Why Secularism will Worsen Pakistan’s security situation

Some saying Pakistan needs Islam. Which Islam? The Wahhabi Islam? The Deobandi Islam? The Al-Hadees Islam? The Bralve Islam? The Twelver Shia Islam? The Fiver Shia Islam? Ismailia? One of the various Sufi sects?

I can tell you right now, with how divided Pakistan is along sect lines, any group's interpretations being imposed will cause the others to fight back.

You have no idea what you're asking.

Also, secularism doesn't mean the absence of religion, or atheism. It's less French secularism thats being proposed, and more Canadian secularism Pakistan needs, where religious beliefs are respected and even celebrated, instead of being shunned and hidden away.

Pakistan is one of the few countries in the world that, while having a mandatory muslim identity, cannot choose to play favorites, thus a custom form of secularism is needed.
No problem with celebrating your religious beliefs as long as you don't impose them on others .....you don't need to make your Muslim identity mandatory , your Muslim identity is a reality that you can't get rid off even if you want to ...... anyway , I agree with most of your post .
 
No problem with celebrating your religious beliefs as long as you don't impose them on others .....you don't need to make your Muslim identity mandatory , your Muslim identity is a reality that you can't get rid off even if you want to ...... anyway , I agree with most of your post .
With ALL his post, actually.
It is amazing to find people afflicted with a social distortion thinking that the way out is more of the same.
Religion and religious belief is fine in personal life, dragging it into governance is a fatal error.
 
Even more disconcerting is the way some posts glorify the distancing that has occurred between their host societies and themselves.
It seems that locking up an entire community into a ghetto is a great achievement. That is what led to the exclusive, finally racist Outlook of Ashkenazi Jews and Boers in South Africa.
And that is supposed to lead to a morally superior way of life, and neutralise the contempt and hatred that such behaviour provokes, among precisely those whose opinions count, when deciding how to respond to strife elsewhere, and the urgent need to accommodate vulnerable individuals from those spots?
 
Some saying Pakistan needs Islam. Which Islam? The Wahhabi Islam? The Deobandi Islam? The Al-Hadees Islam? The Bralve Islam? The Twelver Shia Islam? The Fiver Shia Islam? Ismailia? One of the various Sufi sects?

I had replied to whole and as almost always... I had to rewrite and this part was left out... and I don't want to start over

Anyhow, Yours is exactly the other end of the purist... secular spectrum.

Which?
The answer is NONE!

Sects by their nature are transient, derived ideologies. The state owns or upholds none such. Islam is very clear and it's methodology clear. It does not necessitate a sectarian underpinning except for the sectarians themselves.
 
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What is actually secular ? Sunni Islam always put political leader as leader, unlike Shiah Iranian where religious leader (Ayatollah Khameini) become the Supreme leader
 
This secular vs mazhabi vs sectarian bullshit was never here in the subcontinent until the 1970's and 80's......

If anyone can't see that its a CIA/ Al-Yahuda political import into our region.......that mofo should just commit suicide!

Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Yemen, Afghanistan, Sudan, Somalia, Eritria and Libya.......completely destroyed by the Zionists.
 
I agree with your comments. A drastic change in a country's values will inevitably lead to disruption or even collapse of the social order.

In 1979 the Chinese government announced that it was abandoning fundamentalist communism and taking a new path that was half-capitalist and half-socialist. This behavior caused the collapse of values and beliefs of Chinese people throughout the era. Social security rapidly deteriorated, crimes became more and more frequent, and people's morals rapidly degenerated. Throughout the 1980s and 1990s, China sank into misery. It was not until twenty years later, when the new generation became the backbone of our society, that these conditions were completely resolved.

Major values reforms may not necessarily have major gains, but they are bound to have majo
Even more disconcerting is the way some posts glorify the distancing that has occurred between their host societies and themselves.
It seems that locking up an entire community into a ghetto is a great achievement. That is what led to the exclusive, finally racist Outlook of Ashkenazi Jews and Boers in South Africa.
And that is supposed to lead to a morally superior way of life, and neutralise the contempt and hatred that such behaviour provokes, among precisely those whose opinions count, when deciding how to respond to strife elsewhere, and the urgent need to accommodate vulnerable individuals from those spots?
Problems arise when you think your philosophy , religion and way of life is sacrosanct so can't be negotiated or criticized .....rest everything is worth screwing .
 
Some saying Pakistan needs Islam. Which Islam? The Wahhabi Islam? The Deobandi Islam? The Al-Hadees Islam? The Bralve Islam? The Twelver Shia Islam? The Fiver Shia Islam? Ismailia? One of the various Sufi sects?

I can tell you right now, with how divided Pakistan is along sect lines, any group's interpretations being imposed will cause the others to fight back.

You have no idea what you're asking.

Also, secularism doesn't mean the absence of religion, or atheism. It's less French secularism thats being proposed, and more Canadian secularism Pakistan needs, where religious beliefs are respected and even celebrated, instead of being shunned and hidden away.

Pakistan is one of the few countries in the world that, while having a mandatory muslim identity, cannot choose to play favorites, thus a custom form of secularism is needed.
As a Corollary to your point, it is only then can the Pakistani state can end its abuse of faith(s), freeing the religion to return to its natural equilibrium in society, and the state can refocus on the fundamentals of good governance, especially developing the marginalized areas (of the country and of society) to the standard of the majority of the country, in hopes of making a dent in the alienation of frankly the majority of the population. If allusions are made to religion, they should be to humble the politicians and populace to not transgress ethical boundaries or remind each other of our common humanity and necessity to be meritocratic, giving our consent to be governed in order to ensure the greater good. In the west, references to religion has been framed, since the enlightenment as “Providence” and in the east as the “Mandate of Heaven”. Not explicitly religious as both had periods of wars of religion, especially in Europe with the various sects, but as I have always believed, Pakistan too can go through its own enlightenment period, without losing its respect and reverence for the faith. It just needs to end its abuse of faith, especially as a way to divert from good governance. I assume this was the hope Jinnah had when assumed the leadership of the Muslim League, and brought Pakistan across the finish line to its independence; the hope it would live up to its potential, in the physical and metaphysical.
 
Sectarian happened because lack of Islam knowledge

Nothing wrong with Islam, you go see Donald Trump inaguration there you know USA is basically Christian country

Quran: Al Kafirun

  1. Say: O disbelievers,
  2. I do not worship what you worship.
  3. Nor are you worshippers of what I worship.
  4. Nor will I be a worshipper of what you worship.
  5. Nor will you be worshippers of what I worship.
  6. For you is your religion, and for me is my religion.
Quran: Al Baqarah verse 256

Let there be no compulsion in religion, for the truth stands out clearly from falsehood.1 So whoever renounces false gods and believes in Allah has certainly grasped the firmest, unfailing hand-hold. And Allah is All-Hearing, All-Knowing.

 
What makes Western countries successful ?

It is already there in Islam since its birth, be it democracy like when Abu Bakar is elected after Prophet Muhammad passed away and also the harmony of people with different religion united under one Madinah state nasionalism

 
If anyone can't see that its a CIA/ Al-Yahuda political import into our region.......that mofo should just commit suicide!
Totally disagree.
When I get to a proper key board tomorrow evening, I will try to explain why.
 
As a Corollary to your point, it is only then can the Pakistani state can end its abuse of faith(s), freeing the religion to return to its natural equilibrium in society, and the state can refocus on the fundamentals of good governance, especially developing the marginalized areas (of the country and of society) to the standard of the majority of the country, in hopes of making a dent in the alienation of frankly the majority of the population. If allusions are made to religion, they should be to humble the politicians and populace to not transgress ethical boundaries or remind each other of our common humanity and necessity to be meritocratic, giving our consent to be governed in order to ensure the greater good. In the west, references to religion has been framed, since the enlightenment as “Providence” and in the east as the “Mandate of Heaven”. Not explicitly religious as both had periods of wars of religion, especially in Europe with the various sects, but as I have always believed, Pakistan too can go through its own enlightenment period, without losing its respect and reverence for the faith. It just needs to end its abuse of faith, especially as a way to divert from good governance. I assume this was the hope Jinnah had when assumed the leadership of the Muslim League, and brought Pakistan across the finish line to its independence; the hope it would live up to its potential, in the physical and metaphysical.
Very difficult to add to this post, or that annoying post by @That_Guy.
Those, and partly what has been posted by @mythbuster and @Indos, really cover most of the topic 😒
 
Totally disagree.
When I get to a proper key board tomorrow evening, I will try to explain why.
oh bhai, we weren't even religious until the dawn of Al-CIA and Al-Qaeda.

Nobody gave a fukk about whether yous sunni or shia or barelvi or hannafi.

All this commercialization of religion is a western/ zionist enterprise.

Religion in Pakistan is now an industry, just like in da west......

Before the 1980's it was never like this.
 
oh bhai, we weren't even religious until the dawn of Al-CIA and Al-Qaeda.

Nobody gave a fukk about whether yous sunni or shia or barelvi or hannafi.

All this commercialization of religion is a western/ zionist enterprise.

Religion in Pakistan is now an industry, just like in da west......

Before the 1980's it was never like this.
27th afternoon/ evening.
 
Their are lot of modern moderate Muslim states which you guys can emulate

Turkey, Malaysia, Indonesia

Even UAE is more moderate than parts of Pakistan outside of Karachi, Islamabad, Lahore.

Baloch problem can be solved once baloch people get full access to the wealth generated by their provinces natural resources
Instead of the money going to the Chinese and PA
 

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