer and frigate construction is difficult to mess up.

I see you missed the point on swift resort and awacs
Face it pak chiefs are step ahead all the time on fraction resources they are more decisive

 

[Joe Shearer]

You mentioned money....we have the fifth largest gdp and shopping 80 billion dollar defense budget I heard some capex is returned unspent each year ...that's criminal

Look up the split between capital expenditure and revenue expenditure.
Not all capex can be spent within a year; the fault lies in the accounting system that ties expenditure to something irredeemably silly like a financial year, rather than taking into account the life of a system and the time needed to examine it.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I see you missed the point on swift resort and awacs
Face it pak chiefs are step ahead all the time on fraction resources they are more decisive

What point was that?
I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Joe Shearer]

but in your view which jets can replace Jaguar considering its roll?

Only the F/A18, because people are now more and more focussed on multi-role/swing role aircraft. Both the SU30 and Rafale have been positioned as such aircraft. There is nothing exactly like the very focussed Jaguar in modern times.

 

[kmc_chacko]

Only the F/A18, because people are now more and more focussed on multi-role/swing role aircraft. Both the SU30 and Rafale have been positioned as such aircraft. There is nothing exactly like the very focussed Jaguar in modern times.

but USN plans to F/A-18 by 2040, unless we can move production line to India F-18 doesn't have long life.

regarding Rafale I would have loved to have 200+ Jets replacing Mig-29s, Mirage & Jaguars with hard bargain for IN we could have brought a production line to India, and produced locally.

By the By, by 2040 we will have to plan for retiring 270+ Su-30s are we going to join FCAS or focus on more AMCA ?

 

[harpy1]

FCAS is cloud system with loads of unmanned systems in tow with manned fighter.
Which means 500 million each

I doubt we can afford this or learn how to implement it in war

 

[Joe Shearer]

but USN plans to F/A-18 by 2040, unless we can move production line to India F-18 doesn't have long life.

Your question was, "Which jet can replace Jaguar considering its roll (sic)?"
I answered that question.

regarding Rafale I would have loved to have 200+ Jets replacing Mig-29s, Mirage & Jaguars with hard bargain for IN we could have brought a production line to India, and produced locally.

Who told you that?

By the By, by 2040 we will have to plan for retiring 270+ Su-30s are we going to join FCAS or focus on more AMCA ?

LOL.

Anybody's guess.

 

[DDG-80]

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[DDG-80]

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